From kgottschalk at uwc.ac.za Sat Oct 1 09:55:30 2011 From: kgottschalk at uwc.ac.za (Keith Gottschalk) Date: Sat, 01 Oct 2011 15:55:30 +0200 Subject: [FPSPACE] all systems go for IAC2011 Message-ID: <4E8737F2020000A60001324D@uwc.ac.za> It's now two years & four months since I sat in an astronomer's office & he asked: should we - & can we - submit a bid to host the first International Astronautical Congress in Africa in its six decades? I urged Peter Martinez to say yes (his doctorate is on asteroseismology so we knew he could make waves :) Then, since South Africa had only one member of the IAF, I had to beg my own University of the Western Cape to join, when we don't even have an engineering faculty [US: school / college]. We South Africans thought it wise to appoint in addition to the normal Local Organizing Committee a Preparatory Committee to deal with broader issues, on which I served. The easiest part was proving to the IAF exco that Cape Town's International Convention Centre could accommodate the anticipated 1600 delegates. We are a long haul destination, which would make some drop out due to airfare cost. Numbers would also be lower because our entire South African space industry, broadly defined, numbers about 200 professionals, which is less than one factory of SpaceX, Boeing, or Lockmart. By happy coincidence, the 2010 FIFA soccer cup hype preempted the anxiety queries about mugging & other crime which we anticipated because of the western press sensationalism on this. The CTICC & the neighbouring central business precinct & waterfront has the South African record for saturation coverage from over one hundred spy TV cameras & a supplementary business-funded police service. For any FPSPACErs flying in, Cape Town is the San Francisco of Africa, & it's now the southern spring. Think of 'Frisco in April, & you'll know what clothes to bring. All our chlorinated tap water is safe to drink, so don't spend 1000 times the price per litre on the latest silly fad of buying bottled water. Our biggest disappointment was being unable to arrange any good deal for the artists & cultural persons who'd like to exhibit. The IAC prices are stiff, aimed at a largely corporate engineer delegate, & so more than double the conference registration cost of a typical international academic conference. We negotiated half prices for African delegates, but even so there are under 200 delegates from Africa. The same costs per sq. metre apply to exhibitors, aimed at corporate exhibitors, which wipes out artists who are at best on university salaries. & at worst are self employed & self-underemployed. So we tried to negotiate an off-site venue for the artists, to help those who could not afford the $700 - 1000 registration. But alas the answer we got from some of the artists was that "exhibiting at a gala dinner is outdated. We want to provoke debate". So I could in the end only advise ITTACUS & other artists to maybe team up with the Association of Astronomical Artists & try to negotiate directly with the IAF exco that in future years, as they have a "Student Zone" they should also have an "Artists' zone", & extend student prices to artists. Anyone coming is more than welcome to contact me through my email address. As my high school maths marks make clear, my own two papers will be presented at symposium E4.4 on African & South African space history. Though with my RLV interests, I will also attend the sessions on hypersonic & combined cycle propulsion, & on future space transport systems where the Skylon rep will present. On Monday 3rd @ 20h00 I will, as part of our fringe programme, give a space poems & slide show off-site at a pub-restaurant called a "Touch of Madness" in Trill Rd., Observatory. hoping to meet some of you, Keith. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- All Email originating from UWC is covered by disclaimer http://www.uwc.ac.za/emaildisclaimer From pjp961 at svol.net Sat Oct 1 15:35:34 2011 From: pjp961 at svol.net (Peter Pesavento) Date: Sat, 1 Oct 2011 15:35:34 -0400 Subject: [FPSPACE] Presidential Contender (USA) Michelle Bachmann claims PRC has blinded US satellites with ground lasers Message-ID: <4e876bae.0515640a.3bb3.2cc2@mx.google.com> I am only supplying this to fpspace because it is a news story, and not to the accuracy of the claims. Michelle Bachmann is well known for making inaccurate claims while on the campaign trail.but it gets her press copy... http://news.yahoo.com/bachmann-china-blinded-united-states-satellites-214426 298.html Daily Caller via yahoo Bachmann: 'China has blinded United States satellites' The Daily Caller - 21 hrs ago Minnesota Rep. and presidential candidate Michele Bachmann talked foreign policy Friday during an interview on the Laura Ingraham Show. Specifically, she zeroed in on China, saying the country has attacked American satellites with lasers. "I'm not sharing something I shouldn't," said Bachmann, "but China has blinded United States' satellites with their lasers. They've also supplied arms to the Taliban, and they've helped North Korea deliver missiles to Iran and Pakistan . And they've assisted Iran with their nuclear program." But Bachmann didn't stop there. She doubled down on her criticisms by saying that China has also been engaged in industrial espionage against the West. "Just keep these things in mind when it comes to China - they are a very bad actor," she concluded. She prefaced her comments by reminding listeners that she's currently a member of the House Intelligence Committee and thus has access to "classified secrets." The congresswoman's comments are the second time this week she sought to highlight her foreign policy views. On Thursday, she commented on the recent uprisings in the Middle East, positing that the overthrow of dictators could pose a threat to Israel. Then, she said that President Barack Obama is to blame for the Arab Spring. "You want to know why we have [the] Arab Spring?" Bachmann asked. "Barack Obama has laid the table for the Arab Spring by demonstrating weakness from the United States of America." -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From jbcharle at gmail.com Sat Oct 1 18:13:54 2011 From: jbcharle at gmail.com (John) Date: Sat, 1 Oct 2011 17:13:54 -0500 Subject: [FPSPACE] all systems go for IAC2011 In-Reply-To: <4E8737F2020000A60001324D@uwc.ac.za> References: <4E8737F2020000A60001324D@uwc.ac.za> Message-ID: <9810CA74-9B9B-459C-AB19-091B31536BF6@gmail.com> Keith, I had hoped to attend IAC but only managed to secure the #3 backup slot on the approved list of NASA-funded travelers. My wife is even more disappointed: this destination is on her bucket list. Oh well, best wishes for great success! John Charles Houston, Texas On Oct 1, 2011, at 8:55, "Keith Gottschalk" wrote: > It's now two years & four months since I sat in an astronomer's office & he asked: should we - & can we - submit a bid to host the first International Astronautical Congress in Africa in its six decades? > > I urged Peter Martinez to say yes (his doctorate is on asteroseismology so we knew he could make waves :) Then, since South Africa had only one member of the IAF, I had to beg my own University of the Western Cape to join, when we don't even have an engineering faculty [US: school / college]. We South Africans thought it wise to appoint in addition to the normal Local Organizing Committee a Preparatory Committee to deal with broader issues, on which I served. > > The easiest part was proving to the IAF exco that Cape Town's International Convention Centre could accommodate the anticipated 1600 delegates. We are a long haul destination, which would make some drop out due to airfare cost. Numbers would also be lower because our entire South African space industry, broadly defined, numbers about 200 professionals, which is less than one factory of SpaceX, Boeing, or Lockmart. By happy coincidence, the 2010 FIFA soccer cup hype preempted the anxiety queries about mugging & other crime which we anticipated because of the western press sensationalism on this. The CTICC & the neighbouring central business precinct & waterfront has the South African record for saturation coverage from over one hundred spy TV cameras & a supplementary business-funded police service. > > For any FPSPACErs flying in, Cape Town is the San Francisco of Africa, & it's now the southern spring. Think of 'Frisco in April, & you'll know what clothes to bring. All our chlorinated tap water is safe to drink, so don't spend 1000 times the price per litre on the latest silly fad of buying bottled water. > > Our biggest disappointment was being unable to arrange any good deal for the artists & cultural persons who'd like to exhibit. The IAC prices are stiff, aimed at a largely corporate engineer delegate, & so more than double the conference registration cost of a typical international academic conference. We negotiated half prices for African delegates, but even so there are under 200 delegates from Africa. The same costs per sq. metre apply to exhibitors, aimed at corporate exhibitors, which wipes out artists who are at best on university salaries. & at worst are self employed & self-underemployed. So we tried to negotiate an off-site venue for the artists, to help those who could not afford the $700 - 1000 registration. But alas the answer we got from some of the artists was that "exhibiting at a gala dinner is outdated. We want to provoke debate". So I could in the end only advise ITTACUS & other artists to maybe team up with the Association of Astronomical Artists & try to negotiate directly with the IAF exco that in future years, as they have a "Student Zone" they should also have an "Artists' zone", & extend student prices to artists. > > Anyone coming is more than welcome to contact me through my email address. As my high school maths marks make clear, my own two papers will be presented at symposium E4.4 on African & South African space history. Though with my RLV interests, I will also attend the sessions on hypersonic & combined cycle propulsion, & on future space transport systems where the Skylon rep will present. On Monday 3rd @ 20h00 I will, as part of our fringe programme, give a space poems & slide show off-site at a pub-restaurant called a "Touch of Madness" in Trill Rd., Observatory. > > hoping to meet some of you, > Keith. > All Email originating from UWC is covered by disclaimer http://www.uwc.ac.za/emaildisclaimer > _______________________________________________ > FPSPACE mailing list > FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org > http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From phillipclark at btinternet.com Sun Oct 2 03:16:48 2011 From: phillipclark at btinternet.com (Phillip Clark) Date: Sun, 2 Oct 2011 08:16:48 +0100 Subject: [FPSPACE] Presidential Contender (USA) Michelle Bachmann claims PRChas blinded US satellites with ground lasers In-Reply-To: <4e876bae.0515640a.3bb3.2cc2@mx.google.com> References: <4e876bae.0515640a.3bb3.2cc2@mx.google.com> Message-ID: <6831965F2A154A21895039CB6FF8C104@WINDOWSPGK1XFS> Ah, this is just like the Cold War all over again, when the US Right Wing would scream about the Soviets using weapons that we now know never existed. I just hope that such rhetoric is not taken seriously without a little thing called proof. Phillip Clark ----- Original Message ----- From: Peter Pesavento To: fpspace at friends-partners.org Sent: Saturday, October 01, 2011 8:35 PM Subject: [FPSPACE] Presidential Contender (USA) Michelle Bachmann claims PRChas blinded US satellites with ground lasers I am only supplying this to fpspace because it is a news story, and not to the accuracy of the claims. Michelle Bachmann is well known for making inaccurate claims while on the campaign trail.but it gets her press copy... http://news.yahoo.com/bachmann-china-blinded-united-states-satellites-214426298.html Daily Caller via yahoo Bachmann: 'China has blinded United States satellites' The Daily Caller - 21 hrs ago Minnesota Rep. and presidential candidate Michele Bachmann talked foreign policy Friday during an interview on the Laura Ingraham Show. Specifically, she zeroed in on China, saying the country has attacked American satellites with lasers. "I'm not sharing something I shouldn't," said Bachmann, "but China has blinded United States' satellites with their lasers. They've also supplied arms to the Taliban, and they've helped North Korea deliver missiles to Iran and Pakistan . And they've assisted Iran with their nuclear program." But Bachmann didn't stop there. She doubled down on her criticisms by saying that China has also been engaged in industrial espionage against the West. "Just keep these things in mind when it comes to China - they are a very bad actor," she concluded. She prefaced her comments by reminding listeners that she's currently a member of the House Intelligence Committee and thus has access to "classified secrets." The congresswoman's comments are the second time this week she sought to highlight her foreign policy views. On Thursday, she commented on the recent uprisings in the Middle East, positing that the overthrow of dictators could pose a threat to Israel. Then, she said that President Barack Obama is to blame for the Arab Spring. "You want to know why we have [the] Arab Spring?" Bachmann asked. "Barack Obama has laid the table for the Arab Spring by demonstrating weakness from the United States of America." ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ _______________________________________________ FPSPACE mailing list FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From cpvick at globalsecurity.org Sun Oct 2 11:01:51 2011 From: cpvick at globalsecurity.org (Charles Vick) Date: Sun, 2 Oct 2011 11:01:51 -0400 Subject: [FPSPACE] Presidential Contender (USA) Michelle Bachmann claims PRChas blinded US satellites with ground lasers In-Reply-To: <6831965F2A154A21895039CB6FF8C104@WINDOWSPGK1XFS> References: <4e876bae.0515640a.3bb3.2cc2@mx.google.com> <6831965F2A154A21895039CB6FF8C104@WINDOWSPGK1XFS> Message-ID: <001201cc8114$37b157c0$a7140740$@globalsecurity.org> Yes - More US excuse for Politicians want a bee's rabble-rousers propagandas believing their own lies. Has this country become so elitist politically partisan charged greed out of control political padding that the citizenry have to contemplate the unthinkable against its own government and its agencies to restore many aspects of governance enforcement of policy & fiscal responsibility for the present generation and especially our future generation's relevance? Unfortunately today the obvious is all too apparent. Never mind muddling along fading away From: fpspace-bounces at www.friends-partners.org [mailto:fpspace-bounces at www.friends-partners.org] On Behalf Of Phillip Clark Sent: Sunday, October 02, 2011 3:17 AM To: fpspace at friends-partners.org Subject: Re: [FPSPACE] Presidential Contender (USA) Michelle Bachmann claims PRChas blinded US satellites with ground lasers Ah, this is just like the Cold War all over again, when the US Right Wing would scream about the Soviets using weapons that we now know never existed. I just hope that such rhetoric is not taken seriously without a little thing called proof. Phillip Clark ----- Original Message ----- From: Peter Pesavento To: fpspace at friends-partners.org Sent: Saturday, October 01, 2011 8:35 PM Subject: [FPSPACE] Presidential Contender (USA) Michelle Bachmann claims PRChas blinded US satellites with ground lasers I am only supplying this to fpspace because it is a news story, and not to the accuracy of the claims. Michelle Bachmann is well known for making inaccurate claims while on the campaign trail.but it gets her press copy... http://news.yahoo.com/bachmann-china-blinded-united-states-satellites-214426 298.html Daily Caller via yahoo Bachmann: 'China has blinded United States satellites' The Daily Caller - 21 hrs ago Minnesota Rep. and presidential candidate Michele Bachmann talked foreign policy Friday during an interview on the Laura Ingraham Show. Specifically, she zeroed in on China, saying the country has attacked American satellites with lasers. "I'm not sharing something I shouldn't," said Bachmann, "but China has blinded United States' satellites with their lasers. They've also supplied arms to the Taliban, and they've helped North Korea deliver missiles to Iran and Pakistan . And they've assisted Iran with their nuclear program." But Bachmann didn't stop there. She doubled down on her criticisms by saying that China has also been engaged in industrial espionage against the West. "Just keep these things in mind when it comes to China - they are a very bad actor," she concluded. She prefaced her comments by reminding listeners that she's currently a member of the House Intelligence Committee and thus has access to "classified secrets." The congresswoman's comments are the second time this week she sought to highlight her foreign policy views. On Thursday, she commented on the recent uprisings in the Middle East, positing that the overthrow of dictators could pose a threat to Israel. Then, she said that President Barack Obama is to blame for the Arab Spring. "You want to know why we have [the] Arab Spring?" Bachmann asked. "Barack Obama has laid the table for the Arab Spring by demonstrating weakness from the United States of America." _____ _______________________________________________ FPSPACE mailing list FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From dokter.nuyens at telenet.be Sun Oct 2 12:44:58 2011 From: dokter.nuyens at telenet.be (Zeger Nuyens) Date: Sun, 02 Oct 2011 18:44:58 +0200 Subject: [FPSPACE] Presidential Contender (USA) Michelle Bachmann claims PRChas blinded US satellites with ground lasers Message-ID: <4E88950A.8070508@telenet.be> Really, no connection at all with Sarah Palin? Zeger Nuyens > Ah, this is just like the Cold War all over again, when the US Right Wing would scream about the Soviets using weapons that we now know never existed. > > I just hope that such rhetoric is not taken seriously without a little thing called proof. > > Phillip Clark From jameseoberg at comcast.net Sun Oct 2 16:55:14 2011 From: jameseoberg at comcast.net (James E Oberg) Date: Sun, 2 Oct 2011 15:55:14 -0500 Subject: [FPSPACE] Presidential Contender (USA) Michelle Bachmann claimsPRChas blinded US satellites with ground lasers References: <4e876bae.0515640a.3bb3.2cc2@mx.google.com> <6831965F2A154A21895039CB6FF8C104@WINDOWSPGK1XFS> Message-ID: <565D5C76F1FF497DACC3460DE5B10359@ownerfbf08f40c> "Ah, this is just like the Cold War all over again, when the US Right Wing would scream about the Soviets using weapons that we now know never existed.' Yes, I well remember at the height of the Cold War that particularly vicious presidential campaign when the incumbant president was accused of being soft on communism and of allowing the USSR to amass a terrifying lead in ICBMs for nuclear attack on the US. The country needed a much tougher policy against the USSR and a crash program to eliminate this 'missile gap'. Richard Nixon was involved in this campaign, I recall. Awful distortions were thrown against the incumbants and the 'Missile Gap' screamers did eventually eke out a narrow victory, alas. ----- Original Message ----- From: Phillip Clark To: fpspace at friends-partners.org Sent: Sunday, October 02, 2011 2:16 AM Subject: Re: [FPSPACE] Presidential Contender (USA) Michelle Bachmann claimsPRChas blinded US satellites with ground lasers Ah, this is just like the Cold War all over again, when the US Right Wing would scream about the Soviets using weapons that we now know never existed. Phillip Clark ----- -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From dsfportree at hotmail.com Sun Oct 2 18:56:41 2011 From: dsfportree at hotmail.com (David Portree) Date: Sun, 2 Oct 2011 16:56:41 -0600 Subject: [FPSPACE] Wenchang and typhoons In-Reply-To: <1317386383.10611.YahooMailClassic@web80204.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <1317386383.10611.YahooMailClassic@web80204.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: I think this said "Wenching" at first. Imagine my disappointment. David S. F. Portree dsfportree at hotmail.com dportree at usgs.gov http://beyondapollo.blogspot.com/ http://astrogeology.usgs.gov/About/People/DavidPortree/ > Date: Fri, 30 Sep 2011 05:39:43 -0700 > From: thomsona at flash.net > To: fpspace at friends-partners.org > Subject: [FPSPACE] Wenchang and typhoons > > > Hopefully the new spaceport and theme park are going to be sturdily designed; the launch pads seem to be close to shore. OTOH, the situation is not unlike KSC, which has gotten along with similar weather circumstances. > > http://blogs.voanews.com/breaking-news/2011/09/29/deadly-typhoon-strikes-southern-chinese-island/ > > "Typhoon Nesat struck the southern Chinese island of Hainan Thursday afternoon, after pounding Hong Kong with heavy winds and rains earlier in the day. > > "Forecasters say the storm hit Wenchang city with sustained winds up to 150 kilometers an hour, making it the strongest typhoon to hit China this year. Xinhua news agency said almost 58,000 people were evacuated from low-lying areas ahead of Hainan's arrival." > > _______________________________________________ > FPSPACE mailing list > FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org > http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From pjp961 at svol.net Mon Oct 3 17:32:58 2011 From: pjp961 at svol.net (Peter Pesavento) Date: Mon, 3 Oct 2011 17:32:58 -0400 Subject: [FPSPACE] On Russia's missiles...Last three Typhoon class submarines and their armaments to be scrapped Message-ID: <4e8a2a15.6617ec0a.73b2.148e@mx.google.com> http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/europe/russia/8796904/Red-October- no-more-Russia-scraps-Cold-War-era-Typhoon-submarine.html >From the UK Telegraph (along with illustration graphic at the URL link above). -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From ljk4 at msn.com Tue Oct 4 07:40:42 2011 From: ljk4 at msn.com (LARRY KLAES) Date: Tue, 4 Oct 2011 07:40:42 -0400 Subject: [FPSPACE] So, did the Apollo astronauts take the Lunar Rover for a real joy ride? Message-ID: Harrison Schmitt once said they did: http://www.strangehistory.net/2011/10/03/joy-riding-on-the-moon/ -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From jbcharle at gmail.com Tue Oct 4 11:35:37 2011 From: jbcharle at gmail.com (John) Date: Tue, 4 Oct 2011 10:35:37 -0500 Subject: [FPSPACE] So, did the Apollo astronauts take the Lunar Rover for a real joy ride? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Larry, Not saying it didn't happen. But Apollo EVA times and progress were tightly controlled and monitored in real time with continuous downlink. On Apollo 16 John Young did an authorized off-road test of the LRV which was filmed by Charlie Duke. Al Shepard's golf swings were on live TV. Closest thing I recall hearing about an off-the-record activity during a surface EVA was when Conrad and Bean were vigorously digging through their sample bag on Apollo 12 looking for the camera timer while they claimed to be resting. (Hence their extremely dirty suits.) Plus who measured their height and distance? Maybe new LRO images can find LRV tracks with a 100-meter gap? That would confirm and identify the time, place and driver. This sounds like one of those stories so good that if it isn't true, it should be. JBC Sent from my iPhone. Please forgive typos. On Oct 4, 2011, at 6:41, "LARRY KLAES" wrote: > Harrison Schmitt once said they did: > > http://www.strangehistory.net/2011/10/03/joy-riding-on-the-moon/ > _______________________________________________ > FPSPACE mailing list > FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org > http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From davidlrickman at aol.com Thu Oct 6 20:54:42 2011 From: davidlrickman at aol.com (David L. Rickman) Date: Thu, 6 Oct 2011 20:54:42 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [FPSPACE] Lunniy Korabl Cabin/Krechet-94 Flight Simulation Message-ID: <8CE52A2D558C0A3-10BC-304A9@webmail-m097.sysops.aol.com> FPSpacers, Here is a link to a video still I would like to place: http://farm7.static.flickr.com/6106/6218749360_3614a3833d_z.jpg It appears to be a test of the Krechet-94 functionality/or Lunar cosmonaut Training, possibly taking place during a parabolic dive simulating lunar gravity. Note that the person behind the cosmonaut is wearing a strap from left shoulder to right waist, possibly to keep him in a position to help steady the cosmonaut during the ascents. Note also that the Lunar Cabin appears to be in the final configuration, with the spherical water reclamation tank to the left of the cosmonauts shoulder, and the interior light source (not the light source used for this filming) just above that. My questions are: What aircraft, what time-frame, and how long would a lunar weight parabolic dive last compared to a Zero-G test? As always, any help answering any of these questions would be greatly appreciated! Best Regards, David L. Rickman 549 Caribou Road Asheville, NC 28803 USA Follow my progress as I recreate the Soviet Lunniy Korabl spaceship in 1:5 scale at http://lunniykorabl.blogspot.com -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From jameseoberg at comcast.net Fri Oct 7 07:42:17 2011 From: jameseoberg at comcast.net (James E Oberg) Date: Fri, 7 Oct 2011 06:42:17 -0500 Subject: [FPSPACE] Roskosmos decides to abandon development of Rus-M booster Message-ID: <9C18AFE020C64413AAD1530B4BC076FE@ownerfbf08f40c> http://en.rian.ru/russia/20111007/167466227.html http://www.itar-tass.com/en/c154/242211.html Roskosmos decides to abandon development of Rus-M booster MOSCOW, October 7 (Itar-Tass) - The Federal Space Agency (Roskosmos) decided to abandon the development of a promising booster Rus-M, Roskosmos chief Vladimir Popovkin said at a question-and-answer governmental session in the State Duma on Friday. "We do not need a new rocket, we will use those that we have," he said. Popovkin elaborated that more than 37% of Roskosmos budget was allocated to develop a launch vehicle by 2015, however, these funds are very small, "so, the launch of a new booster in 2015 is not in question." -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From pjp961 at svol.net Fri Oct 7 08:17:31 2011 From: pjp961 at svol.net (Peter Pesavento) Date: Fri, 7 Oct 2011 08:17:31 -0400 Subject: [FPSPACE] No flaws found in rocket engine batch production that included Progress launch failure Message-ID: <4e8eee37.4b13e70a.0c8f.730f@mx.google.com> Associated Press via Yahoo http://news.yahoo.com/russian-space-chief-no-flaws-found-rockets-111436885.h tml Russian space chief: no flaws found in rockets AP - 57 mins ago MOSCOW (AP) - Russia's space chief says that an inspection has found no flaws in a batch of rocket engines similar to the one that has caused a crash of an unmanned cargo ship and raised doubts about future missions to the International Space Station. With NASA's space shuttles retired as of July, Russia's Soyuz rocket is the only means of getting astronauts to and from the space station. The Soyuz that failed in August is similar to the ones used to launch astronauts. The crash was blamed on an "accidental" manufacturing flaw. Russian Space Agency head Vladimir Popovkin said Friday that a check of rocket engines of the same batch has found no faults. The next Soyuz launches have been postponed pending the outcome of the probe. Popovkin said a cargo ship will be launched on Oct. 30 and a manned mission will follow on Nov. 14. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From ljk4 at msn.com Fri Oct 7 09:29:39 2011 From: ljk4 at msn.com (LARRY KLAES ) Date: Fri, 7 Oct 2011 13:29:39 +0000 Subject: [FPSPACE] Fwd: EPSC-DPS: Map of Moon Reveals Titanium Treasure Troves Message-ID: ---------- Sent from AT&T Wireless using Windows Live Hotmail -----Original Message----- From: AAS Press Officer Dr. Rick Fienberg Sent: 10/7/2011 12:34:56 PM To: Rick Fienberg Subject: EPSC-DPS: Map of Moon Reveals Titanium Treasure Troves THE FOLLOWING RELEASE WAS RECEIVED JOINTLY FROM THE EUROPEAN PLANETARY SCIENCE CONGRESS PRESS OFFICE AND THE AAS DIVISION FOR PLANETARY SCIENCES AND IS FORWARDED FOR YOUR INFORMATION. (FORWARDING DOES NOT IMPLY ENDORSEMENT BY THE AMERICAN ASTRONOMICAL SOCIETY.) Rick Fienberg, AAS Press Officer: rick.fienberg at aas.org, +1 202-328-2010 x116. 7 October 2011 Media Contacts: Anita Heward Europlanet Press Officer +44 (0) 7756 034243 anita.heward at europlanet-eu.org Vishnu Reddy Press Officer, AAS Division for Planetary Sciences +49 555 15787 579623 reddy at space.edu Nicole Staab Arizona State University nicole.staab at asu.edu ** Science contacts appear below. ** EPSC-DPS Press Office (7 October only) +33 (0)2 51 88 21 00 (English enquiries) +33 (0)2 51 88 21 01 (French enquiries) Text & Image: http://www.europlanet-eu.org/outreach/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=360&Itemid=41 SUBTLY SHADED MAP OF MOON REVEALS TITANIUM TREASURE TROVES A map of the Moon combining observations in visible and ultraviolet wavelengths shows a treasure trove of areas rich in titanium ores. Not only is titanium a valuable element, it is key to helping scientists unravel the mysteries of the Moon's interior. Mark Robinson and Brett Denevi will be presenting the results from the Lunar Reconnaissance Orbiter mission today at the joint meeting of the European Planetary Science Congress and the American Astronomical Society's Division for Planetary Sciences. "Looking up at the Moon, its surface appears painted with shades of grey -- at least to the human eye. But with the right instruments, the Moon can appear colorful," said Robinson, of Arizona State University. "The maria appear reddish in some places and blue in others. Although subtle, these color variations tell us important things about the chemistry and evolution of the lunar surface. They indicate the titanium and iron abundance, as well as the maturity of a lunar soil." The Lunar Reconnaissance Orbiter Camera (LROC) Wide Angle Camera (WAC) is imaging the surface in seven different wavelengths at a resolution of between 100 and 400 meters per pixel. Specific minerals reflect or absorb strongly certain parts of the electromagnetic spectrum, so the wavelengths detected by LROC WAC help scientists better understand the chemical composition of the lunar surface. Robinson and his team previously developed a technique using Hubble Space Telescope images to map titanium abundances around a small area centered on the Apollo 17 landing site. Samples around the site spanned a broad range of titanium levels. By comparing the Apollo data from the ground with the Hubble images, the team found that the titanium levels corresponded to the ratio of ultraviolet to visible light reflected by the lunar soils. "Our challenge was to find out whether the technique would work across broad areas, or whether there was something special about the Apollo 17 area," said Robinson. Robinson's team constructed a mosaic from around 4,000 LROC WAC images collected over one month. Using the technique they had developed with the Hubble imagery, they used the WAC ratio of the brightness in the ultraviolet to visible light to deduce titanium abundance, backed up by surface samples gathered by Apollo and Luna missions. The highest titanium abundances in similar kinds of rocks on Earth are around one percent or less. The new map shows that in the maria, titanium abundances range from about one percent to a little more than ten percent. In the highlands, everywhere titanium is less than one percent. The new titanium values match those measured in the ground samples to about one percent. "We still don't really understand why we find much higher abundances of titanium on the Moon compared to similar types of rocks on Earth. What the lunar titanium-richness does tell us is something about the conditions inside the Moon shortly after it formed, knowledge that geochemists value for understanding the evolution of the Moon," said Robinson. Lunar titanium is mostly found in the mineral ilmenite, a compound containing iron, titanium and oxygen. Future miners living and working on the Moon could break down ilmenite to liberate these elements. In addition, Apollo data shows that titanium-rich minerals are more efficient at retaining particles from the solar wind, such as helium and hydrogen. These gases would also provide a vital resource for future human inhabitants of lunar colonies. "The new map is a valuable tool for lunar exploration planning. Astronauts will want to visit places with both high scientific value and a high potential for resources that can be used to support exploration activities. Areas with high titanium provide both -- a pathway to understanding the interior of the Moon and potential mining resources," said Robinson. The new maps also shed light on how space weather changes the lunar surface. Over time, the lunar surface materials are altered by the impact of charged particles from the solar wind and high-velocity micrometeorite impacts. Together these processes work to pulverize rock into a fine powder and alter the surface's chemical composition and hence its color. Recently exposed rocks, such as the rays that are thrown out around impact craters, appear bluer and have higher reflectance than more mature soil. Over time this 'young' material darkens and reddens, disappearing into the background after about 500 million years. "One of the exciting discoveries we've made is that the effects of weathering show up much more quickly in ultraviolet than in visible or infrared wavelengths. In the LROC ultraviolet mosaics, even craters that we thought were very young appear relatively mature. Only small, very recently formed craters show up as fresh regolith exposed on the surface," said Denevi, of Johns Hopkins University Applied Physics Laboratory. The mosaics have also given important clues to why lunar swirls -- sinuous features associated with magnetic fields in the lunar crust -- are highly reflective. The new data suggest that when a magnetic field is present, it deflects the charged solar wind, slowing the maturation process and resulting in the bright swirl. The rest of the Moon's surface, which does not benefit from the protective shield of a magnetic field, is more rapidly weathered by the solar wind. This result may suggest that bombardment by charged particles may be more important than micrometeorites in weathering the Moon's surface. Science Contacts: Mark Robinson Arizona State University School of Earth and Space Exploration robinson at ser.asu.edu Brett Denevi The Johns Hopkins University Applied Physics Laboratory brett.denevi at jhuapl.edu Figure 1: http://www.europlanet-eu.org/outreach/images/stories/ep/news/epsc2011/lroc_picture1.jpg LROC WAC mosaic showing the boundary between Mare Serenitatis and Mare Tranquillitatis. The relative blue color of the Tranquillitatis mare is due to higher abundances of the titanium-bearing mineral ilmenite. Enhanced color formed as 689 nm filter image in red, 415 nm in green, and 321 nm in blue [NASA/GSFC/Arizona State University]. Figure 2: http://www.europlanet-eu.org/outreach/images/stories/ep/news/epsc2011/lroc_picture2.jpg Full-resolution WAC three-color composite (566 nm filter image in red, 360 nm in green, and 321 nm in blue) highlighting regions with varying mare compositions and enigmatic small volcanic structures known as "domes" [NASA/GSFC/Arizona State University]. Figure 3: http://www.europlanet-eu.org/outreach/images/stories/ep/news/epsc2011/lroc_picture3.jpg LROC WAC color ratio 321/415 nm shows little variation due to crater rays. The dark haloed crater, Giordano Bruno, in the upper center is thought to be quite young and thus "immature" and thus still has a distinct UV signature. The most immature material on the Moon as defined by the UV maturity signal are the enigmatic "swirls". The swirls are likely due to local relatively intense magnetic fields standing off the solar wind and thus protecting mineral grains from the maturing effects of solar wind sputtering [NASA/GSFC/Arizona State University]. Figure 4: http://www.europlanet-eu.org/outreach/images/stories/ep/news/epsc2011/lroc_picture4.jpg LROC Wide Angle Camera mosaic centered on the lunar swirl Reiner Gamma and corresponding UV/visible light ratio (321/415 nm) [NASA/GSFC/Arizona State University]. Further Information Lunar Reconnaissance Orbiter was built and is managed by NASA's Goddard Space Flight Center, Greenbelt, Md. The exploration phase was funded by NASA's Exploration Systems Missions Directorate in Washington, D.C. LRO operates under NASA's Science Mission Directorate. # # # EPSC-DPS Joint Meeting 2011 The EPSC-DPS Joint Meeting 2011 represents the first cooperation between the European Planetary Science Congress (EPSC) organized by the Europlanet Research Infrastructure and the Division for Planetary Sciences of the American Astronomical Society. The meeting is being organized in association with the European Geosciences Union and with the support of the Universit??? de Nantes. More than 1,800 abstracts for oral presentations and posters have been submitted for the meeting. EPSC-DPS 2011 provides a platform for the worldwide planetary sciences community to exchange and present results, develop new ideas and network. It has a distinctively interactive style, with an extensive mix of talks, workshops and posters, intended to provide a stimulating environment for the community to meet. The meeting covers the entire scope of the planetary sciences. Details of the congress can be found at the official website: http://meetings.copernicus.org/epsc-dps2011/ Session overview: http://www.europlanet-eu.org/outreach/images/stories/ep/epsc-dps2011schedule.pdf EUROPLANET The Europlanet Research Infrastructure is a major (???6 million) program co-funded by the European Union under the Seventh Framework Programme of the European Commission. Europlanet's Networking Activities provide European planetary scientists with the opportunity to define key science goals, and to exchange ideas and personnel. Europlanet provides TransNational Access to leading laboratory and field site facilities tailored to the needs of planetary research for Planetary Sciences, developing them further through highly focused Joint Research Activities. It is building a Virtual Planetary Observatory where all types of planetary data can be accessed. Europlanet Project website: http://www.europlanet-ri.eu Europlanet Outreach website: http://www.europlanet-eu.org Follow @europlanetmedia on Twitter DPS The Division for Planetary Sciences (DPS) of the American Astronomical Society (AAS) is the largest organization of professional planetary scientists in the world. The DPS was formed in 1968 as a sub-organization within the AAS devoted to solar system and extrasolar planet research. Today it is the largest special interest Division of the AAS. DPS website: http://dps.aas.org ------------------------------------------------------------------------ If you do not wish to receive press releases that are forwarded to the news media by the American Astronomical Society, please unsubscribe by replying accordingly to any incoming press release, or send e-mail to rick.fienberg at aas.org. Requests for referrals to experts on astronomy and space science should be sent to the same address. Rick Fienberg, AAS Press Officer, +1 202-328-2010 x116, @AAS_Press (Twitter). -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From cpvick at globalsecurity.org Fri Oct 7 09:35:05 2011 From: cpvick at globalsecurity.org (Charles Vick) Date: Fri, 7 Oct 2011 09:35:05 -0400 Subject: [FPSPACE] Roskosmos decides to abandon development of Rus-M booster In-Reply-To: <9C18AFE020C64413AAD1530B4BC076FE@ownerfbf08f40c> References: <9C18AFE020C64413AAD1530B4BC076FE@ownerfbf08f40c> Message-ID: <002601cc84f5$ecd90000$c68b0000$@globalsecurity.org> That will be devastating to Samara , Energiya, KBKhA [Chemical Automatics Design Bureau (KB)] of Voronezh, NPO Energomash of Khimki, Moscow r, Samara based TsSKB Progress, S. P. Korolev, Rocket Space Corporation Energiya, of Korolev, Moscow region and the KB Makeyev of Miass organizations. But makes Khrunichev the victor further it makes the new Cosmodrome of Vostochniy (Eastern) Cosmodrome highly questionable to justify. From: fpspace-bounces at www.friends-partners.org [mailto:fpspace-bounces at www.friends-partners.org] On Behalf Of James E Oberg Sent: Friday, October 07, 2011 7:42 AM To: fpspace at friends-partners.org Subject: [FPSPACE] Roskosmos decides to abandon development of Rus-M booster http://en.rian.ru/russia/20111007/167466227.html http://www.itar-tass.com/en/c154/242211.html Roskosmos decides to abandon development of Rus-M booster MOSCOW, October 7 (Itar-Tass) - The Federal Space Agency (Roskosmos) decided to abandon the development of a promising booster Rus-M, Roskosmos chief Vladimir Popovkin said at a question-and-answer governmental session in the State Duma on Friday. "We do not need a new rocket, we will use those that we have," he said. Popovkin elaborated that more than 37% of Roskosmos budget was allocated to develop a launch vehicle by 2015, however, these funds are very small, "so, the launch of a new booster in 2015 is not in question." -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From kgottschalk at uwc.ac.za Fri Oct 7 09:39:59 2011 From: kgottschalk at uwc.ac.za (Keith Gottschalk) Date: Fri, 07 Oct 2011 15:39:59 +0200 Subject: [FPSPACE] Roskosmos decides to abandon development of Rus-M booster Message-ID: <4E8F1D4F020000A600013746@uwc.ac.za> I assume that the main purpose of Vostochniy is to limit the ability of Khazakhstan to keep on rack-raising the rent on Baikonyur. Just as SpaceX limits the amount the Russians can raise the tickets for astronauts toISS. - Keith >>> "Charles Vick" 10/07/11 3:35 PM >>> That will be devastating to Samara , Energiya, KBKhA [Chemical Automatics Design Bureau (KB)] of Voronezh, NPO Energomash of Khimki, Moscow r, Samara based TsSKB Progress, S. P. Korolev, Rocket Space Corporation Energiya, of Korolev, Moscow region and the KB Makeyev of Miass organizations. But makes Khrunichev the victor further it makes the new Cosmodrome of Vostochniy (Eastern) Cosmodrome highly questionable to justify. From: fpspace-bounces at www.friends-partners.org [mailto:fpspace-bounces at www.friends-partners.org] On Behalf Of James E Oberg Sent: Friday, October 07, 2011 7:42 AM To: fpspace at friends-partners.org Subject: [FPSPACE] Roskosmos decides to abandon development of Rus-M booster http://en.rian.ru/russia/20111007/167466227.html http://www.itar-tass.com/en/c154/242211.html Roskosmos decides to abandon development of Rus-M booster MOSCOW, October 7 (Itar-Tass) * The Federal Space Agency (Roskosmos) decided to abandon the development of a promising booster Rus-M, Roskosmos chief Vladimir Popovkin said at a question-and-answer governmental session in the State Duma on Friday. *We do not need a new rocket, we will use those that we have,* he said. Popovkin elaborated that more than 37% of Roskosmos budget was allocated to develop a launch vehicle by 2015, however, these funds are very small, *so, the launch of a new booster in 2015 is not in question.* -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- All Email originating from UWC is covered by disclaimer http://www.uwc.ac.za/emaildisclaimer From agzak at optonline.net Fri Oct 7 09:49:23 2011 From: agzak at optonline.net (Anatoly Zak) Date: Fri, 07 Oct 2011 09:49:23 -0400 Subject: [FPSPACE] Roskosmos decides to abandon development of Rus-M booster In-Reply-To: <002601cc84f5$ecd90000$c68b0000$@globalsecurity.org> Message-ID: It is certainly unpleasant news to Samara, but it is still busy with Soyuz family, so the company would be able to maintain its work force for the time being. However the latest idea of bringing Soyuz to Vostochny is obviously extremely silly and, probably, would die too. As they say in Russia, when you say ?A? you have to say ?B?. If they decided to kill Rus-M, they should abandon Vostochny as well. Anatoly Zak http://www.RussianSpaceWeb.com On 10/7/11 9:35 AM, "Charles Vick" wrote: > That will be devastating to Samara , Energiya, KBKhA [Chemical Automatics > Design Bureau (KB)] of Voronezh, NPO Energomash of Khimki, Moscow r, Samara > based TsSKB Progress, S. P. Korolev, Rocket Space Corporation Energiya, of > Korolev, Moscow region and the KB Makeyev of Miass organizations. But makes > Khrunichev the victor further it makes the new Cosmodrome of Vostochniy > (Eastern) Cosmodrome highly questionable to justify. > > > From: fpspace-bounces at www.friends-partners.org > [mailto:fpspace-bounces at www.friends-partners.org] On Behalf Of James E Oberg > Sent: Friday, October 07, 2011 7:42 AM > To: fpspace at friends-partners.org > Subject: [FPSPACE] Roskosmos decides to abandon development of Rus-M booster > > > http://en.rian.ru/russia/20111007/167466227.html > http://www.itar-tass.com/en/c154/242211.html > > > Roskosmos decides to abandon development of Rus-M booster > MOSCOW, October 7 (Itar-Tass) ? The Federal Space Agency (Roskosmos) decided > to abandon the development of a promising booster Rus-M, Roskosmos chief > Vladimir Popovkin said at a question-and-answer governmental session in the > State Duma on Friday. > > ?We do not need a new rocket, we will use those that we have,? he said. > > Popovkin elaborated that more than 37% of Roskosmos budget was allocated to > develop a launch vehicle by 2015, however, these funds are very small, ?so, > the launch of a new booster in 2015 is not in question.? > > > _______________________________________________ > FPSPACE mailing list > FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org > http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From thomsona at flash.net Fri Oct 7 09:57:32 2011 From: thomsona at flash.net (Allen Thomson) Date: Fri, 7 Oct 2011 06:57:32 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [FPSPACE] Roskosmos decides to abandon development of Rus-M booster Message-ID: <1317995852.94680.YahooMailClassic@web80205.mail.mud.yahoo.com> > If they decided to kill Rus-M, they should abandon Vostochny as well. How far along is construction at Vostochny? The Google Earth coverage is old and just shows the former ICBM facilities. From cpvick at globalsecurity.org Fri Oct 7 10:13:49 2011 From: cpvick at globalsecurity.org (Charles Vick) Date: Fri, 7 Oct 2011 10:13:49 -0400 Subject: [FPSPACE] Roskosmos decides to abandon development of Rus-M booster In-Reply-To: References: <002601cc84f5$ecd90000$c68b0000$@globalsecurity.org> Message-ID: <000701cc84fb$55b7d330$01277990$@globalsecurity.org> To delay RUS-M is ok but cancelling is quite another thing meaning they must rethink Baikonur totally and become diplomats for once From: fpspace-bounces at www.friends-partners.org [mailto:fpspace-bounces at www.friends-partners.org] On Behalf Of Anatoly Zak Sent: Friday, October 07, 2011 9:49 AM To: Untitled Subject: Re: [FPSPACE] Roskosmos decides to abandon development of Rus-M booster It is certainly unpleasant news to Samara, but it is still busy with Soyuz family, so the company would be able to maintain its work force for the time being. However the latest idea of bringing Soyuz to Vostochny is obviously extremely silly and, probably, would die too. As they say in Russia, when you say "A" you have to say "B". If they decided to kill Rus-M, they should abandon Vostochny as well. Anatoly Zak http://www.RussianSpaceWeb.com On 10/7/11 9:35 AM, "Charles Vick" wrote: That will be devastating to Samara , Energiya, KBKhA [Chemical Automatics Design Bureau (KB)] of Voronezh, NPO Energomash of Khimki, Moscow r, Samara based TsSKB Progress, S. P. Korolev, Rocket Space Corporation Energiya, of Korolev, Moscow region and the KB Makeyev of Miass organizations. But makes Khrunichev the victor further it makes the new Cosmodrome of Vostochniy (Eastern) Cosmodrome highly questionable to justify. From: fpspace-bounces at www.friends-partners.org [mailto:fpspace-bounces at www.friends-partners.org] On Behalf Of James E Oberg Sent: Friday, October 07, 2011 7:42 AM To: fpspace at friends-partners.org Subject: [FPSPACE] Roskosmos decides to abandon development of Rus-M booster http://en.rian.ru/russia/20111007/167466227.html http://www.itar-tass.com/en/c154/242211.html Roskosmos decides to abandon development of Rus-M booster MOSCOW, October 7 (Itar-Tass) - The Federal Space Agency (Roskosmos) decided to abandon the development of a promising booster Rus-M, Roskosmos chief Vladimir Popovkin said at a question-and-answer governmental session in the State Duma on Friday. "We do not need a new rocket, we will use those that we have," he said. Popovkin elaborated that more than 37% of Roskosmos budget was allocated to develop a launch vehicle by 2015, however, these funds are very small, "so, the launch of a new booster in 2015 is not in question." _____ _______________________________________________ FPSPACE mailing list FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From agzak at optonline.net Fri Oct 7 10:14:48 2011 From: agzak at optonline.net (Anatoly Zak) Date: Fri, 07 Oct 2011 10:14:48 -0400 Subject: [FPSPACE] Roskosmos decides to abandon development of Rus-M booster In-Reply-To: <1317995852.94680.YahooMailClassic@web80205.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: It is mostly a paper project. The investment so far has been probably minimal: http://www.russianspaceweb.com/svobodny.html#2010 Anatoly Zak On 10/7/11 9:57 AM, "Allen Thomson" wrote: >> If they decided to kill Rus-M, they should abandon Vostochny as well. > > How far along is construction at Vostochny? The Google Earth coverage is old > and just shows the former ICBM facilities. > > > > _______________________________________________ > FPSPACE mailing list > FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org > http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace From cpvick at globalsecurity.org Fri Oct 7 10:25:13 2011 From: cpvick at globalsecurity.org (Charles Vick) Date: Fri, 7 Oct 2011 10:25:13 -0400 Subject: [FPSPACE] Roskosmos decides to abandon development of Rus-M booster In-Reply-To: References: <002601cc84f5$ecd90000$c68b0000$@globalsecurity.org> Message-ID: <001101cc84fc$edcbe750$c963b5f0$@globalsecurity.org> I guess Popovkin is determined to force out the funds for unmanned military science programs and not the future S&T development of the country's economy a very bad omen as I see it From: fpspace-bounces at www.friends-partners.org [mailto:fpspace-bounces at www.friends-partners.org] On Behalf Of Anatoly Zak Sent: Friday, October 07, 2011 9:49 AM To: Untitled Subject: Re: [FPSPACE] Roskosmos decides to abandon development of Rus-M booster It is certainly unpleasant news to Samara, but it is still busy with Soyuz family, so the company would be able to maintain its work force for the time being. However the latest idea of bringing Soyuz to Vostochny is obviously extremely silly and, probably, would die too. As they say in Russia, when you say "A" you have to say "B". If they decided to kill Rus-M, they should abandon Vostochny as well. Anatoly Zak http://www.RussianSpaceWeb.com On 10/7/11 9:35 AM, "Charles Vick" wrote: That will be devastating to Samara , Energiya, KBKhA [Chemical Automatics Design Bureau (KB)] of Voronezh, NPO Energomash of Khimki, Moscow r, Samara based TsSKB Progress, S. P. Korolev, Rocket Space Corporation Energiya, of Korolev, Moscow region and the KB Makeyev of Miass organizations. But makes Khrunichev the victor further it makes the new Cosmodrome of Vostochniy (Eastern) Cosmodrome highly questionable to justify. From: fpspace-bounces at www.friends-partners.org [mailto:fpspace-bounces at www.friends-partners.org] On Behalf Of James E Oberg Sent: Friday, October 07, 2011 7:42 AM To: fpspace at friends-partners.org Subject: [FPSPACE] Roskosmos decides to abandon development of Rus-M booster http://en.rian.ru/russia/20111007/167466227.html http://www.itar-tass.com/en/c154/242211.html Roskosmos decides to abandon development of Rus-M booster MOSCOW, October 7 (Itar-Tass) - The Federal Space Agency (Roskosmos) decided to abandon the development of a promising booster Rus-M, Roskosmos chief Vladimir Popovkin said at a question-and-answer governmental session in the State Duma on Friday. "We do not need a new rocket, we will use those that we have," he said. Popovkin elaborated that more than 37% of Roskosmos budget was allocated to develop a launch vehicle by 2015, however, these funds are very small, "so, the launch of a new booster in 2015 is not in question." _____ _______________________________________________ FPSPACE mailing list FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From cpvick at globalsecurity.org Fri Oct 7 10:34:09 2011 From: cpvick at globalsecurity.org (Charles Vick) Date: Fri, 7 Oct 2011 10:34:09 -0400 Subject: [FPSPACE] Roskosmos decides to abandon development of Rus-M booster References: <002601cc84f5$ecd90000$c68b0000$@globalsecurity.org> Message-ID: <001601cc84fe$2d6f99f0$884ecdd0$@globalsecurity.org> This makes me wonder if the economic bubble has broken over there? From: Charles Vick [mailto:cpvick at globalsecurity.org] Sent: Friday, October 07, 2011 10:25 AM To: 'Anatoly Zak'; 'Untitled' Subject: RE: [FPSPACE] Roskosmos decides to abandon development of Rus-M booster I guess Popovkin is determined to force out the funds for unmanned military science programs and not the future S&T development of the country's economy a very bad omen as I see it From: fpspace-bounces at www.friends-partners.org [mailto:fpspace-bounces at www.friends-partners.org] On Behalf Of Anatoly Zak Sent: Friday, October 07, 2011 9:49 AM To: Untitled Subject: Re: [FPSPACE] Roskosmos decides to abandon development of Rus-M booster It is certainly unpleasant news to Samara, but it is still busy with Soyuz family, so the company would be able to maintain its work force for the time being. However the latest idea of bringing Soyuz to Vostochny is obviously extremely silly and, probably, would die too. As they say in Russia, when you say "A" you have to say "B". If they decided to kill Rus-M, they should abandon Vostochny as well. Anatoly Zak http://www.RussianSpaceWeb.com On 10/7/11 9:35 AM, "Charles Vick" wrote: That will be devastating to Samara , Energiya, KBKhA [Chemical Automatics Design Bureau (KB)] of Voronezh, NPO Energomash of Khimki, Moscow r, Samara based TsSKB Progress, S. P. Korolev, Rocket Space Corporation Energiya, of Korolev, Moscow region and the KB Makeyev of Miass organizations. But makes Khrunichev the victor further it makes the new Cosmodrome of Vostochniy (Eastern) Cosmodrome highly questionable to justify. From: fpspace-bounces at www.friends-partners.org [mailto:fpspace-bounces at www.friends-partners.org] On Behalf Of James E Oberg Sent: Friday, October 07, 2011 7:42 AM To: fpspace at friends-partners.org Subject: [FPSPACE] Roskosmos decides to abandon development of Rus-M booster http://en.rian.ru/russia/20111007/167466227.html http://www.itar-tass.com/en/c154/242211.html Roskosmos decides to abandon development of Rus-M booster MOSCOW, October 7 (Itar-Tass) - The Federal Space Agency (Roskosmos) decided to abandon the development of a promising booster Rus-M, Roskosmos chief Vladimir Popovkin said at a question-and-answer governmental session in the State Duma on Friday. "We do not need a new rocket, we will use those that we have," he said. Popovkin elaborated that more than 37% of Roskosmos budget was allocated to develop a launch vehicle by 2015, however, these funds are very small, "so, the launch of a new booster in 2015 is not in question." _____ _______________________________________________ FPSPACE mailing list FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From agzak at optonline.net Fri Oct 7 10:35:07 2011 From: agzak at optonline.net (Anatoly Zak) Date: Fri, 07 Oct 2011 10:35:07 -0400 Subject: [FPSPACE] Roskosmos decides to abandon development of Rus-M booster In-Reply-To: <000701cc84fb$55b7d330$01277990$@globalsecurity.org> Message-ID: RKK Energia long believed that Rus-M and Votochny were unaffordable pipe dreams. They would actually prefer to fly sooner from Baikonur on a Zenit-derived booster: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/science-environment-10725093 In the future, if real statesmen at NASA, ESA and Roskosmos reach an agreement on the joint moon base or even Mars expedition, they can easily build a heavy-lifting rocket ... and launch it from Kourou! :) Anatoly Zak On 10/7/11 10:13 AM, "Charles Vick" wrote: > To delay RUS-M is ok but cancelling is quite another thing meaning they must > rethink Baikonur totally and become diplomats for once > > > > From: fpspace-bounces at www.friends-partners.org > [mailto:fpspace-bounces at www.friends-partners.org] On Behalf Of Anatoly Zak > Sent: Friday, October 07, 2011 9:49 AM > To: Untitled > Subject: Re: [FPSPACE] Roskosmos decides to abandon development of Rus-M > booster > > It is certainly unpleasant news to Samara, but it is still busy with Soyuz > family, so the company would be able to maintain its work force for the time > being. However the latest idea of bringing Soyuz to Vostochny is obviously > extremely silly and, probably, would die too. As they say in Russia, when you > say ?A? you have to say ?B?. If they decided to kill Rus-M, they should > abandon Vostochny as well. > > Anatoly Zak > http://www.RussianSpaceWeb.com > > > > > > > On 10/7/11 9:35 AM, "Charles Vick" wrote: > That will be devastating to Samara , Energiya, KBKhA [Chemical Automatics > Design Bureau (KB)] of Voronezh, NPO Energomash of Khimki, Moscow r, Samara > based TsSKB Progress, S. P. Korolev, Rocket Space Corporation Energiya, of > Korolev, Moscow region and the KB Makeyev of Miass organizations. But makes > Khrunichev the victor further it makes the new Cosmodrome of Vostochniy > (Eastern) Cosmodrome highly questionable to justify. > > > From: fpspace-bounces at www.friends-partners.org > [mailto:fpspace-bounces at www.friends-partners.org] On Behalf Of James E Oberg > Sent: Friday, October 07, 2011 7:42 AM > To: fpspace at friends-partners.org > Subject: [FPSPACE] Roskosmos decides to abandon development of Rus-M booster > > > http://en.rian.ru/russia/20111007/167466227.html > http://www.itar-tass.com/en/c154/242211.html > > > Roskosmos decides to abandon development of Rus-M booster > MOSCOW, October 7 (Itar-Tass) ? The Federal Space Agency (Roskosmos) decided > to abandon the development of a promising booster Rus-M, Roskosmos chief > Vladimir Popovkin said at a question-and-answer governmental session in the > State Duma on Friday. > > ?We do not need a new rocket, we will use those that we have,? he said. > > Popovkin elaborated that more than 37% of Roskosmos budget was allocated to > develop a launch vehicle by 2015, however, these funds are very small, ?so, > the launch of a new booster in 2015 is not in question.? > > > _______________________________________________ > FPSPACE mailing list > FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org > http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From cpvick at globalsecurity.org Fri Oct 7 11:02:23 2011 From: cpvick at globalsecurity.org (Charles Vick) Date: Fri, 7 Oct 2011 11:02:23 -0400 Subject: [FPSPACE] Roskosmos decides to abandon development of Rus-M booster In-Reply-To: References: <000701cc84fb$55b7d330$01277990$@globalsecurity.org> Message-ID: <003301cc8502$1f0a76b0$5d1f6410$@globalsecurity.org> I guess this is the de-emphasis of manned flight that Popovkin spoke of in August as desired looking for financial return for investment. This defines his leadership as being pragmatic at best. From: fpspace-bounces at www.friends-partners.org [mailto:fpspace-bounces at www.friends-partners.org] On Behalf Of Anatoly Zak Sent: Friday, October 07, 2011 10:35 AM To: Untitled Subject: Re: [FPSPACE] Roskosmos decides to abandon development of Rus-M booster RKK Energia long believed that Rus-M and Votochny were unaffordable pipe dreams. They would actually prefer to fly sooner from Baikonur on a Zenit-derived booster: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/science-environment-10725093 In the future, if real statesmen at NASA, ESA and Roskosmos reach an agreement on the joint moon base or even Mars expedition, they can easily build a heavy-lifting rocket ... and launch it from Kourou! :) Anatoly Zak On 10/7/11 10:13 AM, "Charles Vick" wrote: To delay RUS-M is ok but cancelling is quite another thing meaning they must rethink Baikonur totally and become diplomats for once From: fpspace-bounces at www.friends-partners.org [mailto:fpspace-bounces at www.friends-partners.org] On Behalf Of Anatoly Zak Sent: Friday, October 07, 2011 9:49 AM To: Untitled Subject: Re: [FPSPACE] Roskosmos decides to abandon development of Rus-M booster It is certainly unpleasant news to Samara, but it is still busy with Soyuz family, so the company would be able to maintain its work force for the time being. However the latest idea of bringing Soyuz to Vostochny is obviously extremely silly and, probably, would die too. As they say in Russia, when you say "A" you have to say "B". If they decided to kill Rus-M, they should abandon Vostochny as well. Anatoly Zak http://www.RussianSpaceWeb.com On 10/7/11 9:35 AM, "Charles Vick" wrote: That will be devastating to Samara , Energiya, KBKhA [Chemical Automatics Design Bureau (KB)] of Voronezh, NPO Energomash of Khimki, Moscow r, Samara based TsSKB Progress, S. P. Korolev, Rocket Space Corporation Energiya, of Korolev, Moscow region and the KB Makeyev of Miass organizations. But makes Khrunichev the victor further it makes the new Cosmodrome of Vostochniy (Eastern) Cosmodrome highly questionable to justify. From: fpspace-bounces at www.friends-partners.org [mailto:fpspace-bounces at www.friends-partners.org] On Behalf Of James E Oberg Sent: Friday, October 07, 2011 7:42 AM To: fpspace at friends-partners.org Subject: [FPSPACE] Roskosmos decides to abandon development of Rus-M booster http://en.rian.ru/russia/20111007/167466227.html http://www.itar-tass.com/en/c154/242211.html Roskosmos decides to abandon development of Rus-M booster MOSCOW, October 7 (Itar-Tass) - The Federal Space Agency (Roskosmos) decided to abandon the development of a promising booster Rus-M, Roskosmos chief Vladimir Popovkin said at a question-and-answer governmental session in the State Duma on Friday. "We do not need a new rocket, we will use those that we have," he said. Popovkin elaborated that more than 37% of Roskosmos budget was allocated to develop a launch vehicle by 2015, however, these funds are very small, "so, the launch of a new booster in 2015 is not in question." _____ _______________________________________________ FPSPACE mailing list FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From cdomashnev at acm.org Fri Oct 7 11:22:11 2011 From: cdomashnev at acm.org (Constantine Domashnev) Date: Fri, 7 Oct 2011 11:22:11 -0400 Subject: [FPSPACE] Roskosmos decides to abandon development of Rus-M booster In-Reply-To: <003301cc8502$1f0a76b0$5d1f6410$@globalsecurity.org> Message-ID: <4F2BBBE3E2194B139E2F92DFF0BCC1DD@Tosha> >From what I understand, the exact wording is rather "to suspend" as oppose to "to abandon". KD From cpvick at globalsecurity.org Fri Oct 7 11:45:11 2011 From: cpvick at globalsecurity.org (Charles Vick) Date: Fri, 7 Oct 2011 11:45:11 -0400 Subject: [FPSPACE] Roskosmos decides to abandon development of Rus-M booster In-Reply-To: <4F2BBBE3E2194B139E2F92DFF0BCC1DD@Tosha> References: <003301cc8502$1f0a76b0$5d1f6410$@globalsecurity.org> <4F2BBBE3E2194B139E2F92DFF0BCC1DD@Tosha> Message-ID: <004701cc8508$19653f00$4c2fbd00$@globalsecurity.org> That is my impression until mission decisions programs are developed and the new launch infrastructure will take much longer to build regardless of the funding as that is like building the N1 facility all over again 1962-1971 in reality based on imagery or the better part of two five year plans alone. I just think Baikonur would be more responsible economically -----Original Message----- From: fpspace-bounces at www.friends-partners.org [mailto:fpspace-bounces at www.friends-partners.org] On Behalf Of Constantine Domashnev Sent: Friday, October 07, 2011 11:22 AM To: fpspace at www.friends-partners.org Subject: Re: [FPSPACE] Roskosmos decides to abandon development of Rus-M booster >From what I understand, the exact wording is rather "to suspend" as oppose to "to abandon". KD _______________________________________________ FPSPACE mailing list FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace From cpvick at globalsecurity.org Fri Oct 7 11:48:02 2011 From: cpvick at globalsecurity.org (Charles Vick) Date: Fri, 7 Oct 2011 11:48:02 -0400 Subject: [FPSPACE] Roskosmos decides to abandon development of Rus-M booster In-Reply-To: <4F2BBBE3E2194B139E2F92DFF0BCC1DD@Tosha> References: <003301cc8502$1f0a76b0$5d1f6410$@globalsecurity.org> <4F2BBBE3E2194B139E2F92DFF0BCC1DD@Tosha> Message-ID: <004801cc8508$7f6aa5b0$7e3ff110$@globalsecurity.org> I also expect more emphasis on Baikonur and communication satellites as well as navigation and meteorological satellites that pay back on investments. -----Original Message----- From: fpspace-bounces at www.friends-partners.org [mailto:fpspace-bounces at www.friends-partners.org] On Behalf Of Constantine Domashnev Sent: Friday, October 07, 2011 11:22 AM To: fpspace at www.friends-partners.org Subject: Re: [FPSPACE] Roskosmos decides to abandon development of Rus-M booster >From what I understand, the exact wording is rather "to suspend" as oppose to "to abandon". KD _______________________________________________ FPSPACE mailing list FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace From thomsona at flash.net Fri Oct 7 11:52:56 2011 From: thomsona at flash.net (Allen Thomson) Date: Fri, 7 Oct 2011 08:52:56 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [FPSPACE] Roskosmos decides to abandon development of Rus-M booster Message-ID: <1318002776.40707.YahooMailClassic@web80204.mail.mud.yahoo.com> It appears that Vostochny may go ahead for a while: http://www.rg.ru/2011/10/07/rus-anons.html ????????? ????????? ?? ?????????? ??????-???????? "????-?" ????? ?????????? ???????? ???????? ??????? ?? "????????????????? ????" ? ??????? ??????, ??? ??????????? ????????? ?????? ?????????? ?? ?????????? ????????????? ??????-???????? "????-?", ????? ??????? ? ?????????? "?????????" ??? ???????????? ?? 2015 ???. ?? ?????? ?????????, ?? ?????????? ????? ??????-???????? ???????? ????? 37 ????????? ??????? ????????? ?? 2015 ????, ?? ???? ??????? ??? ????? ?? ???????, ??????? ? ????? 2015 ???? ???? ?? ????. "?? ?????????, ??? ????? ?????? ??? ?? ?????, ?? ???? ????? ?????? ? ?? ??????. ?? ???????? ??????????? ?????? ?? ????. ???????????? ?????? ??????? ??????? ???? ?????????? ????????????? ??????-???????? "????-?". ?? ? ????? ??????? ???? ?????? ? "??????????" ? 2015 ????, ???????????, ?? ????? ???? ? ????", - ???????? ????????? ??? ???????. ????? ?????????? ???????, ??? ? ????????? ????? ???? ?????????????????? ?? ????????????? ?????????? "?????????" ? ?? ???????? ????? "????-2" ? ????. "?? ?????? ???? ???????? ?? ????????, ??? ??? ?????? ?????? ? ????? ???? ?????? ??????? ? ?????????? ?????? ?? "??????????" - ????????? ?????? ?????? ??? ????????? ? ?????????? ?????", - ??????? ??. [snip] -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From thomsona at flash.net Fri Oct 7 12:07:29 2011 From: thomsona at flash.net (Allen Thomson) Date: Fri, 7 Oct 2011 09:07:29 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [FPSPACE] Roskosmos decides to abandon development of Rus-M booster Message-ID: <1318003649.87200.YahooMailClassic@web80201.mail.mud.yahoo.com> > From what I understand, the exact wording is rather "to suspend" as oppose to "to abandon". What Popovkin is quoted as saying is "?? ?????????, ??? ????? ?????? ??? ?? ?????, ?? ???? ????? ?????? ? ?? ??????. ?? ???????? ??????????? ?????? ?? ????. ???????????? ?????? ??????? ??????? ???? ?????????? ????????????? ??????-???????? "????-?". This may be stretching my Russian further than prudent and others who have a better understanding should comment, but I think "????" here means "for the time being" without any definite implication that things will be resumed later. IOW, work on the rocket is being halted (??????????) and they may or may not think about resuming it in the future. From pjp961 at svol.net Fri Oct 7 12:21:36 2011 From: pjp961 at svol.net (Peter Pesavento) Date: Fri, 7 Oct 2011 12:21:36 -0400 Subject: [FPSPACE] Any news update on the status of the Chinese space station module in orbit? Message-ID: <4e8f2737.8dcfe30a.28b8.fffffabd@mx.google.com> Thought I would ask if there are any news updates on the Chinese space station module now in orbit, and how it is faring. Thanks in advance. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From cpvick at globalsecurity.org Fri Oct 7 12:26:39 2011 From: cpvick at globalsecurity.org (Charles Vick) Date: Fri, 7 Oct 2011 12:26:39 -0400 Subject: [FPSPACE] Roskosmos decides to abandon development of Rus-M booster In-Reply-To: <1318002776.40707.YahooMailClassic@web80204.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <1318002776.40707.YahooMailClassic@web80204.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <004c01cc850d$e4ca8b50$ae5fa1f0$@globalsecurity.org> News of the day Roskosmos has abandoned development of the Launcher "RUS-m" "Rossiyskaya Gazeta"-www.rg.ru 07.10.2011, 13:32 Head of Roskosmos, Vladimir Popovkin today on "Government hour" in the State Duma said the space agency has decided to renounce the development of advanced Launcher "RUS-m" start which launched from the "East" was scheduled for the year 2015. According to Popovkina, to develop a new rocket more than 37 per cent of the budget agency before the year 2015, but these funds still lacks, therefore alerting the year 2015 is not speech. "We felt that the new missile is not necessary, we are able to fly and old. We reported the country's leadership. The country's leadership decided to discontinue construction of the Launcher "RUS-m". No launch this missile with "East" in the year 2015, of course, there could be no "quotes Popovkina RIA News. Head of Roskosmos noted that now need to concentrate on the construction of spaceport "East" and missile launches of Soyuz-2 "with him. "On the basis of those times we check, as the rockets fly and take a decision on further plans for" East "-run old missiles or return to the development of a new," he said. It was planned that the new prospective piloted transport system under the working title "RUS-m will replace the spaceships of the Soyuz. From: Allen Thomson [mailto:thomsona at flash.net] Sent: Friday, October 07, 2011 11:53 AM To: 'Constantine Domashnev'; fpspace at www.friends-partners.org; Charles Vick Subject: Re: [FPSPACE] Roskosmos decides to abandon development of Rus-M booster It appears that Vostochny may go ahead for a while: http://www.rg.ru/2011/10/07/rus-anons.html ????????? ????????? ?? ?????????? ??????-???????? "????-?" ????? ?????????? ???????? ???????? ??????? ?? "????????????????? ????" ? ??????? ??????, ??? ??????????? ????????? ?????? ?????????? ?? ?????????? ????????????? ??????-???????? "????-?", ????? ??????? ? ?????????? "?????????" ??? ???????????? ?? 2015 ???. ?? ?????? ?????????, ?? ?????????? ????? ??????-???????? ???????? ????? 37 ????????? ??????? ????????? ?? 2015 ????, ?? ???? ??????? ??? ????? ?? ???????, ??????? ? ????? 2015 ???? ???? ?? ????. "?? ?????????, ??? ????? ?????? ??? ?? ?????, ?? ???? ????? ?????? ? ?? ??????. ?? ???????? ??????????? ?????? ?? ????. ???????????? ?????? ??????? ??????? ???? ?????????? ????????????? ??????-???????? "????-?". ?? ? ????? ??????? ???? ?????? ? "??????????" ? 2015 ????, ???????????, ?? ????? ???? ? ????", - ???????? ????????? ??? ???????. ????? ?????????? ???????, ??? ? ????????? ????? ???? ?????????????????? ?? ????????????? ?????????? "?????????" ? ?? ???????? ????? "????-2" ? ????. "?? ?????? ???? ???????? ?? ????????, ??? ??? ?????? ?????? ? ????? ???? ?????? ??????? ? ?????????? ?????? ?? "??????????" - ????????? ?????? ?????? ??? ????????? ? ?????????? ?????", - ??????? ??. [snip] -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From spaceflightnews at gmail.com Fri Oct 7 12:29:49 2011 From: spaceflightnews at gmail.com (space fan) Date: Fri, 7 Oct 2011 17:29:49 +0100 Subject: [FPSPACE] Ryumin inspired to become a cosmonaut by death of Soyuz 11 crew Message-ID: <027d01cc850e$565725d0$03057170$@gmail.com> EXTRACT: '. Ryumin said that Gagarin's original flight had little effect on him as at the time it had seemed unimaginable for a human to go to space, he said his inspiration to become a cosmonaut came later while he had been working on the construction of spacecraft and following the death of a USSR crew in a space flight. At the time there was insufficient training for cosmonauts and in his opinion the crew hadn't properly prepared for their flight. "If they had followed their documentation precisely they had a chance to survive. It was at that moment that I decided to become a cosmonaut," he said, speaking through a translator. His inspiration was that he could do better and he acknowledged that he had been young and self-assured at the time.' http://www.engineeringnews.co.za/article/astronauts-share-views-on-the-futur e-of-space-flight-at-big-sa-event-2011-10-07 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From dpayson at mail.ru Fri Oct 7 12:30:57 2011 From: dpayson at mail.ru (Dmitry Payson) Date: Fri, 7 Oct 2011 20:30:57 +0400 Subject: [FPSPACE] Roskosmos decides to abandon development of Rus-M booster In-Reply-To: <004801cc8508$7f6aa5b0$7e3ff110$@globalsecurity.org> References: <003301cc8502$1f0a76b0$5d1f6410$@globalsecurity.org> <4F2BBBE3E2194B139E2F92DFF0BCC1DD@Tosha> <004801cc8508$7f6aa5b0$7e3ff110$@globalsecurity.org> Message-ID: <008401cc850e$7e738cc0$7b5aa640$@mail.ru> While CPV is right mentioning the obvious shift to more 'practical' space applications, I would like to remark that the concept of Roscosmos' activities paying back on investments is kind of semantic trap that often makes the space program top level discussions rather complicated. Navigation satellites do not pay back on the space segment investments; rather, they provide the universally accessible free infrastructure for ground-based services in a way like the state investments in the road network support the national economy as a whole. See early Galileo PPP plans. Meteorological satellites do not pay back on the investments, as they are part of the state-owned (and growingly international) infrastructure; also, Roshydromet national weather authority is a major beneficiary here, not Roscosmos. Communication satellites do pay back on investments, but national fixed and broadcasting constellation (Express-AMs, etc.) is mostly funded and operated by the separate player, the Russian Satellite Communication Company (RSCC), the state enterprise controlled by the Ministry of Communications, not Roscosmos or any space industry enterprise. Generally speaking, the government agency's functions should cover the fields that do not include the immediate revenue streams. Those include manned programs, fundamental research, bulky dual use infrastructure like cosmodromes and launch vehicle (to a degree), satnav infrastructure and advanced R&Ds for future technologies. In an ideal world, the exact function for the space agency is developing the assets and infrastructure that do not pay on investments, at least in the commercially recognized sense. We'll see what the trajectory towards the near-ideal world solution is going to be like. Dmitry Payson -----Original Message----- From: fpspace-bounces at www.friends-partners.org [mailto:fpspace-bounces at www.friends-partners.org] On Behalf Of Charles Vick Sent: Friday, October 07, 2011 7:48 PM To: 'Constantine Domashnev'; fpspace at www.friends-partners.org Subject: Re: [FPSPACE] Roskosmos decides to abandon development of Rus-M booster I also expect more emphasis on Baikonur and communication satellites as well as navigation and meteorological satellites that pay back on investments. -----Original Message----- From: fpspace-bounces at www.friends-partners.org [mailto:fpspace-bounces at www.friends-partners.org] On Behalf Of Constantine Domashnev Sent: Friday, October 07, 2011 11:22 AM To: fpspace at www.friends-partners.org Subject: Re: [FPSPACE] Roskosmos decides to abandon development of Rus-M booster >From what I understand, the exact wording is rather "to suspend" as oppose to "to abandon". KD _______________________________________________ FPSPACE mailing list FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace _______________________________________________ FPSPACE mailing list FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace From rmcsbarbosa at gmail.com Fri Oct 7 13:04:29 2011 From: rmcsbarbosa at gmail.com (Rui Barbosa) Date: Fri, 7 Oct 2011 18:04:29 +0100 Subject: [FPSPACE] Any news update on the status of the Chinese space station module in orbit? In-Reply-To: <4e8f2737.8dcfe30a.28b8.fffffabd@mx.google.com> References: <4e8f2737.8dcfe30a.28b8.fffffabd@mx.google.com> Message-ID: The latest official update: http://news.xinhuanet.com/english2010/sci/2011-10/07/c_131177092.htm Rui C. Barbosa Braga - Portugal www.zenite.nu/orbita On Fri, Oct 7, 2011 at 5:21 PM, Peter Pesavento wrote: > Thought I would ask if there are any news updates on the Chinese space > station module now in orbit, and how it is faring.**** > > ** ** > > Thanks in advance.**** > > _______________________________________________ > FPSPACE mailing list > FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org > http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From agzak at optonline.net Fri Oct 7 13:09:02 2011 From: agzak at optonline.net (Anatoly Zak) Date: Fri, 07 Oct 2011 13:09:02 -0400 Subject: [FPSPACE] Roskosmos decides to abandon development of Rus-M booster In-Reply-To: <003301cc8502$1f0a76b0$5d1f6410$@globalsecurity.org> Message-ID: It could be seen as pragmatic, but they now claim that Soyuz-2 would be moved to Vostochny, which might be even costlier than using it for Rus-M. It doesn?t make any sense at all, unless these statements were designed to confuse Kazakhstan and not to upset the Kremlin. Anatoly Zak http://www.RussianSpaceWeb.com On 10/7/11 11:02 AM, "Charles Vick" wrote: > This defines his leadership as being pragmatic at best. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From rmcsbarbosa at gmail.com Fri Oct 7 13:29:02 2011 From: rmcsbarbosa at gmail.com (Rui Barbosa) Date: Fri, 7 Oct 2011 18:29:02 +0100 Subject: [FPSPACE] Any news update on the status of the Chinese space station module in orbit? In-Reply-To: <4e8f2737.8dcfe30a.28b8.fffffabd@mx.google.com> References: <4e8f2737.8dcfe30a.28b8.fffffabd@mx.google.com> Message-ID: And also from CCTV News http://english.cntv.cn/program/newshour/20111007/103920.shtml On Fri, Oct 7, 2011 at 5:21 PM, Peter Pesavento wrote: > Thought I would ask if there are any news updates on the Chinese space > station module now in orbit, and how it is faring.**** > > ** ** > > Thanks in advance.**** > > _______________________________________________ > FPSPACE mailing list > FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org > http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From cpvick at globalsecurity.org Fri Oct 7 15:54:41 2011 From: cpvick at globalsecurity.org (Charles Vick) Date: Fri, 7 Oct 2011 15:54:41 -0400 Subject: [FPSPACE] Roskosmos decides to abandon development of Rus-M booster In-Reply-To: <008401cc850e$7e738cc0$7b5aa640$@mail.ru> References: <003301cc8502$1f0a76b0$5d1f6410$@globalsecurity.org> <4F2BBBE3E2194B139E2F92DFF0BCC1DD@Tosha> <004801cc8508$7f6aa5b0$7e3ff110$@globalsecurity.org> <008401cc850e$7e738cc0$7b5aa640$@mail.ru> Message-ID: <003501cc852a$f420c250$dc6246f0$@globalsecurity.org> Dear Dmitry, we have been doing these large Science & Technology (S&T) projects in the Westand Russia is not unaware of this in its policy direction --which is rarely, if ever, explained. It has been the plan at least since the Eisenhower and subsequent Kennedy administrations to do the following: To apply from the total available discretionary government funding about 40% to basic Scientific Research to push the basic sciences and about 60 % of the available funding to push the basic technologies, (Research & Development) to drive the national economy and to provide for the Citizenry's wellbeing. Above all, it is to provide for the National Security of the nation by keeping the USA technologically industrial base ahead of the rest of the world that opposes our social system by two to two-and-one-half generations strategically. That basic intent applies to the Russian Federation and that is what I am focused on though the administrator has indicated those a fore mention programs which you are correct about but it was in the contest of national economic proviso's. I would add also that weather satellites can have quite an impact as a warning to the national economy impact. cpv -----Original Message----- From: Dmitry Payson [mailto:dpayson at mail.ru] Sent: Friday, October 07, 2011 12:31 PM To: 'Charles Vick'; fpspace at www.friends-partners.org Subject: RE: [FPSPACE] Roskosmos decides to abandon development of Rus-M booster While CPV is right mentioning the obvious shift to more 'practical' space applications, I would like to remark that the concept of Roscosmos' activities paying back on investments is kind of semantic trap that often makes the space program top level discussions rather complicated. Navigation satellites do not pay back on the space segment investments; rather, they provide the universally accessible free infrastructure for ground-based services in a way like the state investments in the road network support the national economy as a whole. See early Galileo PPP plans. Meteorological satellites do not pay back on the investments, as they are part of the state-owned (and growingly international) infrastructure; also, Roshydromet national weather authority is a major beneficiary here, not Roscosmos. Communication satellites do pay back on investments, but national fixed and broadcasting constellation (Express-AMs, etc.) is mostly funded and operated by the separate player, the Russian Satellite Communication Company (RSCC), the state enterprise controlled by the Ministry of Communications, not Roscosmos or any space industry enterprise. Generally speaking, the government agency's functions should cover the fields that do not include the immediate revenue streams. Those include manned programs, fundamental research, bulky dual use infrastructure like cosmodromes and launch vehicle (to a degree), satnav infrastructure and advanced R&Ds for future technologies. In an ideal world, the exact function for the space agency is developing the assets and infrastructure that do not pay on investments, at least in the commercially recognized sense. We'll see what the trajectory towards the near-ideal world solution is going to be like. Dmitry Payson -----Original Message----- From: fpspace-bounces at www.friends-partners.org [mailto:fpspace-bounces at www.friends-partners.org] On Behalf Of Charles Vick Sent: Friday, October 07, 2011 7:48 PM To: 'Constantine Domashnev'; fpspace at www.friends-partners.org Subject: Re: [FPSPACE] Roskosmos decides to abandon development of Rus-M booster I also expect more emphasis on Baikonur and communication satellites as well as navigation and meteorological satellites that pay back on investments. -----Original Message----- From: fpspace-bounces at www.friends-partners.org [mailto:fpspace-bounces at www.friends-partners.org] On Behalf Of Constantine Domashnev Sent: Friday, October 07, 2011 11:22 AM To: fpspace at www.friends-partners.org Subject: Re: [FPSPACE] Roskosmos decides to abandon development of Rus-M booster >From what I understand, the exact wording is rather "to suspend" as oppose to "to abandon". KD _______________________________________________ FPSPACE mailing list FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace _______________________________________________ FPSPACE mailing list FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace From cpvick at globalsecurity.org Fri Oct 7 15:58:29 2011 From: cpvick at globalsecurity.org (Charles Vick) Date: Fri, 7 Oct 2011 15:58:29 -0400 Subject: [FPSPACE] Roskosmos decides to abandon development of Rus-M booster In-Reply-To: References: <003301cc8502$1f0a76b0$5d1f6410$@globalsecurity.org> Message-ID: <003b01cc852b$7c62cf00$75286d00$@globalsecurity.org> Are we not sure they will not launch manned flights from the French Guiana site in the future? effectively vetoing the Kazakhs unless the switch to a Russian Zenit which is presently preferred. From: fpspace-bounces at www.friends-partners.org [mailto:fpspace-bounces at www.friends-partners.org] On Behalf Of Anatoly Zak Sent: Friday, October 07, 2011 1:09 PM To: Untitled Subject: Re: [FPSPACE] Roskosmos decides to abandon development of Rus-M booster It could be seen as pragmatic, but they now claim that Soyuz-2 would be moved to Vostochny, which might be even costlier than using it for Rus-M. It doesn't make any sense at all, unless these statements were designed to confuse Kazakhstan and not to upset the Kremlin. Anatoly Zak http://www.RussianSpaceWeb.com On 10/7/11 11:02 AM, "Charles Vick" wrote: This defines his leadership as being pragmatic at best. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From davidlrickman at aol.com Fri Oct 7 16:38:55 2011 From: davidlrickman at aol.com (David L. Rickman) Date: Fri, 7 Oct 2011 16:38:55 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [FPSPACE] Soviet Lunniy Korabl Helicopter Simulator Update Message-ID: <8CE534843D0D3C4-718-3A5BC@webmail-m057.sysops.aol.com> Hello FPSpacers, Adding to what I posted a little over a month ago: I now have three separate Russian sources giving three different accounts of what helicopter was used to simulate the Lunniy Korabl for training purposes; the ??-4, ??-6, and ??-9. The only solid evidence I have is the photo presented in the August issue of the Russian periodical, "?????", seen here: http://farm7.static.flickr.com/6061/6131508147_6f8aaf0306_z.jpg I have enlisted the help of a Russian Aviation Enthusiast, Sergei Ostrozhinsky. With his help we have only ruled out the ??-6 at this time, "because its wheels (have) another proportions: main wheel bigger, nose-wheel smaller. Moreover, it has a rounded bottom." I have forwarded Sergei more information about the size of the Planeta PRL DA-019 and DA-018 Landing Radar. I'll keep everyone posted on the progress! Best always, David L.Rickman 549 Caribou Road Asheville, NC 28803 USA Follow my progress as I recreate the Soviet Lunniy Korabl spaceship in 1:5 scale at http://lunniykorabl.blogspot.com -----Original Message----- From: davidlrickman To: fpspace Sent: Sun, Sep 4, 2011 3:01 pm Subject: [FPSPACE] Anniversary of a Soviet lunar lander helicopter simulator test Hi FPSpacers, I know it's been a year and a half since we had this discussion, but I came across a photo that I hadn't seen before and thought I'd share (just in case others hadn't seen it). It's the Planeta PRL DA-019 and DA-018 attached to a Mi-6 Helicopter for Lunar Landing Simulation Test: http://4image.uz/images/5913.jpg Not exactly the same as the one actually used on the Lunniy Korabl, but almost there. Best Regards, David L. Rickman -----Original Message----- From: David R. Woods To: fpspace Sent: Sat, Apr 17, 2010 5:15 pm Subject: [FPSPACE] Anniversary of a Soviet lunar lander helicopter simulator test Folks, An interesting item appeared on the Anniversaries section of the Roscosmos web page at http://www.roscosmos.ru. Today was marked as the anniversary of the SU (Soviet Union) 17 April 1970 flight test of a helicopter simulator of a spacecraft used to land on the lunar surface. There were no further details. It is generally assumed that once the Apollo 11 mission had been conducted, that the Soviet lunar cosmonaut team was disbanded to concentrate instead on space station programs. Therefore there should have been no further lander training tests after that. I have done a little searching through my records and I can not find any reference to this event or program. Does anyone have any further details? Dave ????????? ??????????? ??? What space anniversaries 17 ?????? 1970 | ?????????? ?????? ????????? ?? ??????? ??????? ??? ??????? ?? ??????????? ???? ?? ??????????? ?????????. 17 April 1970 | The flight tests of the SU lunar spacecraft to land on the lunar surface for the helicopter simulator. 17 April 1970 | Took place the flight tests SU of lunar ship for the landing on the surface of the Moon on the helicopter imitator _______________________________________________ FPSPACE mailing list FPSPACE at friends-partners.org http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace _______________________________________________ FPSPACE mailing list FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From agzak at optonline.net Fri Oct 7 17:49:08 2011 From: agzak at optonline.net (Anatoly Zak) Date: Fri, 07 Oct 2011 17:49:08 -0400 Subject: [FPSPACE] Roskosmos decides to abandon development of Rus-M booster In-Reply-To: <4F2BBBE3E2194B139E2F92DFF0BCC1DD@Tosha> Message-ID: Just watched recording of Popovkin's speech in Duma. In context, it is clear that Rus-M was abandoned not suspended, as a duplication to Angara. There will be no way back. Popovkin went on to say that after Angara starts flying, the agency might decide to build a pad for it in Vostochny. In the meantime, a wacky idea to put Soyuz in Vostochny apparently came from one of Popovkin's deputies in an impromptu interview and then was spread by TV people, who, as we all know, usually have no brains and can't differentiate between declarations of official plans and informal thoughts :) Anatoly Zak http://www.RussianSpaceWeb.com On 10/7/11 11:22 AM, "Constantine Domashnev" wrote: > From what I understand, the exact wording is rather "to suspend" as oppose > to "to abandon". > > KD > > _______________________________________________ > FPSPACE mailing list > FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org > http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace From cpvick at globalsecurity.org Fri Oct 7 19:08:30 2011 From: cpvick at globalsecurity.org (Charles Vick) Date: Fri, 7 Oct 2011 19:08:30 -0400 Subject: [FPSPACE] Roskosmos decides to abandon development of Rus-M booster In-Reply-To: References: <4F2BBBE3E2194B139E2F92DFF0BCC1DD@Tosha> Message-ID: <001001cc8546$07e6c170$17b44450$@globalsecurity.org> That to me is a very dangerous long term Science & Technology decision and bring the New manned spacecraft PTK-NP (RUS) development of the S. P. Korolev Rocket Space Corporation and Zenit combination up to challenge win or lose all including Vostochny economic decision or the deathblow for the S. P. Korolev Corporation in the long term and manned spaceflight? I am very reserved on Angara options as incompatible which is why I said the New Manned Spacecraft PTK-NP (RUS) is highly questionable. This is an extremely bad oman from my perspective for the Russian Federation Future. This is a military, industry Coup D??tat for the Khrunichev Space Center over S. P. Korolev Corporation that no doubt may be taken over as an industry consolidation by Khrunichev. Be that as it may the game is over from my perspective. It totally remind me of the forced congressional office of management and budget design of SLS to pay off the padded politicians solid motor industry rammed down our throats that I find totally intolerable and walk away from as I fade away in semi-retirement total discuss. Enough. Never mind the future of future generations... cpv -----Original Message----- From: fpspace-bounces at www.friends-partners.org [mailto:fpspace-bounces at www.friends-partners.org] On Behalf Of Anatoly Zak Sent: Friday, October 07, 2011 5:49 PM To: fpspace at www.friends-partners.org Subject: Re: [FPSPACE] Roskosmos decides to abandon development of Rus-M booster Just watched recording of Popovkin's speech in Duma. In context, it is clear that Rus-M was abandoned not suspended, as a duplication to Angara. There will be no way back. Popovkin went on to say that after Angara starts flying, the agency might decide to build a pad for it in. In the meantime, a wacky idea to put Soyuz in Vostochny apparently came from one of Popovkin's deputies in an impromptu interview and then was spread by TV people, who, as we all know, usually have no brains and can't differentiate between declarations of official plans and informal thoughts :) Anatoly Zak http://www.RussianSpaceWeb.com On 10/7/11 11:22 AM, "Constantine Domashnev" wrote: > From what I understand, the exact wording is rather "to suspend" as > oppose to "to abandon". > > KD > > _______________________________________________ > FPSPACE mailing list > FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org > http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace _______________________________________________ FPSPACE mailing list FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace From jameseoberg at comcast.net Fri Oct 7 20:14:35 2011 From: jameseoberg at comcast.net (jameseoberg at comcast.net) Date: Sat, 8 Oct 2011 00:14:35 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [FPSPACE] Roskosmos decides to abandon development of Rus-M booster In-Reply-To: <001001cc8546$07e6c170$17b44450$@globalsecurity.org> Message-ID: <1888273060.77679.1318032875269.JavaMail.root@sz0079a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net> This remains a members-only link to the article, I'll try to get my pdf file posted on my home page/ Aerospace America (AIAA) ? // ? October 2011 issue PERSPECTIVES ON THE RUS-M BOOSTER PROJECT Plans for building Rus-M, Russia's next-generation crew-carrying space booster, face mounting problems. by James Oberg http://www.aerospaceamerica.org/Pages/TableOfContents.aspx -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From cdomashnev at acm.org Fri Oct 7 20:36:45 2011 From: cdomashnev at acm.org (Constantine A. Domashnev) Date: Fri, 7 Oct 2011 20:36:45 -0400 Subject: [FPSPACE] Roskosmos decides to abandon development of Rus-M booster Message-ID: <000801cc8552$5dbb7300$0800a8c0@vosem> Hi, >From what I can tell at the moment of this writing, the majority of news agencies/reporters seem to use the 'to suspend' wording. To what degree it is "wishful thinking", I cannot tell. KD Pittsburgh, PA -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From drwoods at stny.rr.com Sat Oct 8 21:50:14 2011 From: drwoods at stny.rr.com (David R. Woods) Date: Sat, 08 Oct 2011 21:50:14 -0400 Subject: [FPSPACE] Mercury Messenger spacecraft first solar day results Message-ID: <4E90FDD6.9020506@stny.rr.com> Has anyone seen any of the results that were to be presented at this conference? ******************************** http://messenger.jhuapl.edu/ October 5, 2011 *MESSENGER Team Presents New Mercury Findings at Planetary Conference* Nantes, France?MESSENGER scientists will highlight the latest results on Mercury from MESSENGER observations obtained during the first six months (the first Mercury solar day) in orbit. These findings will be presented October 5 in 30 papers and posters as part of a special session of the joint meeting of the European Planetary Science Congress and the Division for Planetary Sciences of the American Astronomical Society in Nantes, Frances. From phillipclark at btinternet.com Mon Oct 10 03:12:24 2011 From: phillipclark at btinternet.com (Phillip Clark) Date: Mon, 10 Oct 2011 08:12:24 +0100 Subject: [FPSPACE] Cosmos 2472 down? Message-ID: There have been no new element sets for Cosmos 2472, the latest Kobalt-M photoreconnaissance satellite, issued since October 8.77. Therefore, I am wondering whether it has come down. Phillip Clark -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From thomsona at flash.net Tue Oct 11 09:03:12 2011 From: thomsona at flash.net (Allen Thomson) Date: Tue, 11 Oct 2011 06:03:12 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [FPSPACE] Shenzhou-8, Tiangong plans Message-ID: <1318338192.92061.YahooMailClassic@web80207.mail.mud.yahoo.com> http://english.peopledaily.com.cn/202936/7614095.html China's Shenzhou-8 spacecraft launch on target 13:46, October 11, 2011 After the space laboratory module Tiangong-1 successfully entered orbit, the launch of the Shenzhou-8 spacecraft is imminent. Locking in a remarkable "kiss in space," the two will come together in early November, according to space experts. "The preparation for launch is proceeding now," Yin Jiangang, an expert tied to China's space program, told the Global Times on Monday, "according to the original plan, Shenzhou-8 will be launched at the end of October or beginning of November, depending on the technical preparations and weather conditions." The unmanned Shenzhou-8 spacecraft will conduct its first docking test within two days of reaching Tiangong-1 to form a combined spacecraft, according to the Ministry of National Defense. After flying together for about 12 days, the two space modules will separate and prepare for another docking test. After the two docking tests, Shenzhou-8 will return to Earth, while Tiangong-1 will remain in long-term orbit to await the next round of docking practice. In preparation for the docking test, Tiangong-1 was designed to lower its orbit and carry out phase modulations ahead of the launch of its counterpart. "Tiangong-1 controls the progress of the docking at all times," Zhang Bonan, chief designer of Tiangong-1, said to the Science and Technology Daily, "It keeps sending signals to let its counterpart know where it is and to guide the flight path after the docking." If the docking test is successful, China will be the third country to have independently developed space docking technology after the US and Russia. Yin expressed his confidence about the Shenzhou-8 launch, but admitted risks still existed. He believed that the docking test would "lay a sound foundation for the large-scale construction of China's own space station and space experiments in the future." "Tiangong-1 once combined will forms a small-scale space station. China's space station, in its true capacity, may be sent up piece-by-piece from the new satellite launch center in Wenchang, Hainan Province after 2014," Yin told the Global Times, "That will be the task for spacecraft like Shenzhou-11 and -12." According to China's ambitious space plan, Shenzhou-8 through -10 will conduct docking tests with Tiangong-1. Different from the pioneering docking spaceship, Shenzhou-9 and -10 may be manned by an astronaut to complete manual space docking with Tiangong-1. Before 2016, China is planning to send Tiangong-2 and Tiangong-3 into orbit. [snip] From jameseoberg at comcast.net Tue Oct 11 17:49:45 2011 From: jameseoberg at comcast.net (James E Oberg) Date: Tue, 11 Oct 2011 16:49:45 -0500 Subject: [FPSPACE] With Shenzhou/Tiangong rendezvous nearing, WHAT was that Shijian-12 rendezvous sequence last year? Message-ID: <2B56EBA2E16A4048BC73FE024528FDF9@ownerfbf08f40c> With Shenzhou/Tiangong rendezvous nearing, WHAT was that Shijian-12 rendezvous sequence last year? Last year's articles: http://www.thespacereview.com/article/1689/1 and http://www.wired.com/dangerroom/2010/08/chinas-secret-satellite-rendezvous-suggestive-of-a-military-program/ and Two Chinese satellites rendezvous in orbit http://www.newscientist.com/article/dn19379-two-chinese-satellites-rendezvous-in-orbit.html Satellite-watchers worry about China http://cosmiclog.msnbc.msn.com/_news/2010/08/30/5003915-satellite-watchers-worry-about-china restarting the forum http://forum.nasaspaceflight.com/index.php?action=post;topic=21988.75;num_replies=85 In hindsight are there any new insights into these rendezvous maneuvers? Is there any hint from official or unofficial Chinese sources? With the first attempt at PUBLIC rendezvous only a few weeks away, the nature of this still very SECRET series of maneuvers needs to be better understood. Or did I miss somebody's full report? -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From phillipclark at btinternet.com Wed Oct 12 03:13:24 2011 From: phillipclark at btinternet.com (Phillip Clark) Date: Wed, 12 Oct 2011 08:13:24 +0100 Subject: [FPSPACE] With Shenzhou/Tiangong rendezvous nearing, WHAT was that Shijian-12 rendezvous sequence last year? In-Reply-To: <2B56EBA2E16A4048BC73FE024528FDF9@ownerfbf08f40c> References: <2B56EBA2E16A4048BC73FE024528FDF9@ownerfbf08f40c> Message-ID: Since the Shijian 12 rendezvous tests last year were too late to be seriously considered to be related to the Tiangong 1 programme, I had assumed that they were part of a satellite inspector programme. Phillip Clark ----- Original Message ----- From: James E Oberg To: fpspace at friends-partners.org Sent: Tuesday, October 11, 2011 10:49 PM Subject: [FPSPACE] With Shenzhou/Tiangong rendezvous nearing,WHAT was that Shijian-12 rendezvous sequence last year? With Shenzhou/Tiangong rendezvous nearing, WHAT was that Shijian-12 rendezvous sequence last year? Last year's articles: http://www.thespacereview.com/article/1689/1 and http://www.wired.com/dangerroom/2010/08/chinas-secret-satellite-rendezvous-suggestive-of-a-military-program/ and Two Chinese satellites rendezvous in orbit http://www.newscientist.com/article/dn19379-two-chinese-satellites-rendezvous-in-orbit.html Satellite-watchers worry about China http://cosmiclog.msnbc.msn.com/_news/2010/08/30/5003915-satellite-watchers-worry-about-china restarting the forum http://forum.nasaspaceflight.com/index.php?action=post;topic=21988.75;num_replies=85 In hindsight are there any new insights into these rendezvous maneuvers? Is there any hint from official or unofficial Chinese sources? With the first attempt at PUBLIC rendezvous only a few weeks away, the nature of this still very SECRET series of maneuvers needs to be better understood. Or did I miss somebody's full report? ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ _______________________________________________ FPSPACE mailing list FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From jameseoberg at comcast.net Wed Oct 12 13:26:03 2011 From: jameseoberg at comcast.net (James E Oberg) Date: Wed, 12 Oct 2011 12:26:03 -0500 Subject: [FPSPACE] 'Iran Failed With Space Monkey Launch: Report' Message-ID: <24AAE80871074328BFF0A3E9D66A2E56@ownerfbf08f40c> AFP: 'Iran Failed With Space Monkey Launch: Report' Paris, Oct 12 -- Iran acknowledged as a failure Wednesday its attempt to send a live monkey into space last month -- touted as its first step towards launching a man into space. "The Kavoshgar-5 rocket carrying a capsule with a live animal (a monkey) was launched during Shahrivar," an Iranian calendar month spanning August 23 to September 22, Deputy Science Minister Mohammad Mehdinejad-Nouri was quoted as saying by the ISNA news agency. "However, the launch was not publicised as all of its anticipated objectives were not accomplished," Mehdinejad-Nouri told reporters. He said the launch of a live animal into space was "strategic, and a priority," and expressed hope that future launches would attain more of the objectives set. On October 3, Iran indefinitely postponed plans to send a live monkey into space, without giving any reasons. "One cannot give a set date for this project and as soon as our nation's scientists announce the readiness (of the project) it will be announced," said Hamid Fazeli, head of Iran's Space Organisation. The project envisaged launching a capsule with life support using the Kavoshgar-5 rocket to an altitude of 120 kilometres (75 miles) for a 20-minute sub-orbital flight. The project was unveiled in February by President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad. At the time, Fazeli touted the launch of a large animal as the first step towards sending a man into space, which Tehran says is scheduled for 2020. In mid-March, Iran announced the successful launch of an earlier version of the rocket, Kavoshgar-4, carrying a test capsule designed to house the monkey. Iran has already sent small animals into space -- a rat, turtles and worms -- aboard a capsule carried by its Kavoshgar-3 rocket in 2010. The Islamic republic, which first put a satellite into orbit in 2009, has outlined an ambitious space programme amid Western concerns the rocket technology may be linked to developing ballistic missiles that could deliver nuclear warheads. Tehran has repeatedly denied that its nuclear and scientific programmes mask military ambitions. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From ljk4 at msn.com Wed Oct 12 23:44:30 2011 From: ljk4 at msn.com (LARRY KLAES) Date: Wed, 12 Oct 2011 23:44:30 -0400 Subject: [FPSPACE] FW: Centauri Dreams - Thoughts on a Different Apollo In-Reply-To: <90e6ba6136b82d17f204af1ee9b3@google.com> References: <90e6ba6136b82d17f204af1ee9b3@google.com> Message-ID: Date: Wed, 12 Oct 2011 19:20:16 +0000 Subject: Centauri Dreams From: gilster at mindspring.com To: ljk4 at msn.com Centauri Dreams Centauri Dreams Thoughts on a Different Apollo Posted: 12 Oct 2011 05:34 AM PDT Did the Apollo missions produce enough good science to justify their cost? It?s a question Freeman Dyson has speculated on in the past, calling the missions a success because they were ?conceived and honestly presented to the public as an international sporting event and not as a contribution to science.? Symbolic of this is the fact that the first item to be unpacked after each landing was the television camera that relayed mission imagery back to Earth. Apollo inevitably labored under the camera?s gaze, but no great scientific discoveries came from it, and the entertainment emphasis inevitably detracted from the missions? scientific objectives. Image: Buzz Aldrin leaves the lunar lander in this photo snapped by Neil Armstrong. What might Apollo have been if it had been conceived from the start to produce good science? Imagine this: Our six Apollo landings put two astronauts each on the surface for a period of several days. At their disposal were two tons of supplies and equipment. For the entire project, Apollo gave us a total of about 50 man-days on the Moon using an aggregate 12 tons of equipment. What if Apollo had produced 40 man-days per ton of equipment instead of the 4 it actually delivered? This could have been achieved by unmanned freight carriers conducting half the landings, providing six astronauts with 60 tons of supplies and equipment, sufficient for 400 days on the Moon. You wind up with 2400 man-days of exploration instead of the 50 we achieved with Apollo. Let me quote John Cramer on this, because I?m drawing these thoughts from a column he wrote for Analog all the way back in 1988. Dyson had been visiting the University of Washington, where Cramer was then on the physics faculty, and his last lecture there contained these thoughts. Cramer took note of the advantages a much longer stay on the Moon could have brought: With this much time, Dyson suggested, the Apollo project might have achieved some significant science. There would have been time to explore the lunar poles , to circumnavigate the body, to set up radio-astronomy dishes on the Moon?s radio-quiet back side, to take the time to investigate and theorize and observe and test and probe. There would have been the time and opportunity to bring into play those intrinsically human skills which have lead in previous years-long voyages of discovery to new insights and understanding. The real Apollo, of course, was carried out in a few days by test pilots operating at a dead run, with one eye on the clock and the other on the prime-time news schedule. There was simply no time for science. Dyson?s revisionist version of Apollo is another road not taken. The Problem of Premature Choice Apollo was a success, but on the terms the mission was built around, and it could have been done much better. The Space Shuttle, however, was something much different, an example of what Dyson refers to as the ?Problem of Premature Choice,? which he defines as ?betting all your money on one horse before you have found whether she is lame.? Translated into bureaucratic terms, this means that a project can become large enough that exploring alternative engineering methods is seen as a waste that could become embarrassing to the public officials who have supported the project all along. Thus one of several alternatives is hastily selected, the rest eliminated, and the premature selection prevents the accurate analysis of the other methods. Dyson himself has always been an example of independent thinking, but one whose priorities in space exploration favor science, which he thinks should command center stage. As he told his University of Washington audience, the contrast between the Space Shuttle and the International Ultraviolet Explorer (IUE) is instructive. The IUE came with mirror and optics from NASA, a solar power system from ESA, and communications gear from the UK. Countless astronomers and astrophysicists have used it to study tens of thousands of stellar objects in ultraviolet and visible wavelengths, and the IUE was available when supernova SN1987A occurred, providing exceptionally useful light curves that are suddenly back in the news as we try to figure out why neutrinos observed at CERN behaved differently from those from this event. The IUE, which had been expected to last for three years, ended up serving us for eighteen, being finally shut down in 1996, some eight years after Dyson gave his talk at the University of Washington. The IUE provided a great scientific return in a mission that remains to this day little known. Learning where the payoff is ? and deciding what kind of payoff you want to achieve ? is key to the process. Looking at NASA?s future as of 1988, John Cramer asked this question: Will there be further plodding along the dismal path that has lead from the triumph of Apollo to the Challenger Disaster? Will the agency continue to place science far down in the priority queue, going always for the Premature Choice and the job security of mammoth engineering projects? Will NASA continue to withhold any investments in the future, in advanced propulsion technologies, and in new ideas? I hope not. Choosing the Right Technology The questions don?t seem to have changed much over the course of the last 23 years, although the scope of our ambitions has been downsized since that even earlier time (1952) when Wernher von Braun proposed a manned expedition to Mars that would have required moving 70 men and 4200 tons of equipment into orbit around the Red Planet, debarking 50 men and 150 tons of equipment to the surface in three ships, using what was essentially World War II technology. Image: A Chesley Bonestell illustration from a 1952 issue of Collier?s showing his take on the von Braun Mars expedition. A premature choice would have been dangerous here as well. Among the things Apollo did right was to work with adequate communications channels. Where von Braun chose a 1 kHz bandwidth for the link between the Mars expedition and Earth (essentially allowing the two to communicate via Morse code), Apollo was designed for spectacle and television, and used a communications bandwidth thousands of times broader. Dyson is all about getting the mix right, the right technology (competitively chosen) coupled to serious scientific purpose to achieve a lasting result. John Cramer?s long-running Alternate View column in Analog can be accessed online. Talking to Cramer at the 100 Year Starship Symposium, I mentioned how useful I had found it over the years, and he told me that the site housing his column had been one of the first to appear on the Internet in Washington, preceding even the Microsoft website. Talk about getting ahead of the curve! Readers will enjoy Dr. Cramer?s take on everything from quantum mechanics to virtual reality over decades of speculation and analysis, a true resource for the interstellar minded. It?s also a source, as this 1988 column showed, of insightful commentary on getting our priorities right. You are subscribed to email updates from Centauri Dreams To stop receiving these emails, you may unsubscribe now. Email delivery powered by Google Google Inc., 20 West Kinzie, Chicago IL USA 60610 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From ljk4 at msn.com Thu Oct 13 13:01:49 2011 From: ljk4 at msn.com (LARRY KLAES) Date: Thu, 13 Oct 2011 13:01:49 -0400 Subject: [FPSPACE] Daring Russian Sample Return mission to Martian Moon Phobos aims for November Liftoff Message-ID: Daring Russian Sample Return mission to Martian Moon Phobos aims for November Liftoff by Ken Kremer on October 13, 2011 In just over 3 weeks time, Russia plans to launch a bold mission to Mars who?s objective, if successful , is to land on the Martian Moon Phobos and return a cargo of precious soil samples back to Earth about three years later. The purpose is to determine the origin and evolution of Phobos and how that relates to Mars and the evolution of the solar system. Liftoff of the Phobos-Grunt space probe will end a nearly two decade long hiatus in Russia?s exploration of the Red Planet following the failed Mars 96 mission and is currently scheduled to head to space just weeks prior to this year?s other Mars mission ? namely NASA?s next Mars rover, the Curiosity Mars Science Laboratory (MSL). http://www.universetoday.com/89845/daring-russian-sample-return-mission-to-martian-moon-phobos-aims-for-november-liftoff/ -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From ljk4 at msn.com Fri Oct 14 06:20:50 2011 From: ljk4 at msn.com (LARRY KLAES ) Date: Fri, 14 Oct 2011 10:20:50 +0000 Subject: [FPSPACE] Fwd: [JAXA:0311] Astronaut Hoshide Begins to Tweet! Message-ID: ---------- Sent from AT&T Wireless using Windows Live Hotmail -----Original Message----- From: JAXA Press Release Mail Service Sent: 10/14/2011 7:58:25 AM To: ljk4 at msn.com Subject: [JAXA:0311] Astronaut Hoshide Begins to Tweet! October 14, 2011 (JST) Astronaut Hoshide Begins to Tweet! Astronaut Akihiko Hoshide of the Japan Aerospace Exploration Agency (JAXA) joined Twitter on October 14, 2011. Astronaut Hoshide has been assigned as a flight engineer for the Expedition 32/33 crew to stay at the International Space Station (ISS) for about six months from June 2012. During his last mission to space, STS-124 (J1 mission,) Astronaut Hoshide became the first Japanese to manipulate the ISS robotic arm, and conducted the assembly operation of the Japanese Experiment Module "Kibo," including installing the Kibo's Pressurized Module (PM) onto the ISS, moving the Experiment Logistics Module Pressurized Section to the PM, activating the PM, and initializing the Kibo's robotic arm. The mission this time is his second flight, and his first long-term space stay and engagement in a space experiment. On his Twitter page, he plans to introduce his training on the ground prior to his space trip, then report on his collaborative work with the Kibo's operation and control team based on his experience of daily ISS operations as a Capcom*. He will also tweet about science experiments, and his feelings while preparing for the mission, and during the mission. JAXA will provide real-time information on activities at the ISS and Kibo through the communication service tool, Twitter. * Capcom: a Capsule Communicator who is in charge of communicating with astronauts for the ISS control and operation. 1. Astronaut Akihito Hoshide's Twitter Details User name: Aki_Hoshide URL: http://twitter.com/Aki_Hoshide 2. Brief Personal History of JAXA Astronaut Akihiko Hoshide http://www.jaxa.jp/press/2011/10/20111014_hoshide_e.html#profile 3. Reference URL JAXA Website http://iss.jaxa.jp/en/ JAXA Astronaut Akihiko Hoshide http://iss.jaxa.jp/en/astro/biographies/hoshide/index.html URL: http://www.jaxa.jp/press/2011/10/20111014_hoshide_e.html -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Publisher : Public Affairs Department Japan Aerospace Exploration Agency (JAXA) Marunouchi Kitaguchi Building, 1-6-5, Marunouchi, Chiyoda-ku, Tokyo 100-8260 Japan TEL:+81-3-6266-6400 JAXA WEB SITE : http://www.jaxa.jp/index_e.html About This Mail Service : To change registered e-mail address, or to cancel this service, please access to http://www.jaxa.jp/pr/mail/index_e.html -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From pjp961 at svol.net Fri Oct 14 13:47:10 2011 From: pjp961 at svol.net (Peter Pesavento) Date: Fri, 14 Oct 2011 13:47:10 -0400 Subject: [FPSPACE] More about the Iraninan Monkey mission that didn't succeed Message-ID: <4e9875b1.c2c5e70a.3468.ffffcc7a@mx.google.com> http://news.yahoo.com/bad-news-irans-space-monkey-184046067.html News source is from Turkey -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From jeoberg at comcast.net Fri Oct 14 16:54:56 2011 From: jeoberg at comcast.net (James E Oberg) Date: Fri, 14 Oct 2011 15:54:56 -0500 Subject: [FPSPACE] More about the Iraninan Monkey mission that didn't succeed References: <4e9875b1.c2c5e70a.3468.ffffcc7a@mx.google.com> Message-ID: <7188154946DD44359BD218D72E76F81C@ownerfbf08f40c> Is it an independent news source or just another excited newspaper piggy-backing on the original story? I suspect the latter. AFP said there was an Iranian press report that they quoted. I cannot find that original report. ----- Original Message ----- From: Peter Pesavento To: fpspace at friends-partners.org Sent: Friday, October 14, 2011 12:47 PM Subject: [FPSPACE] More about the Iraninan Monkey mission that didn't succeed http://news.yahoo.com/bad-news-irans-space-monkey-184046067.html News source is from Turkey ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ _______________________________________________ FPSPACE mailing list FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From ljk4 at msn.com Fri Oct 14 20:57:06 2011 From: ljk4 at msn.com (LARRY KLAES) Date: Fri, 14 Oct 2011 20:57:06 -0400 Subject: [FPSPACE] FW: Centauri Dreams - Remembering Colliers and Looking Ahead In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Date: Fri, 14 Oct 2011 19:08:32 +0000 Subject: Centauri Dreams From: gilster at mindspring.com To: ljk4 at msn.com Centauri Dreams Centauri Dreams Remembering Collier?s and Looking Ahead Posted: 14 Oct 2011 06:37 AM PDT We?ve been talking lately about space missions designed to maximize science vs. those that are at least partly geared toward public relations. But most missions will have both components, the need for public support being woven into the fabric of our ambitions. As we try, then, to ramp up the scientific return, what can we also do to keep the public engaged and instill interest in space exploration? One answer came from Wernher von Braun?s massive project for space exploration, described in a series of articles on space presented by Collier?s magazine from March of 1952 to April, 1954. Let?s put aside all the technical problems of the von Braun concept and concentrate on it as an incentive for space missions. Al Jackson, with whom I enjoyed dinner and several good conversations in Orlando at the 100 Year Starship Symposium, recently sent me The Ugly Spaceship and the Astounding Dream, an article he wrote for the AIAA?s Horizons magazine. Al is completely upfront about the fact that it was the Collier?s series that brought him into space research in the first place. Now a visiting scientist at the Lunar and Planetary Institute, Al has seen aerospace from the government side (as astronaut trainer on the Lunar Module Simulator) to industry, knew Robert Bussard as well as Robert Forward, and wrote a number of papers on interstellar matters for JBIS, including work in the late 1970s on a laser-powered interstellar ramjet that I want to discuss soon in these pages. Image: Chesley Bonestell?s take on the von Braun lunar lander, an ugly spaceship with a mind-blowing cargo of ideas. The Collier?s series, tapping the artistic genius of Chesley Bonestell, produced what Al calls ?the most influential feat of popular science writing ever,? with its depiction of a complete manned space program ranging from Earth-circling space stations to lunar landings and that massive expedition to Mars. And ?massive? is the right word, for von Braun imagined a flotilla of ten spaceships with a crew of 70 making the Mars journey, fifty of them landing on the surface. 950 ferry flights were needed to assemble the spaceships, but von Braun?s vision included the space infrastructure to make that happen, all based on ideas he had been working on in 1947 and 1948, published first in a German journal and then brought out in a hardcover edition: Marsprojekt; Studie einer interplanetrischen Expedition. Sonderheft der Zeitschrift Weltraumfahrt (1952). But it was the October 18, 1952 issue of Collier?s that Al, then almost twelve years old, found the most fascinating, the one with the ugliest, most un-aerodynamic spaceship he had ever seen shown on final descent to the Moon. It was in the pages of this issue that he learned that aerodynamic shapes count for little in space, and as he tells us in his article, the entire series would wind up changing his life: I came to love that ugly space ship! It cemented itself to my soul. It led me to a life in science, a B.A. degree in Mathematics, an M.A. degree in Physics and a Ph.D. in physics. Most startling, to me, that series led me to 35 years of work in spaceflight, first Apollo, the Shuttle program, and now the ISS. All due to the romance of space expressed by Chesley Bonestell, Wernher von Braun and Willy Ley. Collier?s produced spectacle and soaring ideas, doubtless contributing to the careers of numerous scientists and engineers, even if we now find the technical specifications of the von Braun program daunting. But I sometimes wonder what we might do today to recapture some of the spectacle produced by the Apollo landings, which similarly energized broad portions of the population. Space-minded people like myself are fascinated with the Dawn mission to Vesta and Ceres, and equally drawn to the allure of the Pluto/Charon encounter coming up in 2015. But what would have the most impact on those less obsessed with deep space? I think I may have found the right concept. It?s the notion of exploring another planet by balloon, exemplified by MGA, the Mars Geoscience Aerobot, studied by a JPL team in the 1990s under the acronym MABVAP ? Mars Aerobot Validation Program. It?s an idea with an international pedigree: A balloon system for Mars designed for a Soviet space probe was also under development through the work of Jacques Blamont (CNES), although the project was eventually dropped for financial reasons. In essence, though, the ideas are similar. The idea is to deliver a superpressure balloon system to Mars, an aerobot that would remain aloft for as much as three months, circumnavigating Mars more than 25 times. Along with an infrared spectroscopy system, a magnetometer, instruments for studying Martian weather and a radar sounder, the balloon would be equipped with an ultrahigh resolution stereo imager. Robert Zubrin and a team at Martin Marietta have more recently been working on the Mars Aerial Platform (MAP), a plan to use eight balloons to map the global circulation of Mars? atmosphere, examine its surface and subsurface with remote sensing techniques, and return thousands of high resolution images of the Martian surface. The views returned by an aerial circumnavigation of Mars would be little short of spectacular, as Zubrin notes in the new edition of his The Case for Mars (2011): Today, nearly five hundred years since Copernicus and Kepler, Brahe and Galileo, most people still think of Earth as the only world in the universe. The other planets remain mere points of light, their wanderings through the night sky of interest to a select few. They are abstractions, notions taught in schools. The MAP cameras offer the possibility of taking humanity?s eyes to another planet in a way that has never been done before. Through the gondola?s cameras we will see Mars in its spectacular vastness: its enormous canyons, its towering mountains, its dry lake and river beds, its rocky plains and frozen fields. We will see that Mars is truly another world, no longer a notion but a possible destination. And, just as the New World entranced and enticed mariners here on Earth, so can Mars entice a new generation of voyagers, a generation ready to fashion the ships and sails proper for heavenly air. Remember, I?m thinking in terms of how to kindle public interest in space and keep those fires burning, and to me the ability to see the topography of Mars through close-up imaging of its entire surface could create an experience as breathtaking for some budding scientists as the Collier?s series was for Al Jackson. We go from looking at rover tracks and landscapes limited by a rover?s range to the ability to move freely over Mars, from Olympus Mons to the Valles Marineris. Similar missions have been proposed for Titan, with a certain scientific return as well as the potential for serious public engagement as the aerobot probes the surface of the mysterious moon. An autonomous flying robot was actually delivered to Venus on each of the two Soviet Vega probes, entering the atmosphere in June of 1985. The first balloon failed after less than an hour, but the second operated for almost two Earth days until its batteries failed. Deployed onto the darkside of the planet at an altitude of about 50 kilometers, the balloons operated for their brief lives in an altitude where pressure and temperature were not dissimilar to those of Earth. While the scientific return from the Vega balloons was minimal, the concept was validated. Using aerostats equipped with high-definition imaging capabilities on Mars, we may be able to re-create some of the sizzle of exploration that the Voyagers had, giving a boost to science-minded young people and providing vistas for public viewing through remote sensing that could one day be looked back on as the key players in creating new careers in science. We may or may not one day get to the stars, but if we do, it will be because the right people came across the right incentives, leading them into careers that could change the way we do space exploration. You are subscribed to email updates from Centauri Dreams To stop receiving these emails, you may unsubscribe now. Email delivery powered by Google Google Inc., 20 West Kinzie, Chicago IL USA 60610 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From ljk4 at msn.com Fri Oct 14 20:59:14 2011 From: ljk4 at msn.com (LARRY KLAES) Date: Fri, 14 Oct 2011 20:59:14 -0400 Subject: [FPSPACE] ESA asks Russia to fill in for NASA to explore Mars Message-ID: While the U.S. Stalls, Europe Moves On to MarsOct. 14, 2011 | 13:21 PDT | 20:21 UTC By Charlene Anderson The European Space Agency (ESA) seems to have gotten tired of waiting for NASA to commit to its share of the joint 2016/2018 Mars missions that were planned to lay the groundwork for an eventual delivery of samples of Mars to Earth. Space News is reporting that, to save the two-mission plan, ESA Director-General Jean-Jacques Dordain has formally invited Russia in as a full partner. He's asking the Russian space agency, Roscosmos, to provide its Proton rocket to launch the European Mars telecommunications orbiter and a small lander in 2016. NASA has told ESA that its budget will not allow it to commit to launching the 2016 mission, and the hoped-for 2018 launch of the ExoMars rover on an Atlas 5 is not confirmed. If Russia accepts ESA's partnership offer, the rover will launch on a Proton. Full article here: http://www.planetary.org/blog/article/00003222/ -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From ljk4 at msn.com Fri Oct 14 21:09:46 2011 From: ljk4 at msn.com (LARRY KLAES) Date: Fri, 14 Oct 2011 21:09:46 -0400 Subject: [FPSPACE] Remember when trying to get any images and info on a Soviet space mission was hard... Message-ID: Phobos-Grunt update; lots of new images and video!Oct. 14, 2011 | 15:39 PDT | 22:39 UTC http://www.planetary.org/blog/article/00003223/ -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From jeoberg at comcast.net Fri Oct 14 23:17:15 2011 From: jeoberg at comcast.net (James E Oberg) Date: Fri, 14 Oct 2011 22:17:15 -0500 Subject: [FPSPACE] Remember when trying to get any images and info on a Soviet space mission was hard... References: Message-ID: <9B7BB9D5A6AD493D92E19C6837ECF37E@ownerfbf08f40c> Has anyone seen the detailed ascent/insertion timeline? Specifically, will the interplanetary burn[s] be made during comm, or 'in the blind'? ----- Original Message ----- From: LARRY KLAES To: fpspace Sent: Friday, October 14, 2011 8:09 PM Subject: [FPSPACE] Remember when trying to get any images and info on a Soviet space mission was hard... Phobos-Grunt update; lots of new images and video! Oct. 14, 2011 | 15:39 PDT | 22:39 UTC http://www.planetary.org/blog/article/00003223/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ _______________________________________________ FPSPACE mailing list FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From phillipclark at btinternet.com Sat Oct 15 04:26:18 2011 From: phillipclark at btinternet.com (Phillip Clark) Date: Sat, 15 Oct 2011 09:26:18 +0100 Subject: [FPSPACE] More about the Iraninan Monkey mission that didn'tsucceed In-Reply-To: <7188154946DD44359BD218D72E76F81C@ownerfbf08f40c> References: <4e9875b1.c2c5e70a.3468.ffffcc7a@mx.google.com> <7188154946DD44359BD218D72E76F81C@ownerfbf08f40c> Message-ID: <6F5533CACC694BE8BF2FA07C9E60C7AA@WINDOWSPGK1XFS> http://www.iranmilitaryforum.net/index.php?topic=9848.30 Of course, some translation will be required. Phillip Clark ----- Original Message ----- From: James E Oberg To: Peter Pesavento ; fpspace at friends-partners.org Sent: Friday, October 14, 2011 9:54 PM Subject: Re: [FPSPACE] More about the Iraninan Monkey mission that didn'tsucceed Is it an independent news source or just another excited newspaper piggy-backing on the original story? I suspect the latter. AFP said there was an Iranian press report that they quoted. I cannot find that original report. ----- Original Message ----- From: Peter Pesavento To: fpspace at friends-partners.org Sent: Friday, October 14, 2011 12:47 PM Subject: [FPSPACE] More about the Iraninan Monkey mission that didn't succeed http://news.yahoo.com/bad-news-irans-space-monkey-184046067.html News source is from Turkey ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- _______________________________________________ FPSPACE mailing list FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ _______________________________________________ FPSPACE mailing list FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From jeoberg at comcast.net Sat Oct 15 08:30:49 2011 From: jeoberg at comcast.net (James E Oberg) Date: Sat, 15 Oct 2011 07:30:49 -0500 Subject: [FPSPACE] More about the Iraninan Monkey mission thatdidn'tsucceed References: <4e9875b1.c2c5e70a.3468.ffffcc7a@mx.google.com> <7188154946DD44359BD218D72E76F81C@ownerfbf08f40c> <6F5533CACC694BE8BF2FA07C9E60C7AA@WINDOWSPGK1XFS> Message-ID: <37975BFB57CD4D7484CDC99F673F381B@ownerfbf08f40c> Phil, I don't see anything new here. In fact, since this forum has participants with access to Farsi-languaged press, it does support the view the orriginal French story -- and all subsequent retreads and elaborations [eg, turkish] from that story, are based on some misunderstanding. AFP said it got its information from a published story. That original published story has yet to be found. ----- Original Message ----- From: Phillip Clark To: fpspace at friends-partners.org Sent: Saturday, October 15, 2011 3:26 AM Subject: Re: [FPSPACE] More about the Iraninan Monkey mission thatdidn'tsucceed http://www.iranmilitaryforum.net/index.php?topic=9848.30 Of course, some translation will be required. Phillip Clark ----- Original Message ----- From: James E Oberg To: Peter Pesavento ; fpspace at friends-partners.org Sent: Friday, October 14, 2011 9:54 PM Subject: Re: [FPSPACE] More about the Iraninan Monkey mission that didn'tsucceed Is it an independent news source or just another excited newspaper piggy-backing on the original story? I suspect the latter. AFP said there was an Iranian press report that they quoted. I cannot find that original report. ----- Original Message ----- From: Peter Pesavento To: fpspace at friends-partners.org Sent: Friday, October 14, 2011 12:47 PM Subject: [FPSPACE] More about the Iraninan Monkey mission that didn't succeed http://news.yahoo.com/bad-news-irans-space-monkey-184046067.html News source is from Turkey -------------------------------------------------------------------------- _______________________________________________ FPSPACE mailing list FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- _______________________________________________ FPSPACE mailing list FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ _______________________________________________ FPSPACE mailing list FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From agzak at optonline.net Sat Oct 15 08:53:33 2011 From: agzak at optonline.net (Anatoly Zak) Date: Sat, 15 Oct 2011 08:53:33 -0400 Subject: [FPSPACE] Remember when trying to get any images and info on a Soviet space mission was hard... In-Reply-To: <9B7BB9D5A6AD493D92E19C6837ECF37E@ownerfbf08f40c> Message-ID: You are clearly not reading a real source on the Phobos-Grunt, or any other Russian mission for this matter :) http://www.russianspaceweb.com/phobos_grunt_scenario.html Quote: ...First two firings would be conducted in accordance with a pre-programmed sequence, while the third maneuver would be commanded on the basis of the latest trajectory tracking data.... I should mention that the launch profile apparently changed again to a two-engine burn. I will update the page before the launch. Anatoly Zak On 10/14/11 11:17 PM, "James E Oberg" wrote: > Has anyone seen the detailed ascent/insertion timeline? > > Specifically, will the interplanetary burn[s] be made during comm, or 'in the > blind'? > > > >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> >> From: LARRY KLAES >> >> To: fpspace >> >> Sent: Friday, October 14, 2011 8:09 PM >> >> Subject: [FPSPACE] Remember when trying to get any images and info on a >> Soviet space mission was hard... >> >> >> >> >> >> Phobos-Grunt update; lots of new images and video! >> >> Oct. 14, 2011 | 15:39 PDT | 22:39 UTC >> >> http://www.planetary.org/blog/article/00003223/ >> >> >> >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> FPSPACE mailing list >> FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org >> http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> FPSPACE mailing list >> FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org >> http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From m.launer at att.net Sun Oct 16 16:46:44 2011 From: m.launer at att.net (Michael Launer) Date: Sun, 16 Oct 2011 13:46:44 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [FPSPACE] Roskosmos decides to abandon development of Rus-M booster In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <1318798004.20517.YahooMailRC@web180804.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> Different print versions of news reports use both and development. Also, it is said that the booster is not needed (meaning before 2015). Clear as mud, perhaps purposely so. MKL ________________________________ From: "fpspace-request at www.friends-partners.org" To: fpspace at www.friends-partners.org Sent: Fri, October 14, 2011 4:55:07 PM Subject: FPSPACE Digest, Vol 91, Issue 5 Send FPSPACE mailing list submissions to ??? fpspace at www.friends-partners.org To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit ??? http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to ??? fpspace-request at www.friends-partners.org You can reach the person managing the list at ??? fpspace-owner at www.friends-partners.org When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific than "Re: Contents of FPSPACE digest..." Today's Topics: ? 1. Re: Roskosmos decides to abandon development??? of??? Rus-M??? booster ? ? ? (jameseoberg at comcast.net) ? 2. Re: Roskosmos decides to abandon development of Rus-M??? booster ? ? ? (Constantine A. Domashnev) ? 3. Mercury Messenger spacecraft first solar day results ? ? ? (David R. Woods) ? 4. Cosmos 2472 down? (Phillip Clark) ? 5. Shenzhou-8, Tiangong plans (Allen Thomson) ? 6. With Shenzhou/Tiangong rendezvous nearing,??? WHAT was that ? ? ? Shijian-12 rendezvous sequence last year? (James E Oberg) ? 7. Re: With Shenzhou/Tiangong rendezvous nearing,??? WHAT was that ? ? ? Shijian-12 rendezvous sequence last year? (Phillip Clark) ? 8. 'Iran Failed With Space Monkey Launch: Report' (James E Oberg) ? 9. FW: Centauri Dreams - Thoughts on a Different Apollo (LARRY KLAES) ? 10. Daring Russian Sample Return mission to Martian Moon Phobos ? ? ? aims for November Liftoff (LARRY KLAES) ? 11. Fwd: [JAXA:0311] Astronaut Hoshide Begins to Tweet! (LARRY KLAES ) ? 12. More about the Iraninan Monkey mission that didn't succeed ? ? ? (Peter Pesavento) ? 13. Re: More about the Iraninan Monkey mission that didn't ? ? ? succeed (James E Oberg) ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Message: 1 Date: Sat, 8 Oct 2011 00:14:35 +0000 (UTC) From: jameseoberg at comcast.net To: Charles Vick Cc: fpspace at www.friends-partners.org Subject: Re: [FPSPACE] Roskosmos decides to abandon development??? of ??? Rus-M??? booster Message-ID: ??? <1888273060.77679.1318032875269.JavaMail.root at sz0079a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net> ??? Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" This remains a members-only link to the article, I'll try to get my pdf file posted on my home page/ Aerospace America (AIAA) ? // ? October 2011 issue PERSPECTIVES ON THE RUS-M BOOSTER PROJECT Plans for building Rus-M, Russia's next-generation crew-carrying space booster, face mounting problems. by James Oberg http://www.aerospaceamerica.org/Pages/TableOfContents.aspx -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: ------------------------------ Message: 2 Date: Fri, 7 Oct 2011 20:36:45 -0400 From: "Constantine A. Domashnev" To: Subject: Re: [FPSPACE] Roskosmos decides to abandon development of ??? Rus-M??? booster Message-ID: <000801cc8552$5dbb7300$0800a8c0 at vosem> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Hi, >From what I can tell at the moment of this writing, the majority of news >agencies/reporters seem to use the 'to suspend' wording. To what degree it is "wishful thinking", I cannot tell. KD Pittsburgh, PA -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: ------------------------------ Message: 3 Date: Sat, 08 Oct 2011 21:50:14 -0400 From: "David R. Woods" To: fpspace at friends-partners.org Subject: [FPSPACE] Mercury Messenger spacecraft first solar day ??? results Message-ID: <4E90FDD6.9020506 at stny.rr.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252; format=flowed Has anyone seen any of the results that were to be presented at this conference? ******************************** http://messenger.jhuapl.edu/ October 5, 2011 *MESSENGER Team Presents New Mercury Findings at Planetary Conference* Nantes, France?MESSENGER scientists will highlight the latest results on Mercury from MESSENGER observations obtained during the first six months (the first Mercury solar day) in orbit. These findings will be presented October 5 in 30 papers and posters as part of a special session of the joint meeting of the European Planetary Science Congress and the Division for Planetary Sciences of the American Astronomical Society in Nantes, Frances. ------------------------------ Message: 4 Date: Mon, 10 Oct 2011 08:12:24 +0100 From: "Phillip Clark" To: "FPSPACE" Subject: [FPSPACE] Cosmos 2472 down? Message-ID: Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" There have been no new element sets for Cosmos 2472, the latest Kobalt-M photoreconnaissance satellite, issued since October 8.77. Therefore, I am wondering whether it has come down. Phillip Clark -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: ------------------------------ Message: 5 Date: Tue, 11 Oct 2011 06:03:12 -0700 (PDT) From: Allen Thomson To: FPSpace Cc: Ted J Molczan Subject: [FPSPACE] Shenzhou-8, Tiangong plans Message-ID: ??? <1318338192.92061.YahooMailClassic at web80207.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii http://english.peopledaily.com.cn/202936/7614095.html China's Shenzhou-8 spacecraft launch on target 13:46, October 11, 2011 After the space laboratory module Tiangong-1 successfully entered orbit, the launch of the Shenzhou-8 spacecraft is imminent. Locking in a remarkable "kiss in space," the two will come together in early November, according to space experts. "The preparation for launch is proceeding now," Yin Jiangang, an expert tied to China's space program, told the Global Times on Monday, "according to the original plan, Shenzhou-8 will be launched at the end of October or beginning of November, depending on the technical preparations and weather conditions." The unmanned Shenzhou-8 spacecraft will conduct its first docking test within two days of reaching Tiangong-1 to form a combined spacecraft, according to the Ministry of National Defense. After flying together for about 12 days, the two space modules will separate and prepare for another docking test. After the two docking tests, Shenzhou-8 will return to Earth, while Tiangong-1 will remain in long-term orbit to await the next round of docking practice. In preparation for the docking test, Tiangong-1 was designed to lower its orbit and carry out phase modulations ahead of the launch of its counterpart. "Tiangong-1 controls the progress of the docking at all times," Zhang Bonan, chief designer of Tiangong-1, said to the Science and Technology Daily, "It keeps sending signals to let its counterpart know where it is and to guide the flight path after the docking." If the docking test is successful, China will be the third country to have independently developed space docking technology after the US and Russia. Yin expressed his confidence about the Shenzhou-8 launch, but admitted risks still existed. He believed that the docking test would "lay a sound foundation for the large-scale construction of China's own space station and space experiments in the future." "Tiangong-1 once combined will forms a small-scale space station. China's space station, in its true capacity, may be sent up piece-by-piece from the new satellite launch center in Wenchang, Hainan Province after 2014," Yin told the Global Times, "That will be the task for spacecraft like Shenzhou-11 and -12." According to China's ambitious space plan, Shenzhou-8 through -10 will conduct docking tests with Tiangong-1. Different from the pioneering docking spaceship, Shenzhou-9 and -10 may be manned by an astronaut to complete manual space docking with Tiangong-1. Before 2016, China is planning to send Tiangong-2 and Tiangong-3 into orbit. [snip] ------------------------------ Message: 6 Date: Tue, 11 Oct 2011 16:49:45 -0500 From: "James E Oberg" To: Subject: [FPSPACE] With Shenzhou/Tiangong rendezvous nearing,??? WHAT was ??? that Shijian-12 rendezvous sequence last year? Message-ID: <2B56EBA2E16A4048BC73FE024528FDF9 at ownerfbf08f40c> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" With Shenzhou/Tiangong rendezvous nearing, WHAT was that Shijian-12 rendezvous sequence last year? Last year's articles: http://www.thespacereview.com/article/1689/1 and http://www.wired.com/dangerroom/2010/08/chinas-secret-satellite-rendezvous-suggestive-of-a-military-program/ and Two Chinese satellites rendezvous in orbit http://www.newscientist.com/article/dn19379-two-chinese-satellites-rendezvous-in-orbit.html Satellite-watchers worry about China http://cosmiclog.msnbc.msn.com/_news/2010/08/30/5003915-satellite-watchers-worry-about-china restarting the forum http://forum.nasaspaceflight.com/index.php?action=post;topic=21988.75;num_replies=85 In hindsight are there any new insights into these rendezvous maneuvers? Is there any hint from official or unofficial Chinese sources? With the first attempt at PUBLIC rendezvous only a few weeks away, the nature of this still very SECRET series of maneuvers needs to be better understood. Or did I miss somebody's full report? -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: ------------------------------ Message: 7 Date: Wed, 12 Oct 2011 08:13:24 +0100 From: "Phillip Clark" To: "fpSPACE" Subject: Re: [FPSPACE] With Shenzhou/Tiangong rendezvous nearing,??? WHAT ??? was that Shijian-12 rendezvous sequence last year? Message-ID: Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Since the Shijian 12 rendezvous tests last year were too late to be seriously considered to be related to the Tiangong 1 programme, I had assumed that they were part of a satellite inspector programme. Phillip Clark ? ----- Original Message ----- ? From: James E Oberg ? To: fpspace at friends-partners.org ? Sent: Tuesday, October 11, 2011 10:49 PM ? Subject: [FPSPACE] With Shenzhou/Tiangong rendezvous nearing,WHAT was that Shijian-12 rendezvous sequence last year? ? With Shenzhou/Tiangong rendezvous nearing, WHAT was that Shijian-12 rendezvous sequence last year? ? Last year's articles: ? ? http://www.thespacereview.com/article/1689/1 and ? http://www.wired.com/dangerroom/2010/08/chinas-secret-satellite-rendezvous-suggestive-of-a-military-program/ and ? Two Chinese satellites rendezvous in orbit ? http://www.newscientist.com/article/dn19379-two-chinese-satellites-rendezvous-in-orbit.html ? Satellite-watchers worry about China ? http://cosmiclog.msnbc.msn.com/_news/2010/08/30/5003915-satellite-watchers-worry-about-china ? ? restarting the forum ? http://forum.nasaspaceflight.com/index.php?action=post;topic=21988.75;num_replies=85 ? ? In hindsight are there any new insights into these rendezvous maneuvers? Is there any hint from official or unofficial Chinese sources? ? ? With the first attempt at PUBLIC rendezvous only a few weeks away, the nature of this still very SECRET series of maneuvers needs to be better understood. ? ? Or did I miss somebody's full report? ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ ? _______________________________________________ ? FPSPACE mailing list ? FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org ? http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: ------------------------------ Message: 8 Date: Wed, 12 Oct 2011 12:26:03 -0500 From: "James E Oberg" To: Subject: [FPSPACE] 'Iran Failed With Space Monkey Launch: Report' Message-ID: <24AAE80871074328BFF0A3E9D66A2E56 at ownerfbf08f40c> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" AFP: 'Iran Failed With Space Monkey Launch: Report' ? ? Paris, Oct 12 -- Iran acknowledged as a failure Wednesday its attempt to send a live monkey into space last month -- touted as its first step towards launching a man into space. ? "The Kavoshgar-5 rocket carrying a capsule with a live animal (a monkey) was launched during Shahrivar," an Iranian calendar month spanning August 23 to September 22, Deputy Science Minister Mohammad Mehdinejad-Nouri was quoted as saying by the ISNA news agency. ? "However, the launch was not publicised as all of its anticipated objectives were not accomplished," Mehdinejad-Nouri told reporters. ? He said the launch of a live animal into space was "strategic, and a priority," and expressed hope that future launches would attain more of the objectives set. ? On October 3, Iran indefinitely postponed plans to send a live monkey into space, without giving any reasons. ? "One cannot give a set date for this project and as soon as our nation's scientists announce the readiness (of the project) it will be announced," said Hamid Fazeli, head of Iran's Space Organisation. ? The project envisaged launching a capsule with life support using the Kavoshgar-5 rocket to an altitude of 120 kilometres (75 miles) for a 20-minute sub-orbital flight. ? The project was unveiled in February by President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad. ? At the time, Fazeli touted the launch of a large animal as the first step towards sending a man into space, which Tehran says is scheduled for 2020. ? In mid-March, Iran announced the successful launch of an earlier version of the rocket, Kavoshgar-4, carrying a test capsule designed to house the monkey. ? Iran has already sent small animals into space -- a rat, turtles and worms -- aboard a capsule carried by its Kavoshgar-3 rocket in 2010. ? The Islamic republic, which first put a satellite into orbit in 2009, has outlined an ambitious space programme amid Western concerns the rocket technology may be linked to developing ballistic missiles that could deliver nuclear warheads. ? Tehran has repeatedly denied that its nuclear and scientific programmes mask military ambitions. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: ------------------------------ Message: 9 Date: Wed, 12 Oct 2011 23:44:30 -0400 From: LARRY KLAES To: fpspace , Subject: [FPSPACE] FW: Centauri Dreams - Thoughts on a Different ??? Apollo Message-ID: Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1252" Date: Wed, 12 Oct 2011 19:20:16 +0000 Subject: Centauri Dreams From: gilster at mindspring.com To: ljk4 at msn.com Centauri Dreams Centauri Dreams Thoughts on a Different Apollo Posted: 12 Oct 2011 05:34 AM PDT Did the Apollo missions produce enough good science to justify their cost? It?s a question Freeman Dyson has speculated on in the past, calling the missions a success because they were? ?conceived and honestly presented to the public as an international sporting event and not as a contribution to science.? Symbolic of this is the fact that the first item to be unpacked after each landing was the television camera that relayed mission imagery back to Earth. Apollo inevitably labored under the camera?s gaze, but no great scientific discoveries came from it, and the entertainment emphasis inevitably detracted from the missions? scientific objectives. Image: Buzz Aldrin leaves the lunar lander in this photo snapped by Neil Armstrong. What might Apollo have been if it had been conceived from the start to produce good science? Imagine this: Our six Apollo landings put two astronauts each on the surface for a period of several days. At their disposal were two tons of supplies and equipment. For the entire project, Apollo gave us a total of about 50 man-days on the Moon using an aggregate 12 tons of equipment. What if Apollo had produced 40 man-days per ton of equipment instead of the 4 it actually delivered? This could have been achieved by unmanned freight carriers conducting half the landings, providing six astronauts with 60 tons of supplies and equipment, sufficient for 400 days on the Moon. You wind up with 2400 man-days of exploration instead of the 50 we achieved with Apollo. Let me quote John Cramer on this, because I?m drawing these thoughts from a column he wrote for Analog all the way back in 1988. Dyson had been visiting the University of Washington, where Cramer was then on the physics faculty, and his last lecture there contained these thoughts. Cramer took note of the advantages a much longer stay on the Moon could have brought: With this much time, Dyson suggested, the Apollo project might have achieved some significant science. There would have been time to explore the lunar poles , to circumnavigate the body, to set up radio-astronomy dishes on the Moon?s radio-quiet back side, to take the time to investigate and theorize and observe and test and probe. There would have been the time and opportunity to bring into play those intrinsically human skills which have lead in previous years-long voyages of discovery to new insights and understanding. The real Apollo, of course, was carried out in a few days by test pilots operating at a dead run, with one eye on the clock and the other on the prime-time news schedule. There was simply no time for science. Dyson?s revisionist version of Apollo is another road not taken. The Problem of Premature Choice Apollo was a success, but on the terms the mission was built around, and it could have been done much better. The Space Shuttle, however, was something much different, an example of what Dyson refers to as the ?Problem of Premature Choice,? which he defines as ?betting all your money on one horse before you have found whether she is lame.? Translated into bureaucratic terms, this means that a project can become large enough that exploring alternative engineering methods is seen as a waste that could become embarrassing to the public officials who have supported the project all along. Thus one of several alternatives is hastily selected, the rest eliminated, and the premature selection prevents the accurate analysis of the other methods. Dyson himself has always been an example of independent thinking, but one whose priorities in space exploration favor science, which he thinks should command center stage. As he told his University of Washington audience, the contrast between the Space Shuttle and the International Ultraviolet Explorer (IUE) is instructive. The IUE came with mirror and optics from NASA, a solar power system from ESA, and communications gear from the UK. Countless astronomers and astrophysicists have used it to study tens of thousands of stellar objects in ultraviolet and visible wavelengths, and the IUE was available when supernova SN1987A occurred, providing exceptionally useful light curves that are suddenly back in the news as we try to figure out why neutrinos observed at CERN behaved differently from those from this event. The IUE, which had been expected to last for three years, ended up serving us for eighteen, being finally shut down in 1996, some eight years after Dyson gave his talk at the University of Washington. The IUE provided a great scientific return in a mission that remains to this day little known. Learning where the payoff is ? and deciding what kind of payoff you want to achieve ? is key to the process. Looking at NASA?s future as of 1988, John Cramer asked this question: Will there be further plodding along the dismal path that has lead from the triumph of Apollo to the Challenger Disaster? Will the agency continue to place science far down in the priority queue, going always for the Premature Choice and the job security of mammoth engineering projects? Will NASA continue to withhold any investments in the future, in advanced propulsion technologies, and in new ideas? I hope not. Choosing the Right Technology The questions don?t seem to have changed much over the course of the last 23 years, although the scope of our ambitions has been downsized since that even earlier time (1952) when Wernher von Braun proposed a manned expedition to Mars that would have required moving 70 men and 4200 tons of equipment into orbit around the Red Planet, debarking 50 men and 150 tons of equipment to the surface in three ships, using what was essentially World War II technology. Image: A Chesley Bonestell illustration from a 1952 issue of Collier?s showing his take on the von Braun Mars expedition. A premature choice would have been dangerous here as well. Among the things Apollo did right was to work with adequate communications channels. Where von Braun chose a 1 kHz bandwidth for the link between the Mars expedition and Earth (essentially allowing the two to communicate via Morse code), Apollo was designed for spectacle and television, and used a communications bandwidth thousands of times broader. Dyson is all about getting the mix right, the right technology (competitively chosen) coupled to serious scientific purpose to achieve a lasting result. John Cramer?s long-running Alternate View column in Analog can be accessed online. Talking to Cramer at the 100 Year Starship Symposium, I mentioned how useful I had found it over the years, and he told me that the site housing his column had been one of the first to appear on the Internet in Washington, preceding even the Microsoft website. Talk about getting ahead of the curve! Readers will enjoy Dr. Cramer?s take on everything from quantum mechanics to virtual reality over decades of speculation and analysis, a true resource for the interstellar minded. It?s also a source, as this 1988 column showed, of insightful commentary on getting our priorities right. ? You are subscribed to email updates from Centauri Dreams To stop receiving these emails, you may unsubscribe now. Email delivery powered by Google Google Inc., 20 West Kinzie, Chicago IL USA 60610 ??? ??? ??? ? ??? ??? ? -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: ------------------------------ Message: 10 Date: Thu, 13 Oct 2011 13:01:49 -0400 From: LARRY KLAES To: fpspace , , ??? Faces from Earth Google Group Subject: [FPSPACE] Daring Russian Sample Return mission to Martian ??? Moon Phobos aims for November Liftoff Message-ID: Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1252" Daring Russian Sample Return mission to Martian Moon Phobos aims for November Liftoff by Ken Kremer on October 13, 2011 In just over 3 weeks time, Russia plans to launch a bold mission to Mars who?s objective, if successful , is to land on the Martian Moon Phobos and return a cargo of precious soil samples back to Earth about three years later.? ? The purpose is to determine the origin and evolution of Phobos and how that relates to Mars and the evolution of the solar system. Liftoff of the Phobos-Grunt space probe will end a nearly two decade long hiatus in Russia?s exploration of the Red Planet following the failed Mars 96 mission and? is currently scheduled to head to space just weeks prior to this year?s other Mars mission ? namely NASA?s? next Mars rover, the Curiosity Mars Science Laboratory (MSL). http://www.universetoday.com/89845/daring-russian-sample-return-mission-to-martian-moon-phobos-aims-for-november-liftoff/? ? ??? ??? ??? ? ??? ??? ? -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: ------------------------------ Message: 11 Date: Fri, 14 Oct 2011 10:20:50 +0000 From: "LARRY KLAES " To: "fpspace at friends-partners.org " Subject: [FPSPACE] Fwd: [JAXA:0311] Astronaut Hoshide Begins to Tweet! Message-ID: Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-15" ---------- Sent from AT&T Wireless using Windows Live Hotmail -----Original Message----- From: JAXA Press Release Mail Service Sent: 10/14/2011 7:58:25 AM To: ljk4 at msn.com Subject: [JAXA:0311] Astronaut Hoshide Begins to Tweet! October 14, 2011 (JST) Astronaut Hoshide Begins to Tweet! Astronaut Akihiko Hoshide of the Japan Aerospace Exploration Agency (JAXA) joined Twitter on October 14, 2011. Astronaut Hoshide has been assigned as a flight engineer for the Expedition 32/33 crew to stay at the International Space Station (ISS) for about six months from June 2012. During his last mission to space, STS-124 (J1 mission,) Astronaut Hoshide became the first Japanese to manipulate the ISS robotic arm, and conducted the assembly operation of the Japanese Experiment Module "Kibo," including installing the Kibo's Pressurized Module (PM) onto the ISS, moving the Experiment Logistics Module Pressurized Section to the PM, activating the PM, and initializing the Kibo's robotic arm. The mission this time is his second flight, and his first long-term space stay and engagement in a space experiment. On his Twitter page, he plans to introduce his training on the ground prior to his space trip, then report on his collaborative work with the Kibo's operation and control team based on his experience of daily ISS operations as a Capcom*. He will also tweet about science experiments, and his feelings while preparing for the mission, and during the mission. JAXA will provide real-time information on activities at the ISS and Kibo through the communication service tool, Twitter. * Capcom: a Capsule Communicator who is in charge of communicating with ? ? ? ? ? astronauts for the ISS control and operation. 1. Astronaut Akihito Hoshide's Twitter Details User name: Aki_Hoshide URL: http://twitter.com/Aki_Hoshide 2. Brief Personal History of JAXA Astronaut Akihiko Hoshide http://www.jaxa.jp/press/2011/10/20111014_hoshide_e.html#profile 3. Reference URL JAXA Website ? http://iss.jaxa.jp/en/ JAXA Astronaut Akihiko Hoshide ? http://iss.jaxa.jp/en/astro/biographies/hoshide/index.html URL: http://www.jaxa.jp/press/2011/10/20111014_hoshide_e.html -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Publisher : Public Affairs Department Japan Aerospace Exploration Agency (JAXA) Marunouchi Kitaguchi Building, 1-6-5, Marunouchi, Chiyoda-ku, Tokyo 100-8260 Japan TEL:+81-3-6266-6400 JAXA WEB SITE : http://www.jaxa.jp/index_e.html About This Mail Service : To change registered e-mail address, or to cancel this service, please access to http://www.jaxa.jp/pr/mail/index_e.html -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: ------------------------------ Message: 12 Date: Fri, 14 Oct 2011 13:47:10 -0400 From: "Peter Pesavento" To: Subject: [FPSPACE] More about the Iraninan Monkey mission that didn't ??? succeed Message-ID: <4e9875b1.c2c5e70a.3468.ffffcc7a at mx.google.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" http://news.yahoo.com/bad-news-irans-space-monkey-184046067.html News source is from Turkey -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: ------------------------------ Message: 13 Date: Fri, 14 Oct 2011 15:54:56 -0500 From: "James E Oberg" To: "Peter Pesavento" , ??? Subject: Re: [FPSPACE] More about the Iraninan Monkey mission that ??? didn't??? succeed Message-ID: <7188154946DD44359BD218D72E76F81C at ownerfbf08f40c> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Is it an independent news source or just another excited newspaper piggy-backing on the original story? I suspect the latter. AFP said there was an Iranian press report that they quoted. I cannot find that original report. ? ----- Original Message ----- ? From: Peter Pesavento ? To: fpspace at friends-partners.org ? Sent: Friday, October 14, 2011 12:47 PM ? Subject: [FPSPACE] More about the Iraninan Monkey mission that didn't succeed ? http://news.yahoo.com/bad-news-irans-space-monkey-184046067.html ? ? News source is from Turkey ? ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ ? _______________________________________________ ? FPSPACE mailing list ? FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org ? http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: ------------------------------ _______________________________________________ FPSPACE mailing list FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace End of FPSPACE Digest, Vol 91, Issue 5 ************************************** -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From ljk4 at msn.com Mon Oct 17 14:21:21 2011 From: ljk4 at msn.com (LARRY KLAES ) Date: Mon, 17 Oct 2011 18:21:21 +0000 Subject: [FPSPACE] Fwd: [New post] A Possible Approach to the Transnational History of Spaceflight Message-ID: ---------- Sent from AT&T Wireless using Windows Live Hotmail -----Original Message----- From: Roger Launius's Blog Sent: 10/17/2011 6:03:43 PM To: ljk4 at msn.com Subject: [New post] A Possible Approach to the Transnational History of Spaceflight New post on Roger Launius's Blog [http://1.gravatar.com/blavatar/5ab615dc2687e96bf21dc4fa4be2f3ff?s=32&ts=1318874623] [http://0.gravatar.com/avatar/488baba4b54ec638fa19eeebd09b6b69?s=50&d=identicon&r=G] A Possible Approach to the Transnational History of Spaceflight by launiusr My colleague, Andrew Jenks of the California State University, Long Beach, has been working on ideas of human spaceflight in the context of transnational history. While his thoughts are still formative, he has developed some for a Russian History Blog. I recommend these ideas to anyone with an interest. They may be accessed at: http://russianhistoryblog.org/2011/10/transnational-history-and-space-flight/ Comments are welcome. launiusr | October 17, 2011 at 6:03 pm | Tags: transnational | Categories: History, Politics, Space | URL: http://wp.me/pwYu1-DN Comment See all comments Unsubscribe or change your email settings at Manage Subscriptions. Trouble clicking? Copy and paste this URL into your browser: http://launiusr.wordpress.com/2011/10/17/a-possible-approach-to-the-transnational-history-of-spaceflight/ Thanks for flying with [http://s.wordpress.com/i/emails/wp-footericon.png] WordPress.com -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From ljk4 at msn.com Tue Oct 18 08:09:15 2011 From: ljk4 at msn.com (LARRY KLAES ) Date: Tue, 18 Oct 2011 12:09:15 +0000 Subject: [FPSPACE] Fwd: [NOVA] "Finding Life Beyond Earth" Message-ID: ---------- Sent from AT&T Wireless using Windows Live Hotmail -----Original Message----- From: NOVA Sent: 10/18/2011 12:02:21 PM To: ljk4 at msn.com Subject: [NOVA] "Finding Life Beyond Earth" If you have trouble viewing this email, read the online version. [http://images.nationalproduction.wgbh.org/EloquaImages/clients/WGBHNationalSites/{8175cab8-09c2-4412-82d9-06de233bd5af}_novabanner.jpg] NOVA PRESENTS Finding Life Beyond Earth: A two-hour special Airing Wednesday October 19 at 9pm ET/PT on PBS (Check local listings) Watch a preview [http://images.nationalproduction.wgbh.org/EloquaImages/clients/WGBHNationalSites/{81128d45-6fe8-4ff0-98c0-5e4bf0aba7f9}_finding-life-beyond-earth-main.jpg] [http://images.nationalproduction.wgbh.org/EloquaImages/clients/WGBHNationalSites/%7Ba3345900-6fd4-4a2a-aba5-2cfbcbd90e67%7D_twitter.png] TWITTER [http://images.nationalproduction.wgbh.org/EloquaImages/clients/WGBHNationalSites/%7B7104f04e-cc2e-4249-9704-803e75b1487d%7D_facebook.png] FACEBOOK [http://images.nationalproduction.wgbh.org/EloquaImages/clients/WGBHNationalSites/%7B06430d46-c4bd-449d-9ff1-b7ab6b828c80%7D_itunes.png] ITUNES [http://images.nationalproduction.wgbh.org/EloquaImages/clients/WGBHNationalSites/%7Bcdc57764-82a7-4d7e-9b2a-6e614b5f1124%7D_youtube.png] YOUTUBE [http://images.nationalproduction.wgbh.org/EloquaImages/clients/WGBHNationalSites/%7Ba363a99b-d5d5-4099-a52b-01d891c0b535%7D_rss.png] RSS [http://images.nationalproduction.wgbh.org/EloquaImages/clients/WGBHNationalSites/%7B648fc06b-8541-4520-a670-eff1ca37b0e7%7D_insidenova.png] INSIDE NOVA Take a spectacular trip to distant realms of our solar system to discover where secret forms of life may lie hidden. Combining the latest telescope images with dazzling animation, this program immerses audiences in the sights and sounds of alien worlds, while top astrobiologists explain how these places are changing how we think about the potential for life in our solar system. We used to think our neighboring planets and moons were fairly boring-mostly cold, dead rocks where life could never take hold. Today, however, the solar system looks wilder than we ever imagined. WEB FEATURES Watch a Preview Watch a preview of the program online now. Tour the Solar System Explore the planets, visit the moon, and gaze at the stars in this 3-D interactive model of the solar system. ________________________________ Findin[http://images.nationalproduction.wgbh.org/EloquaImages/clients/WGBHNationalSites/%7B3eeffd50-c29e-4c92-ba5a-abffc863d00d%7D_finding-life-beyond-earth-ecarddvd.jpg]g Life Beyond Earth is now available on DVD from ShopPBS.org. NOVA email subscribers get an exclusive offer of 20% off your entire order. Enter promotion code NOVAPBS at checkout to receive your discount. Cannot be combined with other offers. Offer valid through 11/30/11. ________________________________ The Spacetime Lemonade Stand NOVA asked people near the MIT campus to explain spacetime in exchange for free lemonade. See what they said. Have you got your own explanation for spacetime? Post your videos on our Facebook page. ________________________________ Become a NOVA and NOVA scienceNOW fan on Facebook, follow us on Twitter, and subscribe to our YouTube channel. ________________________________ Thank you for your interest in NOVA. We welcome your questions, comments, and feedback. You can send a message directly to nova at wgbh.org, or use our feedback form. Funding for NOVA is provided by David H. Koch, the Howard Hughes Medical Institute, the Corporation for Public Broadcasting, and PBS viewers. [http://images.nationalproduction.wgbh.org/EloquaImages/clients/WGBHNationalSites/%7B146e2c6a-82d8-4a79-8ded-d54185694190%7D_26552.png] [http://images.nationalproduction.wgbh.org/EloquaImages/clients/WGBHNationalSites/%7B694257b7-2349-4791-a7b6-1d981af0a964%7D_26553.png] [http://images.nationalproduction.wgbh.org/EloquaImages/clients/WGBHNationalSites/%7B051ac55a-dce0-4251-be35-de17a2492b0b%7D_26554.png] You are receiving this e-mail because you subscribed to the NOVA Newsletter. If you wish to unsubscribe from similar email communications, click here. If you wish to unsubscribe from all email, click here. Please do not reply to this email. If you have feedback, please visit www.pbs.org/wgbh/nova/feedback/. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From japio at dds.nl Thu Oct 20 03:50:44 2011 From: japio at dds.nl (Jakob Terweij) Date: Thu, 20 Oct 2011 09:50:44 +0200 Subject: [FPSPACE] new russian first Message-ID: <20111020095044.4joxa838tzc48o4k@webmail.dds.nl> When everything will go okay Russia will have a first today. From Kourou French Guyana will be launched for the first time a Russian build Soyuz rocket model CT with Gallileo satellite on board so this will be a first for Roskosmos and Starsem new Jakob Terweij j van Lennepstraat 249C 1053 JD Amsterdam +31651549606 From lucspace at hotmail.com Thu Oct 20 04:09:32 2011 From: lucspace at hotmail.com (Luc van den Abeelen) Date: Thu, 20 Oct 2011 10:09:32 +0200 Subject: [FPSPACE] new russian first In-Reply-To: <20111020095044.4joxa838tzc48o4k@webmail.dds.nl> References: <20111020095044.4joxa838tzc48o4k@webmail.dds.nl> Message-ID: The thing is, and I only noticed this a couple of days ago, that this is not a Starsem mission, but purely Arianespace. What is behind this shift? Cheers, Luc > Date: Thu, 20 Oct 2011 09:50:44 +0200 > From: japio at dds.nl > To: fpspace at friends-partners.org > Subject: [FPSPACE] new russian first > > > When everything will go okay Russia will have a first today. > From Kourou French Guyana will be launched for the first time a > Russian build Soyuz rocket model CT with Gallileo satellite on board > so this will be a first for Roskosmos and Starsem > > > new > > Jakob Terweij > j van Lennepstraat 249C > 1053 JD Amsterdam > +31651549606 > > _______________________________________________ > FPSPACE mailing list > FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org > http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From japio at dds.nl Thu Oct 20 04:32:42 2011 From: japio at dds.nl (Jakob Terweij) Date: Thu, 20 Oct 2011 10:32:42 +0200 Subject: [FPSPACE] new russian first In-Reply-To: References: <20111020095044.4joxa838tzc48o4k@webmail.dds.nl> Message-ID: <20111020103242.zi66nszlq9a88sgw@webmail.dds.nl> The launch is at 14.24 hrs MSK(is that local time?) and on the site of roscosmos.ru is a direct feed where you can watch the launch. And Luc about your comment i also dont understand so if Gallileo is launched on a soyuz in Baikonur it is a Starsem launch, now it is the same but in Kourou and suddenly it is Arianespace. interesting! jakob Quoting Luc van den Abeelen : > > The thing is, and I only noticed this a couple of days ago, that > this is not a Starsem mission, but purely Arianespace. What is > behind this shift? > > Cheers, > Luc > >> Date: Thu, 20 Oct 2011 09:50:44 +0200 >> From: japio at dds.nl >> To: fpspace at friends-partners.org >> Subject: [FPSPACE] new russian first >> >> >> When everything will go okay Russia will have a first today. >> From Kourou French Guyana will be launched for the first time a >> Russian build Soyuz rocket model CT with Gallileo satellite on board >> so this will be a first for Roskosmos and Starsem >> >> >> new >> >> Jakob Terweij >> j van Lennepstraat 249C >> 1053 JD Amsterdam >> +31651549606 >> >> _______________________________________________ >> FPSPACE mailing list >> FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org >> http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace > Jakob Terweij j van Lennepstraat 249C 1053 JD Amsterdam +31651549606 From nikolai39 at hotmail.fr Thu Oct 20 05:21:41 2011 From: nikolai39 at hotmail.fr (Nicolas PILLET) Date: Thu, 20 Oct 2011 11:21:41 +0200 Subject: [FPSPACE] new russian first In-Reply-To: <20111020103242.zi66nszlq9a88sgw@webmail.dds.nl> References: <20111020095044.4joxa838tzc48o4k@webmail.dds.nl>, , <20111020103242.zi66nszlq9a88sgw@webmail.dds.nl> Message-ID: STARSEM had been created only to launch Soyouz from Baykonur. When it is launched from French Guyane, it is under direct responsibility of Arianespace. And please note that th e launch pad is not at all in Kourou. It is in the territory of a city called Sinnamary, which is pretty far away from Kourou... > Date: Thu, 20 Oct 2011 10:32:42 +0200 > From: japio at dds.nl > To: lucspace at hotmail.com > CC: fpspace at friends-partners.org > Subject: Re: [FPSPACE] new russian first > > > The launch is at 14.24 hrs MSK(is that local time?) and on the site of > roscosmos.ru is a direct feed where you can watch the launch. > And Luc about your comment i also dont understand so if Gallileo is > launched on a soyuz in Baikonur it is a Starsem launch, now it is the > same but in Kourou and suddenly it is Arianespace. > interesting! > jakob > > > > > > Quoting Luc van den Abeelen : > > > > > The thing is, and I only noticed this a couple of days ago, that > > this is not a Starsem mission, but purely Arianespace. What is > > behind this shift? > > > > Cheers, > > Luc > > > >> Date: Thu, 20 Oct 2011 09:50:44 +0200 > >> From: japio at dds.nl > >> To: fpspace at friends-partners.org > >> Subject: [FPSPACE] new russian first > >> > >> > >> When everything will go okay Russia will have a first today. > >> From Kourou French Guyana will be launched for the first time a > >> Russian build Soyuz rocket model CT with Gallileo satellite on board > >> so this will be a first for Roskosmos and Starsem > >> > >> > >> new > >> > >> Jakob Terweij > >> j van Lennepstraat 249C > >> 1053 JD Amsterdam > >> +31651549606 > >> > >> _______________________________________________ > >> FPSPACE mailing list > >> FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org > >> http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace > > > > > > > > > Jakob Terweij > j van Lennepstraat 249C > 1053 JD Amsterdam > +31651549606 > > _______________________________________________ > FPSPACE mailing list > FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org > http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From agzak at optonline.net Thu Oct 20 05:49:10 2011 From: agzak at optonline.net (Anatoly Zak) Date: Thu, 20 Oct 2011 05:49:10 -0400 Subject: [FPSPACE] new russian first In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Geographically, the Soyuz pad is in Sinnamary, but by all other accounts, (historical and technical) it is an extension of the Guiana space center, which is, of course, in Kourou. It is similar to the situation of the Statue of Liberty, which is inseparable from the history of New York and tourists are often surprised, that it is (geographically and administratively) in New Jersey. Anatoly Zak http://www.russianspaceweb.com On 10/20/11 5:21 AM, "Nicolas PILLET" wrote: > And please note that th e launch pad is not at all in Kourou. It is in the > territory of a city called Sinnamary, which is pretty far away from Kourou... > >> > Date: Thu, 20 Oct 2011 10:32:42 +0200 >> > From: japio at dds.nl >> > To: lucspace at hotmail.com >> > CC: fpspace at friends-partners.org >> > Subject: Re: [FPSPACE] new russian first >> > >> > >> > The launch is at 14.24 hrs MSK(is that local time?) and on the site of >> > roscosmos.ru is a direct feed where you can watch the launch. >> > And Luc about your comment i also dont understand so if Gallileo is >> > launched on a soyuz in Baikonur it is a Starsem launch, now it is the >> > same but in Kourou and suddenly it is Arianespace. >> > interesting! >> > jakob >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > Quoting Luc van den Abeelen : >> > >>> > > >>> > > The thing is, and I only noticed this a couple of days ago, that >>> > > this is not a Starsem mission, but purely Arianespace. What is >>> > > behind this shift? >>> > > >>> > > Cheers, >>> > > Luc >>> > > >>>> > >> Date: Thu, 20 Oct 2011 09:50:44 +0200 >>>> > >> From: japio at dds.nl >>>> > >> To: fpspace at friends-partners.org >>>> > >> Subject: [FPSPACE] new russian first >>>> > >> >>>> > >> >>>> > >> When everything will go okay Russia will have a first today. >>>> > >> From Kourou French Guyana will be launched for the first time a >>>> > >> Russian build Soyuz rocket model CT with Gallileo satellite on board >>>> > >> so this will be a first for Roskosmos and Starsem >>>> > >> >>>> > >> >>>> > >> new >>>> > >> >>>> > >> Jakob Terweij >>>> > >> j van Lennepstraat 249C >>>> > >> 1053 JD Amsterdam >>>> > >> +31651549606 >>>> > >> >>>> > >> _______________________________________________ >>>> > >> FPSPACE mailing list >>>> > >> FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org >>>> > >> http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace >>> > > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > Jakob Terweij >> > j van Lennepstraat 249C >> > 1053 JD Amsterdam >> > +31651549606 >> > >> > _______________________________________________ >> > FPSPACE mailing list >> > FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org >> > http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace > > > > _______________________________________________ > FPSPACE mailing list > FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org > http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From odibusman at gmail.com Thu Oct 20 06:41:14 2011 From: odibusman at gmail.com (Odi Busman) Date: Thu, 20 Oct 2011 12:41:14 +0200 Subject: [FPSPACE] new russian first In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Dear Friends Latest news is that the Galileo launch for today is postponed for 24hrs. Greetings Odi 2011/10/20 Anatoly Zak > Geographically, the Soyuz pad is in Sinnamary, but by all other accounts, > (historical and technical) it is an extension of the Guiana space center, > which is, of course, in Kourou. It is similar to the situation of the Statue > of Liberty, which is inseparable from the history of New York and tourists > are often surprised, that it is (geographically and administratively) in New > Jersey. > > Anatoly Zak > http://www.russianspaceweb.com > > > > On 10/20/11 5:21 AM, "Nicolas PILLET" wrote: > > And please note that th e launch pad is not at all in Kourou. It is in the > territory of a city called Sinnamary, which is pretty far away from > Kourou... > > > Date: Thu, 20 Oct 2011 10:32:42 +0200 > > From: japio at dds.nl > > To: lucspace at hotmail.com > > CC: fpspace at friends-partners.org > > Subject: Re: [FPSPACE] new russian first > > > > > > The launch is at 14.24 hrs MSK(is that local time?) and on the site of > > roscosmos.ru is a direct feed where you can watch the launch. > > And Luc about your comment i also dont understand so if Gallileo is > > launched on a soyuz in Baikonur it is a Starsem launch, now it is the > > same but in Kourou and suddenly it is Arianespace. > > interesting! > > jakob > > > > > > > > > > > > Quoting Luc van den Abeelen : > > > > > > > > The thing is, and I only noticed this a couple of days ago, that > > > this is not a Starsem mission, but purely Arianespace. What is > > > behind this shift? > > > > > > Cheers, > > > Luc > > > > > >> Date: Thu, 20 Oct 2011 09:50:44 +0200 > > >> From: japio at dds.nl > > >> To: fpspace at friends-partners.org > > >> Subject: [FPSPACE] new russian first > > >> > > >> > > >> When everything will go okay Russia will have a first today. > > >> From Kourou French Guyana will be launched for the first time a > > >> Russian build Soyuz rocket model CT with Gallileo satellite on board > > >> so this will be a first for Roskosmos and Starsem > > >> > > >> > > >> new > > >> > > >> Jakob Terweij > > >> j van Lennepstraat 249C > > >> 1053 JD Amsterdam > > >> +31651549606 > > >> > > >> _______________________________________________ > > >> FPSPACE mailing list > > >> FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org > > >> http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Jakob Terweij > > j van Lennepstraat 249C > > 1053 JD Amsterdam > > +31651549606 > > > > _______________________________________________ > > FPSPACE mailing list > > FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org > > http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace > > > ------------------------------ > _______________________________________________ > FPSPACE mailing list > FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org > http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace > > > _______________________________________________ > FPSPACE mailing list > FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org > http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace > > -- Studio Odi Busman Jacob van Lennepkade 257-3 1054 ZT Amsterdam +31 (0)6 10 35 44 24 www.odibusman.com www.google.com -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From cpgorski at gmail.com Thu Oct 20 11:00:40 2011 From: cpgorski at gmail.com (Christopher Gorski) Date: Thu, 20 Oct 2011 11:00:40 -0400 Subject: [FPSPACE] new russian first In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Is this the booster that they want to see succeed before they'll launch another manned Soyuz? Or does this have a different upper stage, and there's another launch coming up this month from Baikonur? Anybody know the cause of the delay? --me On Thu, Oct 20, 2011 at 6:41 AM, Odi Busman wrote: > Dear Friends > > Latest news is that the Galileo launch for today is postponed for 24hrs. > > Greetings > Odi > > 2011/10/20 Anatoly Zak > >> Geographically, the Soyuz pad is in Sinnamary, but by all other >> accounts, (historical and technical) it is an extension of the Guiana space >> center, which is, of course, in Kourou. It is similar to the situation of >> the Statue of Liberty, which is inseparable from the history of New York and >> tourists are often surprised, that it is (geographically and >> administratively) in New Jersey. >> >> Anatoly Zak >> http://www.russianspaceweb.com >> >> >> >> On 10/20/11 5:21 AM, "Nicolas PILLET" wrote: >> >> And please note that th e launch pad is not at all in Kourou. It is in the >> territory of a city called Sinnamary, which is pretty far away from >> Kourou... >> >> > Date: Thu, 20 Oct 2011 10:32:42 +0200 >> > From: japio at dds.nl >> > To: lucspace at hotmail.com >> > CC: fpspace at friends-partners.org >> > Subject: Re: [FPSPACE] new russian first >> > >> > >> > The launch is at 14.24 hrs MSK(is that local time?) and on the site of >> > roscosmos.ru is a direct feed where you can watch the launch. >> > And Luc about your comment i also dont understand so if Gallileo is >> > launched on a soyuz in Baikonur it is a Starsem launch, now it is the >> > same but in Kourou and suddenly it is Arianespace. >> > interesting! >> > jakob >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > Quoting Luc van den Abeelen : >> > >> > > >> > > The thing is, and I only noticed this a couple of days ago, that >> > > this is not a Starsem mission, but purely Arianespace. What is >> > > behind this shift? >> > > >> > > Cheers, >> > > Luc >> > > >> > >> Date: Thu, 20 Oct 2011 09:50:44 +0200 >> > >> From: japio at dds.nl >> > >> To: fpspace at friends-partners.org >> > >> Subject: [FPSPACE] new russian first >> > >> >> > >> >> > >> When everything will go okay Russia will have a first today. >> > >> From Kourou French Guyana will be launched for the first time a >> > >> Russian build Soyuz rocket model CT with Gallileo satellite on board >> > >> so this will be a first for Roskosmos and Starsem >> > >> >> > >> >> > >> new >> > >> >> > >> Jakob Terweij >> > >> j van Lennepstraat 249C >> > >> 1053 JD Amsterdam >> > >> +31651549606 >> > >> >> > >> _______________________________________________ >> > >> FPSPACE mailing list >> > >> FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org >> > >> http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace >> > > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > Jakob Terweij >> > j van Lennepstraat 249C >> > 1053 JD Amsterdam >> > +31651549606 >> > >> > _______________________________________________ >> > FPSPACE mailing list >> > FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org >> > http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace >> >> >> ------------------------------ >> _______________________________________________ >> FPSPACE mailing list >> FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org >> http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> FPSPACE mailing list >> FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org >> http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace >> >> > > > -- > Studio Odi Busman > Jacob van Lennepkade 257-3 > 1054 ZT Amsterdam > +31 (0)6 10 35 44 24 > www.odibusman.com > www.google.com > > > > _______________________________________________ > FPSPACE mailing list > FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org > http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From nikolai39 at hotmail.fr Thu Oct 20 11:04:30 2011 From: nikolai39 at hotmail.fr (Nicolas PILLET) Date: Thu, 20 Oct 2011 17:04:30 +0200 Subject: [FPSPACE] new russian first In-Reply-To: References: , , , Message-ID: This launcher has a different third stage, which uses RD-0124 engine instead of older RD-0110 (the one that failed). From: cpgorski at gmail.com Date: Thu, 20 Oct 2011 11:00:40 -0400 To: odibusman at gmail.com CC: fpspace at friends-partners.org Subject: Re: [FPSPACE] new russian first Is this the booster that they want to see succeed before they'll launch another manned Soyuz? Or does this have a different upper stage, and there's another launch coming up this month from Baikonur? Anybody know the cause of the delay? --me On Thu, Oct 20, 2011 at 6:41 AM, Odi Busman wrote: Dear Friends Latest news is that the Galileo launch for today is postponed for 24hrs. GreetingsOdi 2011/10/20 Anatoly Zak Geographically, the Soyuz pad is in Sinnamary, but by all other accounts, (historical and technical) it is an extension of the Guiana space center, which is, of course, in Kourou. It is similar to the situation of the Statue of Liberty, which is inseparable from the history of New York and tourists are often surprised, that it is (geographically and administratively) in New Jersey. Anatoly Zak http://www.russianspaceweb.com On 10/20/11 5:21 AM, "Nicolas PILLET" wrote: And please note that th e launch pad is not at all in Kourou. It is in the territory of a city called Sinnamary, which is pretty far away from Kourou... > Date: Thu, 20 Oct 2011 10:32:42 +0200 > From: japio at dds.nl > To: lucspace at hotmail.com > CC: fpspace at friends-partners.org > Subject: Re: [FPSPACE] new russian first > > > The launch is at 14.24 hrs MSK(is that local time?) and on the site of > roscosmos.ru is a direct feed where you can watch the launch. > And Luc about your comment i also dont understand so if Gallileo is > launched on a soyuz in Baikonur it is a Starsem launch, now it is the > same but in Kourou and suddenly it is Arianespace. > interesting! > jakob > > > > > > Quoting Luc van den Abeelen : > > > > > The thing is, and I only noticed this a couple of days ago, that > > this is not a Starsem mission, but purely Arianespace. What is > > behind this shift? > > > > Cheers, > > Luc > > > >> Date: Thu, 20 Oct 2011 09:50:44 +0200 > >> From: japio at dds.nl > >> To: fpspace at friends-partners.org > >> Subject: [FPSPACE] new russian first > >> > >> > >> When everything will go okay Russia will have a first today. > >> From Kourou French Guyana will be launched for the first time a > >> Russian build Soyuz rocket model CT with Gallileo satellite on board > >> so this will be a first for Roskosmos and Starsem > >> > >> > >> new > >> > >> Jakob Terweij > >> j van Lennepstraat 249C > >> 1053 JD Amsterdam > >> +31651549606 > >> > >> _______________________________________________ > >> FPSPACE mailing list > >> FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org > >> http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace > > > > > > > > > Jakob Terweij > j van Lennepstraat 249C > 1053 JD Amsterdam > +31651549606 > > _______________________________________________ > FPSPACE mailing list > FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org > http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace _______________________________________________ FPSPACE mailing list FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace _______________________________________________ FPSPACE mailing list FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace -- Studio Odi Busman Jacob van Lennepkade 257-31054 ZT Amsterdam +31 (0)6 10 35 44 24 www.odibusman.com www.google.com _______________________________________________ FPSPACE mailing list FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace _______________________________________________ FPSPACE mailing list FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From agzak at optonline.net Thu Oct 20 11:21:09 2011 From: agzak at optonline.net (Anatoly Zak) Date: Thu, 20 Oct 2011 11:21:09 -0400 Subject: [FPSPACE] new russian first In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On the cause of the delay: http://www.russianspaceweb.com/galileo.html Anatoly Zak On 10/20/11 11:00 AM, "Christopher Gorski" wrote: > Is this the booster that they want to see succeed before they'll launch > another manned Soyuz?? Or does this have a different upper stage, and there's > another launch coming up this month from Baikonur? > > Anybody know the cause of the delay? > > --me > > > > On Thu, Oct 20, 2011 at 6:41 AM, Odi Busman wrote: >> Dear Friends >> >> Latest news is that the Galileo launch for today is postponed for 24hrs. >> >> Greetings >> Odi >> >> 2011/10/20 Anatoly Zak >>> Geographically, the Soyuz pad is in Sinnamary, but by all other accounts, >>> (historical and technical) it is an extension of the Guiana space center, >>> which is, of course, in Kourou. It is similar to the situation of the Statue >>> of Liberty, which is inseparable from the history of New York and tourists >>> are often surprised, that it is (geographically and administratively) in New >>> Jersey. ? >>> >>> Anatoly Zak >>> http://www.russianspaceweb.com >>> >>> >>> >>> On 10/20/11 5:21 AM, "Nicolas PILLET" wrote: >>> >>>> And please note that th e launch pad is not at all in Kourou. It is in the >>>> territory of a city called Sinnamary, which is pretty far away from >>>> Kourou... >>>> >>>>> > Date: Thu, 20 Oct 2011 10:32:42 +0200 >>>>> > From: japio at dds.nl >>>>> > To: lucspace at hotmail.com >>>>> > CC: fpspace at friends-partners.org >>>>> > Subject: Re: [FPSPACE] new russian first >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > The launch is at 14.24 hrs MSK(is that local time?) and on the site of ? >>>>> > roscosmos.ru is a direct feed where you can watch >>>>> the launch. >>>>> > And Luc about your comment i also dont understand so if Gallileo is ? >>>>> > launched on a soyuz in Baikonur it is a Starsem launch, now it is the ? >>>>> > same but in Kourou and suddenly it is Arianespace. >>>>> > interesting! >>>>> > jakob >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > Quoting Luc van den Abeelen : >>>>> > >>>>>> > > >>>>>> > > The thing is, and I only noticed this a couple of days ago, that ?? >>>>>> > > this is not a Starsem mission, but purely Arianespace. What is ?? >>>>>> > > behind this shift? >>>>>> > > >>>>>> > > Cheers, >>>>>> > > Luc >>>>>> > > >>>>>>> > >> Date: Thu, 20 Oct 2011 09:50:44 +0200 >>>>>>> > >> From: japio at dds.nl >>>>>>> > >> To: fpspace at friends-partners.org >>>>>>> > >> Subject: [FPSPACE] new russian first >>>>>>> > >> >>>>>>> > >> >>>>>>> > >> When everything will go okay Russia will have a first today. >>>>>>> > >> ?From Kourou French Guyana will be launched for the first time a >>>>>>> > >> Russian build Soyuz rocket model CT with Gallileo satellite on >>>>>>> board >>>>>>> > >> so this will be a first for Roskosmos and Starsem >>>>>>> > >> >>>>>>> > >> >>>>>>> > >> new >>>>>>> > >> >>>>>>> > >> Jakob Terweij >>>>>>> > >> j van Lennepstraat 249C >>>>>>> > >> 1053 JD Amsterdam >>>>>>> > >> +31651549606 >>>>>>> > >> >>>>>>> > >> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>> > >> FPSPACE mailing list >>>>>>> > >> FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org >>>>>>> > >> http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace >>>>>> > > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > Jakob Terweij >>>>> > j van Lennepstraat 249C >>>>> > 1053 JD Amsterdam >>>>> > +31651549606 >>>>> > >>>>> > _______________________________________________ >>>>> > FPSPACE mailing list >>>>> > FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org >>>>> > http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace >>>> ??????? >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> FPSPACE mailing list >>>> FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org >>>> http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> FPSPACE mailing list >>>> FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org >>>> http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace >>>> >>>> >>>> -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From jameseoberg at comcast.net Fri Oct 21 00:53:44 2011 From: jameseoberg at comcast.net (James E Oberg) Date: Thu, 20 Oct 2011 23:53:44 -0500 Subject: [FPSPACE] Plesetsk history -- 1918-9 American troops in battle near there Message-ID: <807E4C36BE6E41A0886C7CE32BE07F1C@ownerfbf08f40c> I'd sure like to visit Plesetsk some day, and even lay flowers at the nearby American graves.... Yesterday in Pravda, a good historical overview of the Allied interventionists who battled Bolsheviks in the area that became the Plesetsk cosmodrome [and also see the spirited reader comments] -- here ??????????? ????? ?????????? ? ???? 19.10.2011 // ?????? ???????? http://www.pravda.ru/society/fashion/models/19-10-2011/1095811-pleseck-0/ I added this comment: ??? ????? ?????? ????? ? ?????????? ? ???? ????????: This is the best book in English about this campaign: http://www.amazon.com/Ignorant-Armies-M-Halliday/dp/0553284568/ref=cm_cr_pr_product_top -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From kgottschalk at uwc.ac.za Fri Oct 21 07:18:41 2011 From: kgottschalk at uwc.ac.za (Keith Gottschalk) Date: Fri, 21 Oct 2011 13:18:41 +0200 Subject: [FPSPACE] Cape Town 62nd International Astronautical Congress References: <4E984677020000A600013D93@uwc.ac.za> <4E984D7A020000A600013DAE@uwc.ac.za> <4E98514D020000A600013DBF@uwc.ac.za> <4E9C24BE020000A600013ED5@uwc.ac.za> <4EA15964020000A6000142D3@uwc.ac.za> <4EA1674F020000A6000142F1@uwc.ac.za> <4EA16B4E020000A6000142F5@uwc.ac.za> <4EA17131020000A6000142FF@uwc.ac.za> Message-ID: <4EA17131020000A6000142FF@uwc.ac.za> For Friends who have not the time nor inclination to read through all of this, I give it headings so you can scroll down to the section of interest to you. 62nd INTERNATIONAL ASTRONAUTICAL CONGRESS RLVs & NEW HEAVY LIFT LAUNCHERS AFRICA - LATE ENTRANTS INTO SPACE 62nd INTERNATIONAL ASTRONAUTICAL CONGRESS We South Africans can be proud of this smooth-running 62nd IAC, the first to be held in Africa. Catering was much more convenient & budget-priced than in the previous IACs in Korea or Prague. We had umpteen kiosks scattered along each of the three floors of the Convention Centre. All told, we had 2 900 delegates. They had a great time on the tourism side: none were mugged, refuting the sensationalist western media. So Cape Town will enjoy good word of mouth recommendations. As a South African, I was pleased to see more black persons than ever before, including 500 delegates from across Africa, from Tunisia to Nigeria, Kenya, & my own country. The IAF were able to sponsor 32 individuals from 27 developing countries, mostly in Africa. It is also a sign of the 21st century that even when the number of "accompanying persons" plunged from 500 to 217 when a E 50 fee was introduced, the number of women participants was still noticeably higher than at Korea or Prague. Many of C4.2 on Hypersonic & Combined Cycle Propulsion, for example, were women PhD & MSc students presenting their work on scramjets at China's National University of Defence Technology. The Women in Aerospace club launched its African chapter. All told, we had 391 students & 260 young professionals. One third of delegates were under 35 yrs old, to balance the white-haired veterans like myself. Other statistics of the organizers are that 30 000 cups of coffee were drunk (we have the vouchers to prove that). The exhibition was so small that it only filled Hall 4 of the four exhibition halls that form an integral part of Cape Town's International Convention Centre. But I do not think that we South Africans should be too hard on ourselves for that. This is the second worst depression in world history for space budgets. An agency or corporation would rather cut exhibition costs than retrench personnel. South Africa is a long haul destination, making transport costs worse for flying crates round the globe. NASA had initially offered us a fullscale model of the James Web IR telescope, but in the end could not get the transport budget. Instead the NASA stand [provided free popcorn. You can't get more American than that. & we got an Apollo 17 moonrock to touch. Also, in an internet age, agencies & corporations are less inclined to set up stands with physical models & brochures than in earlier decades. The Chinese space agency did not come, nor did its head grace the heads of agency meeting. ISRO sent not its director, but a substitute, & downsized its exhibition stall to a small counter with a man handing out brochures in front of two desktop brass (not aluminium!) models of their PSLV & GSLV. The South African Dept. of Trade & Industry fortunately sponsored through its Aerospace Industry Support Initiative a complex of stalls for the small South African aerospace corporate sector. Our Dept. of S&T also sponsored a stall, & indirectly also the Square Kilometer Array which South Africans are rooting for. The IAC has grown to a complex of four back-to-back & overlapping conference,s crammed into eight days, by means of running up to nineteen technical sessions simultaneously. One consequence of this is that it can today only be accommodated in international convention centres run on business lines, where everything is priced at corporate levels, for those on private sector remuneration, where the employer often pays. So time & again the IAC organizers are compelled to calculate, in a reality where everything is priced in so many $s per square metre per day, if there will be enough full fee delegates at that specific event to justify it being split off another session or event. Just like airline accountants looking at the business class versus cattle class ratios. Since a proportion of IAC delegates will be pensioners like myself, or students, that means revenue per sq. metre may veto nice-to-have events or sessions. One such casualty is that it would be truly enjoyable to have a sponsored artists or cultural zone, like the current student zone. This would enable painters of the International Association of Astronomical Artists to exhibit their planetscapes & spacescapes, & others to stage performance art, since almost none of them are on corporate level remuneration. That is over to future IAF excos to debate for subsidy per sq. metre. The only way I can think of a future IAC being less burdened by financial overheads is that of course university campuses can accommodate three thousand delegates attending twenty simultaneous lectures. While universities regard conferences as third-stream income, they can charge much less than international convention centres for both conferences & modest accommodation. But this would require IAC to give up the symbolism of meeting during world space week - Sputnik & IGY! - & instead convene during either June-July, or Dec-Jan, which is when the universities of both north & south have their vacations. RLVs & NEW HEAVY LIFT LAUNCHERS Session D2.4 Future Space Transportation Systems. Session C4.5 Hypersonic & Combined Cycle Propulsion. FPSPACE recently carried many expressions of regret about the de facto cancellation of the RUS-M launcher. Simultaneously, IAC sessions on heavy-lift and future launchers showed many no-shows or withdrawn papers. Of the papers given on heavy-lift launchers, their slides consisted of paintings drawn by computers, nothing that actually is built, save for the photo of the horizontal static testing of a 5-segment SRB derivative. Roger Launius (well-known to most of those reading this) gave a witty & well-researched paper on five failed decades of spaceplanes. He hilariously noted how all these RLV schemes "depended on being built of Unobtainium & required the suspension of three laws of physics". There was one honourable exception to the above two paragraphs. Mark Hempsell's paper: Progress on the Skylon & SABRE Development Programme. Reaction Engines has decided to build Skylon of not unobtainium, but a TiSiC matrix, to avoid the difficulties of binding carbon composites to Ti. Also, instead of waiting for the appropriate legislature to repeal three laws of physics, R.E. showed actual photos of actual light-weight heat exchangers built for the pre-cooling & deep cooling of air, to inject O2 into their rocket engine. R.E.'s main sponsors, the ESA, required R.E. to demonstrate that they could move from a lab to a prototype factory assembly line for mass production of the tens of thousands of 1 mm. diameter pipes in their lightweight HEXes, showing their consistency of quality control. (Sounds a bit like John Harrison having to prove to the Board of Longitude that his chronometers could be mass produced). He said they hoped to advance to a flying testbed by 2016, and would do 400 test flights of Skylon. Four hundred test flights sounds a lot to lay people. But of course, the first Skylon test flight might be merely accelerating & braking on the runway, to validate the steering & braking capabilities of its undercarriage. Its second testflight might be merely a few low circlings of the airfield, to validate its aerodynamic handling qualities, including bank and turn, at very low speeds. And who of us dare forget the sobering conclusions of the Commission of Enquiry into the Columbia tragedy: that even after 107 flights, every STS flight must still continue to be regarded as experimental, never routine. 400 test flights will certainly be what actuaries like to hear before underwriting insurance for Skylon cargo. AFRICA - LATE ENTRANTS INTO SPACE Budgetary realities mean that no one can expect to see Saturn 5 class rockets lifting off weekly from Africa during the rest of our lifetimes. What we are seeing is an exponential growth of Africa as a a consumer of space goods & services. Satellite operation centres, tens of millions of VSATs for sat TV, the growth of mobile phone banking, GPS services, are now part of the daily plumbing of life for our continent. Discovery Channel viewers need to remind themselves that about half of Africans are now urbanized, even if that is often in giant shanty towns. In some African countries such as South Africa, the proportion of the population suffering from obesity is today higher than the proportion suffering from malnutrition. The next step up the ladder from consumer of space services to production partners in a value chain has been taken by Algeria, Nigeria, & South Africa. All three now have national space agencies, & are now building their own microsats. The first two of those countries had a score or two of satellite engineers & technicians trained in France & the UK respectively; South Africa indigenously at Stellenbosch University (about 45 minutes driving east of my own University of the Western Cape). Also, across the road from my campus, lies the Cape Peninsula University of Technology, making cubesats or palmsats with French aid. A South African amateur launched South Africa's first liquid propulsion two stage rocket in 1959, pressure-fed; ablative. South Africa, and the other African countries, have yet to build their first regeneratively-cooled liquid propulsion engines, using the cryogenic propellants essential for high performance. At least one of them is going to take this step during this decade. See www dot marcom-as dot com We should realistically however, anticipate space budgets remaining flat until the current international depression lifts. Judging by 1929-34, that could still take another two or three yrs. At session on multi-lingual terminology, we announced the near-completion of Astronautical dictionaries in Afrikaans and Xhosa, two of the official languages in South Africa. I should mention that Afrikaans published a dictionary of Astronomical terms about two decades ago. In countries where multilingual policy is highly politicised, such symbolism can be key in winning the support of political decision-makers. For example, a decade ago, that South Africa's first microsat, Sunspace, broadcast a recording to all radio amateurs in Afrikaans thrilled the highest officers of Stellenbosch University, in whose Electronics lab it was built. Today the languages of our next microsat might be Xhosa & English, but its symbolic impact would be the same on those who decide the budgets. Africa's most significant achievements so far in multi-lateral space cooperation are: 1) the African Resources Management Constellation, an MoU for image & data sharing amongst Algeria, Kenya, Nigeria, & South Africa; 2) RASCOM, a continental parastatal with 45 state-owned national utilities buying & operating a comsat in GSO. We can expect both of these endeavours to grow, & new ones be founded. Should any Italians & Chinese be reading this, all the best for the next two IACs scheduled for Naples & Beijing. Even if I cannot get funding to attend, I shall be cheering you along. with warm regards, Keith. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- All Email originating from UWC is covered by disclaimer http://www.uwc.ac.za/emaildisclaimer From ljk4 at msn.com Fri Oct 21 07:54:14 2011 From: ljk4 at msn.com (LARRY KLAES ) Date: Fri, 21 Oct 2011 11:54:14 +0000 Subject: [FPSPACE] Fwd: [vsnet-chat 7737] Yuri Sergeevich Efimov (died 21.10.2011) Message-ID: ---------- Sent from AT&T Wireless using Windows Live Hotmail -----Original Message----- From: Ivan Andronov Sent: 10/21/2011 11:09:49 AM To: vsnet-chat at ooruri.kusastro.kyoto-u.ac.jp Subject: [vsnet-chat 7737] Yuri Sergeevich Efimov (died 21.10.2011) On October 21, 2011, died Yuri Sergeevich Efimov - a leading researcher, a great scientist, poet, a true Russian intellectual and remarkable person. His diploma was based on observations using the "Shain camera" at the Cat Mountain, Crimea. After graduating from the Sternberg Astronomical Institute of the Moscow State University, he began his work in the Crimean Astrophysical Observatory in 1958. More than half a century he successfully worked in the Laboratory of Physics of Stars and Galaxies, starting as a lab assistant to a leading researcher. Yuri Sergeevich was one of those who stood at the origins of polarimetry in astrophysics. The State Prize in the team of collaborators in the field of science and technology in 2010 was a legitimate award. In the ADS, the list of his works (Efimov, Yu.) contains 269 articles. They were devoted to magnetic and non-magnetic cataclysmic variables, Mira-type stars, active galactic nuclei and other leading directions. With many talents, Yuri was a center of cultural life of the Departments and of the Observatory, his beautiful poems decorated many cultural events and were published in a book and in press. Tragic death stopped his activity. The project of a spectropolarimeter orphaned; extensive archives of Nikolai Mikhailovich Shakhovskoj (1931-2011) remained untreated; Yuri Sergeevich will not see the printed version of the "Selected Works of Academician G.A. Shain", which he initiated. All who knew Yuri Sergeevich Efimov, who was infinitely devoted to our science and the observatory, will always keep on him a good and blessed memory. (translated from Russian) Leisurely is flight of Time All days and nights so much alike, The Time gives us a strong invoice For every moment and the choice. We always are in debt to Time. And my credit was spent, was fine. I can't return this debt, when live, Since Time appointed to me... =================================================== Russian version (based on the info from the Crimean Astrophysical Observatory) http://www.realsky.ru/community/uavso/viewpost/1661 The photo http://uavso.pochta.ru/Yu.S.Efimov(1935-2011).jpg The address for condolences: the scientific secretary of the Crimean Astrophysical Observatory alex-baklanov at mail.ru -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From ljk4 at msn.com Fri Oct 21 10:59:25 2011 From: ljk4 at msn.com (LARRY KLAES ) Date: Fri, 21 Oct 2011 14:59:25 +0000 Subject: [FPSPACE] Fwd: Latest from Cosmic Log Message-ID: ---------- Sent from AT&T Wireless using Windows Live Hotmail -----Original Message----- From: msnbc.com/Newsvine Sent: 10/21/2011 2:40:44 PM To: ljk4 at msn.com Subject: Latest from Cosmic Log Cosmic Log NASA: Pay the Americans now ... or pay the Russians later - Alan Boyle If NASA can't provide as much support for U.S. spaceship-builders as it's hoping for, it'll have to keep paying the Russians $450 million for every year of delay, the space agency's No. ________________________________ If you would like to change your e-mail communication preferences, you may modify your settings here or unsubscribe from all e-mails here. Msnbc.com / Newsvine, One Microsoft Way, Redmond, WA 98052 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From japio at dds.nl Fri Oct 21 14:15:52 2011 From: japio at dds.nl (Jakob Terweij) Date: Fri, 21 Oct 2011 20:15:52 +0200 Subject: [FPSPACE] Fwd: kourou Message-ID: <20111021201552.s0b4vurwyko4kgsg@webmail.dds.nl> -2 hours ago 19.00hrs Moscow time they showed here on the news a beautiful launch of Soyuz CT from Kourou. congratulations for this first flight from Kourou I think I drink know a well earned wodka (they have a lot of that here) jakob j van Lennepstraat 249C 1053 JD Amsterdam +31651549606 ----- Einde doorgestuurd bericht ----- Jakob Terweij j van Lennepstraat 249C 1053 JD Amsterdam +31651549606 From cdomashnev at acm.org Fri Oct 21 15:40:16 2011 From: cdomashnev at acm.org (Constantine A. Domashnev) Date: Fri, 21 Oct 2011 15:40:16 -0400 Subject: [FPSPACE] Fwd: kourou Message-ID: <001901cc9029$4a5009c0$0800a8c0@vosem> > 19.00hrs Moscow time they showed here on the news a beautiful launch of > Soyuz CT from Kourou. CNN.com: Soyuz rocket launched Friday after delay http://www.cnn.com/2011/10/21/world/europe/europe-soyuz-launch/ From drwoods at stny.rr.com Fri Oct 21 17:27:19 2011 From: drwoods at stny.rr.com (David R. Woods) Date: Fri, 21 Oct 2011 17:27:19 -0400 Subject: [FPSPACE] Kourou - more coverage Message-ID: <4EA1E3B7.2030501@stny.rr.com> http://tvroscosmos.ru/frm/kosmostv/vesti/2011/vesti211011.php -------- Original Message -------- Subject: [FPSPACE] Fwd: kourou Date: Fri, 21 Oct 2011 20:15:52 +0200 From: Jakob Terweij To: friends and partners -2 hours ago 19.00hrs Moscow time they showed here on the news a beautiful launch of Soyuz CT from Kourou. congratulations for this first flight from Kourou I think I drink know a well earned wodka (they have a lot of that here) Jakob Terweij j van Lennepstraat 249C 1053 JD Amsterdam +31651549606 From john at satcom.freeserve.co.uk Fri Oct 21 17:59:31 2011 From: john at satcom.freeserve.co.uk (Satcom) Date: Fri, 21 Oct 2011 22:59:31 +0100 Subject: [FPSPACE] ROSAT NOTAM Message-ID: <003201cc903c$b65d3120$6ed6fea9@DELLMASTER> The FAA has now issued a special notice relating to ROSAT.... You can view it here http://satcomuk.yolasite.com/satellites-due-to-re-enter.php John From ljk4 at msn.com Sat Oct 22 03:20:49 2011 From: ljk4 at msn.com (LARRY KLAES) Date: Sat, 22 Oct 2011 03:20:49 -0400 Subject: [FPSPACE] NASA Sets Guidelines to Preserve Apollo Moon Landing Sites Message-ID: NASA Sets Guidelines to Preserve Apollo Moon Landing Sites by Leonard David, SPACE.com?s Space Insider Columnist Date: 21 October 2011 Time: 06:00 AM ET LAS CRUCES, New Mexico ? NASA has begun drafting guidelines to protect the Apollo 11 and Apollo 17 landing sites, listing them as off-limits, and including ground-travel buffers and no-fly zones to avoid spraying rocket exhaust or dust onto aging, but historic, equipment. Robert Kelso, NASA?s director of lunar commercial services at Johnson Space Center in Houston, has taken a hard look at future revisits to the Apollo sites and how to protect U.S. government artifacts on the moon. Kelso has carved out a set of guidelines intended to safeguard the historic and scientific value of more than three dozen "heritage sites" on the lunar surface. Full article here: http://www.space.com/13346-nasa-guidelines-protect-apollo-moon-landing-sites.html -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From kgottschalk at uwc.ac.za Sun Oct 23 08:07:02 2011 From: kgottschalk at uwc.ac.za (Keith Gottschalk) Date: Sun, 23 Oct 2011 14:07:02 +0200 Subject: [FPSPACE] IAC & IPC Sias Mostert Message-ID: <4EA41F86020000A60001441A@uwc.ac.za> Dear Friends, lots of credit for the smooth running of the first International Astronautical Congress held in Africa must go to its International Programme Coordinator, the South African Sias Mostert. Sadly, right during the middle of the IAC, he had a stroke, from which he is slowly recovering in hospital. We can guess that the sheer stress & overwork of the past twelve months triggered off that stroke. Sias professionally was on the satellite engineering side of things. He was working with the Association of African Remote Sensing. - Keith -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- All Email originating from UWC is covered by disclaimer http://www.uwc.ac.za/emaildisclaimer From kgottschalk at uwc.ac.za Sun Oct 23 08:33:56 2011 From: kgottschalk at uwc.ac.za (Keith Gottschalk) Date: Sun, 23 Oct 2011 14:33:56 +0200 Subject: [FPSPACE] reflecting on the transition between ELVs & RLVs Message-ID: <4EA425D4020000A600014420@uwc.ac.za> The topic of RLVs always starts with deep skepticism & cynicism, due to five decades of broken promises & cancelled programmes. As with the Roger Launius paper that I referred to in an earlier posting. Judging by the other papers at relevant International Astronautical Congress sessions, here are a few reflections on what is going on right now. 1. It seems that between ELVs & RLVs, we might be entering a transitional era of PLVs - partially reusable vehicles. Continuing with coining more new acronyms, it seems these PLVs can be divided into two variants: 2. We seem to be going to have what may be called RRVs - reusable reentry vehicles. These typically take the form of a TSTO VTHOL. The STS is the most venerable of these. X-37B is proudly making its second flight as a distant descendant of the cancelled X-20 Dyna-Soar. The wingless Dragon, CST, & Orion, are all an advance on Mercury, Gemini & Apollo in more than size, in that the former three are all designed & built to be reusable. ISRO's proposed TSTO winged RLV is also more accurately called a RRV. 3. Another PLV variant is the fly-back booster - FBB. The STS's salvageable SRBs are a venerable halfway house to this, which has not yet been achieved. SpaceX has announced their intention to add landing legs to their Falcon 9. We all look forward to seeing if they get further than the Douglas Clipper & Kistler.... The combined result of the above engineering approaches could be significant reduction in cost per kg. to LEO, even if not a reduction in costs per flight of one magnitude. We will also see advances in TPS materials manufacturing, compared to the STS TPS, which dates from 1970s technology. - Keith -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- All Email originating from UWC is covered by disclaimer http://www.uwc.ac.za/emaildisclaimer From svengrahn at bahnhof.se Sun Oct 23 08:55:44 2011 From: svengrahn at bahnhof.se (Sven Grahn) Date: Sun, 23 Oct 2011 14:55:44 +0200 Subject: [FPSPACE] IAC & IPC Sias Mostert In-Reply-To: <4EA41F86020000A60001441A@uwc.ac.za> References: <4EA41F86020000A60001441A@uwc.ac.za> Message-ID: <01811AD103634FFA9ABE9322593CFCED@svempadator> Hope he recovers quickly. Met Sias a coiuple of times at the Small satellite Conference in Logon, Utah and at various IACs. Nice person. Sven ----- Original Message ----- From: Keith Gottschalk To: Friends & Partners FPSPACE Sent: Sunday, October 23, 2011 2:07 PM Subject: [FPSPACE] IAC & IPC Sias Mostert Dear Friends, lots of credit for the smooth running of the first International Astronautical Congress held in Africa must go to its International Programme Coordinator, the South African Sias Mostert. Sadly, right during the middle of the IAC, he had a stroke, from which he is slowly recovering in hospital. We can guess that the sheer stress & overwork of the past twelve months triggered off that stroke. Sias professionally was on the satellite engineering side of things. He was working with the Association of African Remote Sensing. - Keith ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ All Email originating from UWC is covered by disclaimer http://www.uwc.ac.za/emaildisclaimer ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ _______________________________________________ FPSPACE mailing list FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From jameseoberg at comcast.net Mon Oct 24 11:15:43 2011 From: jameseoberg at comcast.net (James E Oberg) Date: Mon, 24 Oct 2011 10:15:43 -0500 Subject: [FPSPACE] October 24 space anniversaries.... Message-ID: <6D3E546DE61E4DC59695692540F44D56@ownerfbf08f40c> Several news items today in the Kazakhstan press regarding the memorial events at Baykonur for the 1960 disaster. And there are more items, in the Russian media, about tomorrow's centennial of the birth of Mikhail Yangel. Yandex his name for links. ?? ????????? ?????? ???? ?????? ??????????? ?????????? http://inform.kz/rus/article/2414122 ???? ?????? ???????? ?????????? ???????? ?? ????????? 24 ??????? 2011, 11:26 // http://www.zakon.kz/kazakhstan/4454640-den-pamjati-pogibshikh-raketchikov.html ????, ????? ?? ???????? ?????? 24 ??????? 2011 ?. 10:58 http://blog.fontanka.ru/posts/84268/ http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=aezxBB9vFNs#! -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From pjp961 at svol.net Mon Oct 24 16:19:51 2011 From: pjp961 at svol.net (Peter Pesavento) Date: Mon, 24 Oct 2011 16:19:51 -0400 Subject: [FPSPACE] New Article on NASA dependence on Russia's rockets for transport to the ISS...apparently beyond 2016 Message-ID: <4ea5c87a.09f4640a.6dde.ffffb175@mx.google.com> >From the Orlando Sentinel http://www.orlandosentinel.com/news/space/os-nasa-russia-dependence-20111022 ,0,286459,full.story Also has commentary by our own fpspacer, Charles Vick... NASA may extend Russian contract to fly to space station By Mark K. Matthews, Washington Bureau 9:12 p.m. EDT, October 22, 2011 WASHINGTON - Top NASA officials are quietly working to extend a contract with Moscow that would continue using Russian rockets to fly U.S. astronauts into space until 2016 and beyond - a move that underscores how much the U.S. now relies on its former Cold War adversary. Already, NASA is committed to pay Russia $1.5 billion during the next five years to transport its astronauts to and from the International Space Station, a necessary arrangement because the U.S. no longer flies a human-rated spacecraft since NASA retired the space shuttle last summer. The new contract could extend reliance on Russia even longer while serving as a painful metaphor for the state of NASA in the post-shuttle age. The agency that beat Russia to the moon now is entirely dependent on Roscosmos - and its nearly 50-year-old Soyuz rocket -- to get its people to low Earth orbit. And, ironically, one of the U.S. rockets that could break Moscow's manned-space monopoly relies on engines built by Russia. "It says to me that we're in trouble," said Charles Vick, a Russian space expert with the analyst group GlobalSecurity.org. "They [Russian space officials] are not going to wait for us to catch up. We have to get our act together, or we are going to be out of the game." NASA has brushed off concerns about its reliance on the Russians, saying it's the result of a policy decision to focus on building a new rocket powerful enough to fly astronauts to an asteroid or return to the moon. In fact, though, the agency has failed to build a new human-rated rocket in the 30 years since the shuttle was launched. The Constellation program - the result of President George W. Bush 's 2004 announcement that the agency would return to the moon - was canceled last year after more than $13 billion failed to produce a working rocket and spacecraft. A new program, just announced, is expected to cost $3 billion a year - and won't fly astronauts before 2021. That leaves the United States without the space shuttle - its retirement was ordered to free up money for Constellation - but still needing to get astronauts to the ISS, whose life was extended to 2020. The Russians are the only alternative. Buying from the Russians requires a congressional exemption from national-security laws that ban high-tech commerce with Russia. NASA first obtained a waiver in 2008 - after fierce debate - and has begun efforts to extend it past its mid-2016 expiration. Leading the charge is Bill Gerstenmaier, director of NASA's human-spaceflight division. Earlier this month, he told lawmakers that a waiver would be needed no matter what - even if NASA were successful in its plan to hire U.S. commercial-rocket companies to ferry astronauts to the space station by 2016. "We think an exception to the [security law] is needed even if we don't need to purchase Soyuz seats," Gerstenmaier said. "For basic operations of the ISS, we purchase certain services - minor - but from the Russians, and we need an exception for that to continue operations of ISS." Afterward, Gerstenmaier defined those "minor" services as "engineering services, sustaining engineering analysis, power margins - typical standard integration and engineering services." Meantime, NASA is pushing commercial-rocket companies to handle transportation to the space station. Two companies, SpaceX of California and Orbital Sciences of Virginia, have contracts to ferry cargo to the station through 2016. Both plan to begin flights by next year. SpaceX would get $1.6 billion for 12 flights, and Orbital would get $1.9 billion for eight trips. NASA also has awarded more than $300 million to U.S. companies to develop spacecraft that can taxi astronauts to the station - although it's uncertain when they will be ready. SpaceX, which also received money for crew transport, is aiming for 2014. That date, though, depends on several factors, including the stringency of "human-rating" regulations yet to be finalized by NASA. "With NASA's support, SpaceX will be ready to have our first manned flight in 2014," said SpaceX spokeswoman Kirstin Brost Grantham. The other major player, Boeing , has targeted 2015 - with a caveat. Boeing aims to build its own capsule to fly aboard an existing rocket, the Atlas V. But company officials have said it could meet that deadline only if it received a large chunk of the $850 million a year that the White House has requested during the next five years for commercial spaceflight. That funding level, however, appears unlikely. Budgets proposed by the House and Senate for 2012 allot a maximum of $500 million for the program. And given the tightfisted attitude on Capitol Hill nowadays, that amount is unlikely to increase. A Boeing spokeswoman would not speculate how that would affect the timeline. Even if Boeing is successful, however, it still leaves the U.S. dependent on the Russians. The Atlas V rocket, built by Lockheed Martin and a workhorse for NASA and the Pentagon, uses the Russian RD-180 engine. Top military officials have pushed Lockheed Martin and Pratt & Whitney Rocketdyne - a subcontractor that essentially acts as broker for the engines - to develop a U.S. alternative, but industry has said that would cost hundreds of millions. "That's one of the things we continue to talk about is co-production. It's the thing we need to go do, but . there has to be funding to do that," said Bill Parsons, president and CEO of RD AMROSS, a joint venture between Pratt & Whitney Rocketdyne and NPO Energomash, the Russian manufacturer. The Russian rocket industry is not without kinks. A Soyuz carrying cargo to the station failed in August, briefly raising the possibility of a long-term grounding. But the problem was attributed to fuel-line contamination, and two flights - one for cargo, one for crew - are planned this fall. And Russia's role in space is growing. In 2010, the Russians led the world with 31 launches of satellites - more than twice the 15 the U.S. put into orbit, according to a report published by the Space Foundation. And Friday, Russia blasted its Soyuz rocket from a new pad in French Guiana, the first time it has done so outside the old Iron Curtain. It's yet another reason that Vick, of GlobalSecurity.org, is shaking his head. "We have to have a real reconsideration of space policy," he said. "We are not a world power anymore." -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From jameseoberg at comcast.net Tue Oct 25 16:39:17 2011 From: jameseoberg at comcast.net (James E Oberg) Date: Tue, 25 Oct 2011 15:39:17 -0500 Subject: [FPSPACE] new TASS graphic on Fobos-Grunt Message-ID: here: http://www.itar-tass.com/data/Graphics/LargePhoto/1300.JPEG -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From ljk4 at msn.com Wed Oct 26 09:43:20 2011 From: ljk4 at msn.com (LARRY KLAES ) Date: Wed, 26 Oct 2011 13:43:20 +0000 Subject: [FPSPACE] Fwd: GSFC: STEREO Mission Celebrates 5 Years of Science Message-ID: ---------- Sent from AT&T Wireless using Windows Live Hotmail -----Original Message----- From: AAS Press Officer Dr. Rick Fienberg Sent: 10/25/2011 9:26:36 PM To: Rick Fienberg Subject: GSFC: STEREO Mission Celebrates 5 Years of Science THE FOLLOWING RELEASE WAS RECEIVED FROM NASA'S GODDARD SPACE FLIGHT CENTER IN GREENBELT, MARYLAND, AND IS FORWARDED FOR YOUR INFORMATION. (FORWARDING DOES NOT IMPLY ENDORSEMENT BY THE AMERICAN ASTRONOMICAL SOCIETY.) Rick Fienberg, AAS Press Officer: rick.fienberg at aas.org, +1 202-328-2010 x116. October 25, 2011 Contact: Susan Hendrix +1 301-286-7745 susan.m.hendrix at nasa.gov Text, images, and video: http://www.nasa.gov/mission_pages/stereo/news/five-years.html STEREO MISSION CELEBRATES FIVE INCREDIBLE YEARS OF SCIENCE On October 25, 2006, a Delta II rocket launched from Cape Canaveral carrying two nearly identical spacecraft. Each satellite was one half of a mission entitled Solar TErrestrial RElations Observatory (STEREO) and they were destined to do something never done before -- see the entire Sun simultaneously. The Sun rotates, of course, so there's no part of the Sun we haven't at some point observed from our vantage point on Earth. But watching this massive, highly active star from only a single line of sight has its limitations. For one, we never know what's about to come over the horizon: a clear, relatively quiet surface or a cluster of active areas ready to send billions of tons of energy and radiation toward Earth? It's also not easy to gauge the speed, size, or other characteristics of incoming solar activity when only viewing it head on. "Over the last five years, each STEREO spacecraft has moved to a position in its orbit where it can capture side-view images of anything the Sun sends our way," says Joe Gurman, STEREO's project scientist at NASA's Goddard Space Flight Center in Greenbelt, Md. "That's helped us come up with many new answers to old questions about solar activity." Such solar activity usually comes in the form of bursts of radiation called solar flares or eruptions of solar material and magnetic fields called coronal mass ejections (CMEs). Scientists want to know more about this activity since it can affect our own magnetic environment, interfering with communications and Global Positioning System satellites among other things. To get its unique view of flares and CMES, the two STEREO spacecraft were launched into a clever orbit scheme. One, STEREO-A, flies in an orbit around the Sun that is somewhat smaller and therefore faster than that of Earth. STEREO-B's orbit is somewhat larger and slower. Over time the difference in the speeds of the orbits have naturally caused STEREO A to move ahead of Earth in its path, and STEREO-B to fall behind. As of February 6, 2011, the two spacecraft reached almost exact opposite sides of the Sun. "The most important part of this configuration," says Therese Kucera, STEREO's deputy project scientist at Goddard, "is not only does STEREO track CMEs visually from the Sun to Earth, but that information can be combined with data from several other spacecraft sitting right in the line of the solar activity." Coordinating such in situ observations with an outside perspective opened the door to some of the first movies tracking CMEs and less well-known phenomena such as "co-rotating interaction regions" within the solar wind all the way from the Sun's surface to Earth's environs. STEREO also showed us that bursts of solar energetic particles -- of interest because just one particle can knock out computer components in a satellite or harm the DNA of a human in space -- were much broader than previously thought, extending widely enough that both of STEREO's spacecraft could sense them passing by. Another crucial aspect of this unique 360-degree view of the Sun is that we can now observe CMEs heading in any direction in space. Such space weather can affect any of NASA's spacecraft, so those who handle flight operations appreciate advance warning before a burst of solar particles pass by their sensitive electronics systems. STEREO's wide view also helped comet watchers as it recorded the tail of Comet Encke get ripped off by a solar eruption in April of 2007. And STEREO's images of Comet McNaught -- one of the brightest comets in 40 years -- helped show that the tail contained iron. In the coming months, the two satellites will keep moving further away from Earth, lining up on the far side of the Sun in 2015 and continuing on their journey until they are once again on Earth's side. During the trip, scientists will use STEREO observations to calibrate their techniques to monitor what's happening on the far side of the Sun by tracking the sound waves that roll through the Sun's interior -- a technique called helioseismology. "STEREO was designed to understand what causes CMEs and how they travel, as well as to understand the structure of the solar wind. It's already made great strides in doing that," says Gurman. "I'm looking forward to the next five years." # # # STEREO mission site: http://www.nasa.gov/stereo Heliophysics website: http://www.nasa.gov/sunearth ------------------------------------------------------------------------ If you do not wish to receive press releases that are forwarded to the news media by the American Astronomical Society, please unsubscribe by replying accordingly to any incoming press release, or send e-mail to rick.fienberg at aas.org. Requests for referrals to experts on astronomy and space science should be sent to the same address. Rick Fienberg, AAS Press Officer, +1 202-328-2010 x116, @AAS_Press (Twitter). -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From pjp961 at svol.net Thu Oct 27 18:26:39 2011 From: pjp961 at svol.net (Peter Pesavento) Date: Thu, 27 Oct 2011 18:26:39 -0400 Subject: [FPSPACE] News reports that Chinese military hackers successfully interfered with Landsat 7 and Terra EOS AM-1 Message-ID: <4ea9dab4.4aaaec0a.7b3d.2be4@mx.google.com> Agency France Presse via Raw Story http://www.rawstory.com/rs/2011/10/27/china-suspect-in-u-s-satellite-interfe rence-report/ Major excerpt: China Suspect in US Satellite Interference: US Report. By Agency France-Presse Thursday, October 27, 2011 WASHINGTON-NASA satellites were interfered with four separate times in 2007 and 2008, possibly by the Chinese military, according to a draft of an upcoming report for the US Congress. The latest draft of the report by the US-China Economic and Security Review Commissions said the computer hackers behind the interference gained the ability to issue commands to one of the satellites on two occasions. The targeted satellites are used for observation of earth's climate and terrain, according to the report to be submitted to Congress on November 16. A copy of the latest draft of the report was obtained by AFP on Thursday. It said the account of the interference with the satellites came from a May 2011 briefing for the Commission by the US Air Force. The hackers appear to have exploited the information systems of the Svalbard Satellite Station (SvalSat), a commercially operated satellite ground station in Spitsbergen, Norway, to gain access to the satellites, the report said. SvalSat relies on the Internet for data access and file transfers, it said, citing a recent NASA report. On October 20, 2007, Landsat-7, a US earth observation satellite jointly managed by NASA and the US Geological Survey, experienced 12 or more minutes of interference, the report said. Landsat-7 experienced another 12 or more minutes of interference on July 23, 2008, the report said. It said that on June 20, 2008, Terra EOS AM-1, a NASA-managed program for earth observant, experienced two or more minutes of interference, it said. It said the hackers behind the interference with Terra EOS AM-1 "achieved all steps required to command the satellite but did not issue commands." On October 22, 2008, Terra EOS AM-1 experienced nine or more minutes of interference, the report said, and "the responsible party" again "achieved all steps required to command the satellite but did not issue commands." "Such interference poses numerous potential threats, particularly if achieved against satellites with more sensitive functions," the report said. "The attacker could also deny or degrade as well as forge or otherwise manipulate the satellite's transmission," it said. "A high level of access could reveal the satellite's capabilities or information, such as imagery, gained through its sensors." The report stressed that it was not recounting the incidents "on the basis of specific attribution information" but rather "because the techniques appear consistent with authoritative Chinese military writings." -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From jameseoberg at comcast.net Thu Oct 27 18:34:21 2011 From: jameseoberg at comcast.net (James E Oberg) Date: Thu, 27 Oct 2011 17:34:21 -0500 Subject: [FPSPACE] News reports that Chinese military hackers successfullyinterfered with Landsat 7 and Terra EOS AM-1 References: <4ea9dab4.4aaaec0a.7b3d.2be4@mx.google.com> Message-ID: Good find, Peter -- here's another version of the story: Chinese hackers may have attacked U.S. satellites Jaikumar Vijayan 27.10.2011 kl 18:23 | Computerworld (US) http://news.idg.no/cw/art.cfm?id=C2E8CB09-1A64-67EA-E4B5BA48C574869A Suspected Chinese hackers interfered with two U.S. satellites on four separate occasions in 2007 and 2008, according to a Bloomberg Businessweek story that cites an upcoiming report by a congressional commission. ----- Original Message ----- From: Peter Pesavento To: fpspace at friends-partners.org Sent: Thursday, October 27, 2011 5:26 PM Subject: [FPSPACE] News reports that Chinese military hackers successfullyinterfered with Landsat 7 and Terra EOS AM-1 Agency France Presse via Raw Story http://www.rawstory.com/rs/2011/10/27/china-suspect-in-u-s-satellite-interference-report/ Major excerpt: China Suspect in US Satellite Interference: US Report. By Agency France-Presse Thursday, October 27, 2011 WASHINGTON-NASA satellites were interfered with four separate times in 2007 and 2008, possibly by the Chinese military, according to a draft of an upcoming report for the US Congress. The latest draft of the report by the US-China Economic and Security Review Commissions said the computer hackers behind the interference gained the ability to issue commands to one of the satellites on two occasions. The targeted satellites are used for observation of earth's climate and terrain, according to the report to be submitted to Congress on November 16. A copy of the latest draft of the report was obtained by AFP on Thursday. It said the account of the interference with the satellites came from a May 2011 briefing for the Commission by the US Air Force. The hackers appear to have exploited the information systems of the Svalbard Satellite Station (SvalSat), a commercially operated satellite ground station in Spitsbergen, Norway, to gain access to the satellites, the report said. SvalSat relies on the Internet for data access and file transfers, it said, citing a recent NASA report. On October 20, 2007, Landsat-7, a US earth observation satellite jointly managed by NASA and the US Geological Survey, experienced 12 or more minutes of interference, the report said. Landsat-7 experienced another 12 or more minutes of interference on July 23, 2008, the report said. It said that on June 20, 2008, Terra EOS AM-1, a NASA-managed program for earth observant, experienced two or more minutes of interference, it said. It said the hackers behind the interference with Terra EOS AM-1 "achieved all steps required to command the satellite but did not issue commands." On October 22, 2008, Terra EOS AM-1 experienced nine or more minutes of interference, the report said, and "the responsible party" again "achieved all steps required to command the satellite but did not issue commands." "Such interference poses numerous potential threats, particularly if achieved against satellites with more sensitive functions," the report said. "The attacker could also deny or degrade as well as forge or otherwise manipulate the satellite's transmission," it said. "A high level of access could reveal the satellite's capabilities or information, such as imagery, gained through its sensors." The report stressed that it was not recounting the incidents "on the basis of specific attribution information" but rather "because the techniques appear consistent with authoritative Chinese military writings." ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ _______________________________________________ FPSPACE mailing list FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From ljk4 at msn.com Fri Oct 28 00:05:39 2011 From: ljk4 at msn.com (LARRY KLAES) Date: Fri, 28 Oct 2011 00:05:39 -0400 Subject: [FPSPACE] Did the Soviets have the Vostok/Soyuz design back in 1949? Message-ID: Look at the illustrations in this book and you tell me: http://dreamsofspace.blogspot.com/2011/09/this-one-i-do-not-have-title-for.html -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From jameseoberg at comcast.net Fri Oct 28 00:22:25 2011 From: jameseoberg at comcast.net (James E Oberg) Date: Thu, 27 Oct 2011 23:22:25 -0500 Subject: [FPSPACE] Mars-96 Impact Location -- Any Russian official source EVER admitted it was Andes Mountains? Message-ID: <84C3EF7BD6C04CA7BA0888C74D0A56A2@ownerfbf08f40c> For a story I'm doing pre-Fobos-Grunt on the 'Ghosts of Mars Probes Past', regarding the controversy over where Mars-96 actually landed [see http://www.jamesoberg.com/plutonium.html], has anyone ever seen any Russian space official admit it might have landed in the Andes Mountains and NOT in the deep Pacific? Or do all official websites still state that it did fall safely into the ocean? thanks! -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From pao.ulivi at gmail.com Fri Oct 28 01:35:49 2011 From: pao.ulivi at gmail.com (Paolo Ulivi) Date: Fri, 28 Oct 2011 07:35:49 +0200 Subject: [FPSPACE] Mars-96 Impact Location -- Any Russian official source EVER admitted it was Andes Mountains? In-Reply-To: <84C3EF7BD6C04CA7BA0888C74D0A56A2@ownerfbf08f40c> References: <84C3EF7BD6C04CA7BA0888C74D0A56A2@ownerfbf08f40c> Message-ID: it was reported in Flight International that wreckage had been found in a salt plateau in Bolivia http://www.flightglobal.com/pdfarchive/view/1997/1997%20-%200188.html?search=oyuni On Fri, Oct 28, 2011 at 6:22 AM, James E Oberg wrote: > For a story I'm doing pre-Fobos-Grunt on the 'Ghosts of Mars Probes Past', > regarding the controversy over where Mars-96 actually landed > [see http://www.jamesoberg.com/plutonium.html], > > has anyone ever seen any Russian?space official admit it might have landed > in the Andes Mountains and NOT in the deep Pacific? Or do all official > websites > still state that it did fall safely into the ocean? > > thanks! > > > _______________________________________________ > FPSPACE mailing list > FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org > http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace > > From kgottschalk at uwc.ac.za Fri Oct 28 05:25:21 2011 From: kgottschalk at uwc.ac.za (Keith Gottschalk) Date: Fri, 28 Oct 2011 11:25:21 +0200 Subject: [FPSPACE] South African space programme planning Message-ID: <4EAA9121020000A6000149D4@uwc.ac.za> Dear Friends, Business Day (Johannesburg) 28 October 2011 ran an article today. PLANNING A TWO DECADE PROGRAMME The South African National Space Agency (SANSA) is setting up a 40-strong committee to plan a national space programme until 2030, in effect an eighteen year programme. In my experience getting 40 professionals together for a meeting is so impossible that its work will surely have to be largely done in sub-committees, with only one or two plenary meetings at the start & end. Phil Mjwara, Director-General of the Dept of S&T, mentioned three possibilities: - another South Africa micro-satellite; - another research satellite in cooperation with Brazil & India; - a 3rd satellite for the African Resource Management Constellation. The mothballed Overberg Test Range (built under apartheid under total military censorship to launch South African-build copies of Israeli Shavits) has not been transferred to SANSA, but remains operated by Denel, an armament parastatal. It can launch satellites into equatorial, polar, or SSO orbits The news report quoted Sandile Malinga, CEO of SANSA, as noting that the people who used to operate it are now close to retirement, some already retired. BUDGETS The SANSA starts with a budget of ZAR 93 million under the Dept. of S&T. This budget must include its existing facilities & personnel, such as the Space Weather Centre (formerly Hermanus Magnetic Observatory), the Satellite Applications Centre, & the ISSA (formerly Houwteq). The Govt. has also bought up a majority shareholding in March in Sunspace, the microsat company that was spun-off Stellenbosch University's Electronics Lab, but couldn't make it commercially. It faced fierce competition from South Korea and elsewhere for satellite sub-systems that it marketed. At the recent IAC, I was very surprised when the Nigerian representatives of their National Space Development & Research Agency, NASDRA, showed off slides of their buildings & facilities & their two recently launched micro-sats, but became incredibly evasive when I asked them how much was their budget. They said that this varied, and was more when they had a satellite up & less when they had no satellite. I responded "of course, but please tell us what is your budget for the most recent 12 month period for which you have figures?" They flatly refused to reveal any budget, & just repeated that it varied. Weird? What on earth have they to hide? The Official Opposition spokeswoman on S&T, Marian Shinn of the Democratic Alliance, has become increasingly critical & opposed to building microsats, on the grounds that they break down, & should rather buy imagery from foreign satellites. While the DA is most unlikely to become a government before 2019 or 2024, it does mean that the earlier all-party support for SA's space programme is now over forever. Yesterday Gordhan Pravin, South Africa's Finance Minister (who is also a member of the Communist Party & a qualified pharmacist) presented the supplementary budget appropriation. He gave both Parliament, & also the caucus of the ruling party, a stern talking-to about avoiding extravagance, opposing corruption, & the need for austere budgets. I am sure that the current international depression will taker another two or three years to lift, so South Africa's space budget will not increase much until after that. - Keith -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- All Email originating from UWC is covered by disclaimer http://www.uwc.ac.za/emaildisclaimer From thomsona at flash.net Fri Oct 28 08:40:28 2011 From: thomsona at flash.net (Allen Thomson) Date: Fri, 28 Oct 2011 05:40:28 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [FPSPACE] Did the Soviets have the Vostok/Soyuz design back in 1949? Message-ID: <1319805628.93727.YahooMailClassic@web80204.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Only in that they knew about spheres back then. The illustrations are of a much larger interplanetary ship. From ljk4 at msn.com Fri Oct 28 09:11:54 2011 From: ljk4 at msn.com (LARRY KLAES ) Date: Fri, 28 Oct 2011 13:11:54 +0000 Subject: [FPSPACE] Fwd: [Launch Alert] Delta II Launched Message-ID: ---------- Sent from AT&T Wireless using Windows Live Hotmail -----Original Message----- From: Launch Alert Sent: 10/28/2011 12:09:27 PM To: launch-alert at mailman.qth.net Subject: [Launch Alert] Delta II Launched TEAM VANDENBERG LAUNCHES DELTA II ROCKET VANDENBERG AIR FORCE BASE, Calif. - Team Vandenberg launched a Delta II rocket carrying NASA's NPOESS Preparatory Project (NPP) satellite from Space Launch Complex-2W here at 2:48 a.m. PDT today. Col. Richard Boltz, 30th Space Wing commander, was the launch decision authority. "Public safety is always our first priority, and Team Vandenberg did a phenomenal job ensuring a safe launch for this critical NASA mission," said Colonel Boltz. NPP, an Earth-observing satellite, represents a critical first step in building the next-generation of U.S. polar-orbiting climate and weather monitoring spacecraft. NPP is the bridge between NASA's Earth Observing System (EOS) satellites and the forthcoming series of Joint Polar Satellite System (JPSS) satellites. The mission will test key technologies and instruments for the JPSS missions. See www.nasa.gov/NPP for updates on post-launch NPP mission status. Today's launch is the last scheduled for 2011 from Vandenberg as well as the last for Colonel Boltz serving as 30th Space Wing commander. "It's been a tremendous honor serving alongside the men and women who make Team Vandenberg the best launch team in the world," said Colonel Boltz, whose change of command ceremony is scheduled for January 2012. Col. Nina Armagno, currently serving as Director of Staff, Headquarters, Air Force Space Command, Peterson AFB, Colo., has been named as the incoming 30th Space Wing commander. ______________________________________________________________ Launch-Alert mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/launch-alert Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Launch-Alert at mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From ljk4 at msn.com Fri Oct 28 09:20:21 2011 From: ljk4 at msn.com (LARRY KLAES ) Date: Fri, 28 Oct 2011 13:20:21 +0000 Subject: [FPSPACE] Did the Soviets have the Vostok/Soyuz design back in 1949? Message-ID: I know, but I was struck by the similarities regardless of the dimensional differences. I also wonder if any of the Soviet rocket makers were influenced by this work? Or were they actually consultants on this book? Note it came out at the same time as von Braun, Ley, and Bonestell's pivotal work in the West. Larry ---------- Sent from AT&T Wireless using Windows Live Hotmail -----Original Message----- From: Allen Thomson Sent: 10/28/2011 12:40:28 PM To: fpspace , LARRY KLAES Subject: Re: [FPSPACE] Did the Soviets have the Vostok/Soyuz design back in 1949? Only in that they knew about spheres back then. The illustrations are of a much larger interplanetary ship. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From jameseoberg at comcast.net Fri Oct 28 09:48:44 2011 From: jameseoberg at comcast.net (James E Oberg) Date: Fri, 28 Oct 2011 08:48:44 -0500 Subject: [FPSPACE] Mars-96 Impact Location --Wreckage found References: <84C3EF7BD6C04CA7BA0888C74D0A56A2@ownerfbf08f40c> Message-ID: Wow, I have no memory of ever seeing this report. I wonder what the source was, and if there was any follow-up -- such as photographs of the recovered debris. Caution is required -- even as the recent UARS fall reminds us, most junk attributed to 'space wreckage' turns out to have entirely prosaic origin. How do we pursue this very cold trail? Any contacts at 'Flight' that we can ask? ----- Original Message ----- From: "Paolo Ulivi" Cc: Sent: Friday, October 28, 2011 12:35 AM Subject: Re: [FPSPACE] Mars-96 Impact Location -- Any Russian official source EVER admitted it was Andes Mountains? it was reported in Flight International that wreckage had been found in a salt plateau in Bolivia http://www.flightglobal.com/pdfarchive/view/1997/1997%20-%200188.html?search=oyuni On Fri, Oct 28, 2011 at 6:22 AM, James E Oberg wrote: > For a story I'm doing pre-Fobos-Grunt on the 'Ghosts of Mars Probes Past', > regarding the controversy over where Mars-96 actually landed > [see http://www.jamesoberg.com/plutonium.html], > > has anyone ever seen any Russian space official admit it might have landed > in the Andes Mountains and NOT in the deep Pacific? Or do all official > websites > still state that it did fall safely into the ocean? > > thanks! > > > _______________________________________________ > FPSPACE mailing list > FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org > http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace > > _______________________________________________ FPSPACE mailing list FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace From kgottschalk at uwc.ac.za Fri Oct 28 09:58:48 2011 From: kgottschalk at uwc.ac.za (Keith Gottschalk) Date: Fri, 28 Oct 2011 15:58:48 +0200 Subject: [FPSPACE] Mars-96 Impact Location --Wreckage found In-Reply-To: References: <84C3EF7BD6C04CA7BA0888C74D0A56A2@ownerfbf08f40c> Message-ID: <4EAAD138020000A600014AEC@uwc.ac.za> Bolivia is not the Antarctic or Devon Island. Even its deserts are cris-crossed by lithium prospectors. For those with such resources, satellite imagery could be trawled through to speed up searching. Or aerial-flown geiger counters might pick up a spike. Good luck to researchers. - Keith >>> On 2011/10/28 at 03:48 PM, in message , "James E Oberg" wrote: Wow, I have no memory of ever seeing this report. I wonder what the source was, and if there was any follow-up -- such as photographs of the recovered debris. Caution is required -- even as the recent UARS fall reminds us, most junk attributed to 'space wreckage' turns out to have entirely prosaic origin. How do we pursue this very cold trail? Any contacts at 'Flight' that we can ask? ----- Original Message ----- From: "Paolo Ulivi" Cc: Sent: Friday, October 28, 2011 12:35 AM Subject: Re: [FPSPACE] Mars-96 Impact Location -- Any Russian official source EVER admitted it was Andes Mountains? it was reported in Flight International that wreckage had been found in a salt plateau in Bolivia http://www.flightglobal.com/pdfarchive/view/1997/1997%20-%200188.html?search=oyuni On Fri, Oct 28, 2011 at 6:22 AM, James E Oberg wrote: > For a story I'm doing pre-Fobos-Grunt on the 'Ghosts of Mars Probes Past', > regarding the controversy over where Mars-96 actually landed > [see http://www.jamesoberg.com/plutonium.html], > > has anyone ever seen any Russian space official admit it might have landed > in the Andes Mountains and NOT in the deep Pacific? Or do all official > websites > still state that it did fall safely into the ocean? > > thanks! > > > _______________________________________________ > FPSPACE mailing list > FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org > http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace > > _______________________________________________ FPSPACE mailing list FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace _______________________________________________ FPSPACE mailing list FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- All Email originating from UWC is covered by disclaimer http://www.uwc.ac.za/emaildisclaimer From agzak at optonline.net Fri Oct 28 10:07:13 2011 From: agzak at optonline.net (Anatoly Zak) Date: Fri, 28 Oct 2011 10:07:13 -0400 Subject: [FPSPACE] Did the Soviets have the Vostok/Soyuz design back in 1949? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Shapes of reentry vehicles are based on requirements to provide stability and thermal conditions during the descent. It is technically impossible to fashion an atmospheric vehicle from a body of a sci-fi starship. Vostok?s descent module was made into a sphere, because it promised the easiest way to perform ballistic reentry. Many other shapes were studied and rejected in the process, as described in Feoktistov?s memoirs. http://www.russianspaceweb.com/spacecraft_manned_first.html That said, Shternfeld? book was very popular, I remember these images since I was a kid. However depictions of the spacecraft made of spheres was rather typical for the period. I have many in my archive, for example: http://www.russianspaceweb.com/tsiolkovsky_kaluga.html Anatoly Zak On 10/28/11 9:20 AM, "LARRY KLAES" wrote: > I know, but I was struck by the similarities regardless of the dimensional > differences. I also wonder if any of the Soviet rocket makers were influenced > by this work? Or were they actually consultants on this book? Note it came > out at the same time as von Braun, Ley, and Bonestell's pivotal work in the > West. Larry ---------- Sent from AT Wireless using Windows Live Hotmail > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Allen Thomson > Sent: 10/28/2011 12:40:28 PM > To: fpspace , LARRY KLAES > Subject: Re: [FPSPACE] Did the Soviets have the Vostok/Soyuz design back in > 1949? > > > Only in that they knew about spheres back then. The illustrations are of a > much larger interplanetary ship. > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > FPSPACE mailing list > FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org > http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From ljk4 at msn.com Fri Oct 28 11:12:11 2011 From: ljk4 at msn.com (LARRY KLAES ) Date: Fri, 28 Oct 2011 15:12:11 +0000 Subject: [FPSPACE] Did the Soviets have the Vostok/Soyuz design back in 1949? Message-ID: The early Mercury designs included spherical shapes. Thanks to the V-2 and its makers the West long thought of a typical spaceship as a silvery needle with wings. Thank you for the information. L arry ---------- Sent from AT&T Wireless using Windows Live Hotmail -----Original Message----- From: Anatoly Zak Sent: 10/28/2011 2:07:13 PM To: Untitled Subject: Re: [FPSPACE] Did the Soviets have the Vostok/Soyuz design back in 1949? Shapes of reentry vehicles are based on requirements to provide stability and thermal conditions during the descent. It is technically impossible to fashion an atmospheric vehicle from a body of a sci-fi starship. Vostok's descent module was made into a sphere, because it promised the easiest way to perform ballistic reentry. Many other shapes were studied and rejected in the process, as described in Feoktistov's memoirs. http://www.russianspaceweb.com/spacecraft_manned_first.html That said, Shternfeld' book was very popular, I remember these images since I was a kid. However depictions of the spacecraft made of spheres was rather typical for the period. I have many in my archive, for example: http://www.russianspaceweb.com/tsiolkovsky_kaluga.html Anatoly Zak On 10/28/11 9:20 AM, "LARRY KLAES" wrote: I know, but I was struck by the similarities regardless of the dimensional differences. I also wonder if any of the Soviet rocket makers were influenced by this work? Or were they actually consultants on this book? Note it came out at the same time as von Braun, Ley, and Bonestell's pivotal work in the West. Larry ---------- Sent from AT Wireless using Windows Live Hotmail -----Original Message----- From: Allen Thomson Sent: 10/28/2011 12:40:28 PM To: fpspace , LARRY KLAES Subject: Re: [FPSPACE] Did the Soviets have the Vostok/Soyuz design back in 1949? Only in that they knew about spheres back then. The illustrations are of a much larger interplanetary ship. ________________________________ _______________________________________________ FPSPACE mailing list FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From jameseoberg at comcast.net Fri Oct 28 11:41:59 2011 From: jameseoberg at comcast.net (James E Oberg) Date: Fri, 28 Oct 2011 10:41:59 -0500 Subject: [FPSPACE] Mars-96 Impact Location -- Any Russian official source EVER admitted it was Andes Mountains? References: <84C3EF7BD6C04CA7BA0888C74D0A56A2@ownerfbf08f40c> Message-ID: <593F7F56B8D44368BB313569E9E763D9@ownerfbf08f40c> For those who can't get to the link, here is full citation: SPACEFLIGHT NEWS IN BRIEF * MARS FIND Wreckage of Russia's failed Mars '96 probe has been found south of the Oyuni salt plateau in Bolivia, 100km (55nm) from Chile and at an altitude of 12,000ft (3,650m). The spacecraft plunged from low Earth orbit on 17 November, 1996, after the fourth stage of its Proton launcher failed to restart. The fourth stage re-entered over the Pacific a day later. FLIGHT INTERNATIONAL, 22-28 January 1997 P. 22 ----- Original Message ----- From: "Paolo Ulivi" Cc: Sent: Friday, October 28, 2011 12:35 AM Subject: Re: [FPSPACE] Mars-96 Impact Location -- Any Russian official source EVER admitted it was Andes Mountains? it was reported in Flight International that wreckage had been found in a salt plateau in Bolivia http://www.flightglobal.com/pdfarchive/view/1997/1997%20-%200188.html?search=oyuni On Fri, Oct 28, 2011 at 6:22 AM, James E Oberg wrote: > For a story I'm doing pre-Fobos-Grunt on the 'Ghosts of Mars Probes Past', > regarding the controversy over where Mars-96 actually landed > [see http://www.jamesoberg.com/plutonium.html], > > has anyone ever seen any Russian space official admit it might have landed > in the Andes Mountains and NOT in the deep Pacific? Or do all official > websites > still state that it did fall safely into the ocean? > > thanks! > > > _______________________________________________ > FPSPACE mailing list > FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org > http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace > > _______________________________________________ FPSPACE mailing list FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace From geertsassen at gmail.com Fri Oct 28 12:04:36 2011 From: geertsassen at gmail.com (Geert Sassen) Date: Fri, 28 Oct 2011 18:04:36 +0200 Subject: [FPSPACE] Mars-96 Impact Location --Wreckage found In-Reply-To: References: <84C3EF7BD6C04CA7BA0888C74D0A56A2@ownerfbf08f40c> Message-ID: Purely from memory of those days, I seem to remember we even discussed this report on FPSpace, but quite apart from that one news-report nothing ever turned up, no follow-up reports and no pictures of debris or anything. I seem to remember the actual spacecraft was never tracked by NORAD as it re-entered almost immediately, all that was tracked was its Block-D stage, which re-entered a day later. Without any actual tracking-data I wonder how much value we have to give to the reported re-entry over the Andes, and from what I remember we reached the same conclusion in those days..Without any trackingships on station, there was no telemetry received from either Block-D or the spacecraft, so it never became exactly clear what had happened and whether or not the Block-D ignited and how long it burned, and whether or not the spacecraft (fregat stage) fully completed its burn after separation from Block-D, which makes it almost impossible to predict where it ended up.. Regards, Geert. On Fri, Oct 28, 2011 at 3:48 PM, James E Oberg wrote: > Wow, I have no memory of ever seeing this report. I wonder > what the source was, and if there was any follow-up -- such as > photographs of the recovered debris. > > Caution is required -- even as the recent UARS fall reminds us, most > junk attributed to 'space wreckage' turns out to have entirely prosaic > origin. > > How do we pursue this very cold trail? Any contacts at 'Flight' that we > can ask? > > > > ----- Original Message ----- From: "Paolo Ulivi" > Cc: > Sent: Friday, October 28, 2011 12:35 AM > Subject: Re: [FPSPACE] Mars-96 Impact Location -- Any Russian official > source EVER admitted it was Andes Mountains? > > > it was reported in Flight International that wreckage had been found > in a salt plateau in Bolivia > http://www.flightglobal.com/pdfarchive/view/1997/1997%20-%200188.html?search=oyuni > > On Fri, Oct 28, 2011 at 6:22 AM, James E Oberg > wrote: >> >> For a story I'm doing pre-Fobos-Grunt on the 'Ghosts of Mars Probes Past', >> regarding the controversy over where Mars-96 actually landed >> [see http://www.jamesoberg.com/plutonium.html], >> >> has anyone ever seen any Russian space official admit it might have landed >> in the Andes Mountains and NOT in the deep Pacific? Or do all official >> websites >> still state that it did fall safely into the ocean? >> >> thanks! >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> FPSPACE mailing list >> FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org >> http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace >> >> > _______________________________________________ > FPSPACE mailing list > FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org > http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace > > _______________________________________________ > FPSPACE mailing list > FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org > http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace > -- Geert Sassen http://www.facebook.com/geert.sassen From jeoberg at comcast.net Fri Oct 28 12:44:01 2011 From: jeoberg at comcast.net (James E Oberg) Date: Fri, 28 Oct 2011 11:44:01 -0500 Subject: [FPSPACE] Mars-96 Impact Location --Wreckage found References: <84C3EF7BD6C04CA7BA0888C74D0A56A2@ownerfbf08f40c> Message-ID: Thanks, Geert. I've sent off some emails to the tourist industry in the area, maybe we'll get a follow-up. Without skin-track radar, the tracking of the entry was based on three factors, as I recall. 1. Multiple ground witness accounts of a fireball crossing the coast from west to east. I have recently re-contacted some of the witnesses. 2. Analysis of the probe's orbit assuming NO second DM burn but THEN followed by the canned probe's OWN propulsion system burn that threw it into a more elliptical orbit. We know that burn occurred because the probe THEN opened its solar panels and this report was received in Russia via one telemetry pass [Lou Friedman report from MCC]. 3. IR tracking by US DoD satellite assets provided a corridor of entry that extended from the Pacific to well into Bolivia. That report was released by NORAD at 5 PM on the Friday after Thanksgiving, with the clear [to my mind, at least] hope it would be overlooked by the news media. And it was. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Geert Sassen" To: "James E Oberg" Cc: Sent: Friday, October 28, 2011 11:04 AM Subject: Re: [FPSPACE] Mars-96 Impact Location --Wreckage found > Purely from memory of those days, I seem to remember we even discussed > this report on FPSpace, but quite apart from that one news-report > nothing ever turned up, no follow-up reports and no pictures of debris > or anything. > > I seem to remember the actual spacecraft was never tracked by NORAD as > it re-entered almost immediately, all that was tracked was its Block-D > stage, which re-entered a day later. Without any actual tracking-data > I wonder how much value we have to give to the reported re-entry over > the Andes, and from what I remember we reached the same conclusion in > those days..Without any trackingships on station, there was no > telemetry received from either Block-D or the spacecraft, so it never > became exactly clear what had happened and whether or not the Block-D > ignited and how long it burned, and whether or not the spacecraft > (fregat stage) fully completed its burn after separation from Block-D, > which makes it almost impossible to predict where it ended up.. > > Regards, > > Geert. > > On Fri, Oct 28, 2011 at 3:48 PM, James E Oberg > wrote: >> Wow, I have no memory of ever seeing this report. I wonder >> what the source was, and if there was any follow-up -- such as >> photographs of the recovered debris. >> >> Caution is required -- even as the recent UARS fall reminds us, most >> junk attributed to 'space wreckage' turns out to have entirely prosaic >> origin. >> >> How do we pursue this very cold trail? Any contacts at 'Flight' that we >> can ask? >> >> >> >> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Paolo Ulivi" >> Cc: >> Sent: Friday, October 28, 2011 12:35 AM >> Subject: Re: [FPSPACE] Mars-96 Impact Location -- Any Russian official >> source EVER admitted it was Andes Mountains? >> >> >> it was reported in Flight International that wreckage had been found >> in a salt plateau in Bolivia >> http://www.flightglobal.com/pdfarchive/view/1997/1997%20-%200188.html?search=oyuni >> >> On Fri, Oct 28, 2011 at 6:22 AM, James E Oberg >> wrote: >>> >>> For a story I'm doing pre-Fobos-Grunt on the 'Ghosts of Mars Probes >>> Past', >>> regarding the controversy over where Mars-96 actually landed >>> [see http://www.jamesoberg.com/plutonium.html], >>> >>> has anyone ever seen any Russian space official admit it might have >>> landed >>> in the Andes Mountains and NOT in the deep Pacific? Or do all official >>> websites >>> still state that it did fall safely into the ocean? >>> >>> thanks! >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> FPSPACE mailing list >>> FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org >>> http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace >>> >>> >> _______________________________________________ >> FPSPACE mailing list >> FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org >> http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace >> >> _______________________________________________ >> FPSPACE mailing list >> FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org >> http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace >> > > > > -- > Geert Sassen > http://www.facebook.com/geert.sassen > _______________________________________________ > FPSPACE mailing list > FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org > http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace > From clj at panix.com Fri Oct 28 12:45:25 2011 From: clj at panix.com (Chris Jones) Date: Fri, 28 Oct 2011 12:45:25 -0400 Subject: [FPSPACE] photo essay on Soyuz pad in Korou Message-ID: <20111028124525.4ba263f7@Cloyd> http://englishrussia.com/2011/10/28/service-tower-for-soyuz-st-launch/ is a photo essay (with a time lapse video) of the construction and use of the Soyuz launch pad and service building in Korou, along with pictures of the launcher shipping from Russia. As it mentions, the pad very much resembles the pads in Russia and Kazakstan, with the main difference being a service building which can move into place to protect the erect launcher on the pad (and obviously move out of the way prior to launch). One difference between operations in South America rather than in Europe/Asia (BTW, am I correct in thinking Soyuz is the only satellite launcher to be employed in 3 continents?) is that the launcher is erected on the pad without its payload, which is added there from the service building. From pao.ulivi at gmail.com Fri Oct 28 15:38:19 2011 From: pao.ulivi at gmail.com (Paolo Ulivi) Date: Fri, 28 Oct 2011 21:38:19 +0200 Subject: [FPSPACE] Mars-96 Impact Location --Wreckage found In-Reply-To: References: <84C3EF7BD6C04CA7BA0888C74D0A56A2@ownerfbf08f40c> Message-ID: James you could try contacting Tim Furniss who reported on everything space for Flight Paolo On Fri, Oct 28, 2011 at 3:48 PM, James E Oberg wrote: > Wow, I have no memory of ever seeing this report. I wonder > what the source was, and if there was any follow-up -- such as > photographs of the recovered debris. > > Caution is required -- even as the recent UARS fall reminds us, most > junk attributed to 'space wreckage' turns out to have entirely prosaic > origin. > > How do we pursue this very cold trail? Any contacts at 'Flight' that we > can ask? > > > > ----- Original Message ----- From: "Paolo Ulivi" > Cc: > Sent: Friday, October 28, 2011 12:35 AM > Subject: Re: [FPSPACE] Mars-96 Impact Location -- Any Russian official > source EVER admitted it was Andes Mountains? > > > it was reported in Flight International that wreckage had been found > in a salt plateau in Bolivia > http://www.flightglobal.com/pdfarchive/view/1997/1997%20-%200188.html?search=oyuni > > On Fri, Oct 28, 2011 at 6:22 AM, James E Oberg > wrote: >> >> For a story I'm doing pre-Fobos-Grunt on the 'Ghosts of Mars Probes Past', >> regarding the controversy over where Mars-96 actually landed >> [see http://www.jamesoberg.com/plutonium.html], >> >> has anyone ever seen any Russian space official admit it might have landed >> in the Andes Mountains and NOT in the deep Pacific? Or do all official >> websites >> still state that it did fall safely into the ocean? >> >> thanks! >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> FPSPACE mailing list >> FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org >> http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace >> >> > _______________________________________________ > FPSPACE mailing list > FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org > http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace > > From ljk4 at msn.com Fri Oct 28 19:29:07 2011 From: ljk4 at msn.com (LARRY KLAES ) Date: Fri, 28 Oct 2011 23:29:07 +0000 Subject: [FPSPACE] Fwd: [New post] Whither the Space Shuttle Message-ID: ---------- Sent from AT&T Wireless using Windows Live Hotmail -----Original Message----- From: Roger Launius's Blog Sent: 10/28/2011 8:56:53 PM To: ljk4 at msn.com Subject: [New post] Whither the Space Shuttle New post on Roger Launius's Blog [http://1.gravatar.com/blavatar/5ab615dc2687e96bf21dc4fa4be2f3ff?s=32&ts=1319835413] [http://0.gravatar.com/avatar/488baba4b54ec638fa19eeebd09b6b69?s=50&d=identicon&r=G] Whither the Space Shuttle by launiusr On July 7, 2011, I gave a talk in the "Moving Beyond Earth" exhibition at the Smithsonian Institution's National Air and Space Museum on the history of the Space Shuttle. The audience was the first Student Spaceflight Experiment Program (SSEP) National Conference. This student science symposium allowed student teams from around the United States to share designs and preliminary results for experiments conducted during STS-134, Space Shuttle Endeavour's final mission. The video of this presentation is available here: [http://img.youtube.com/vi/jyVZWv8EUV0/0.jpg]<=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jyVZWv8EUV0> Comments are welcome. launiusr | October 28, 2011 at 8:56 pm | Tags: cold war, Department of Defense, History, NASA, presidential power, public perceptions, public policy, space shuttle, U.S. Civil Space | Categories: History, Personal, Politics, Space Shuttle | URL: http://wp.me/pwYu1-Eg Comment See all comments Unsubscribe or change your email settings at Manage Subscriptions. Trouble clicking? Copy and paste this URL into your browser: http://launiusr.wordpress.com/2011/10/28/whither-the-space-shuttle/ Thanks for flying with [http://s.wordpress.com/i/emails/wp-footericon.png] WordPress.com -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From bhen at telenet.be Sat Oct 29 17:28:03 2011 From: bhen at telenet.be (Bart Hendrickx) Date: Sat, 29 Oct 2011 23:28:03 +0200 Subject: [FPSPACE] Mars-96 Impact Location -- Any Russian official source EVER admitted it was Andes Mountains? In-Reply-To: References: <84C3EF7BD6C04CA7BA0888C74D0A56A2@ownerfbf08f40c> Message-ID: <000001cc9681$a43c3ae0$ecb4b0a0$@be> In April 1999 there were reports about debris having been found in Argentina. See this article in Novosti kosmonavtiki : http://www.novosti-kosmonavtiki.ru/content/numbers/197/36.shtml And for what it?s worth : last year Quest magazine carried an interview with NASA?s Thomas C. Duxbury, who witnessed the Mars-96 launch at Baikonur. He claims that a US team was sent to the Andes to look for debris, or at least that was the plan : ?After I return[ed] to the US, I received a call from a colleague working for an Atomic Energy Commission contractor in Nevada. He wanted to know if I had any idea why his company was putting together a crew to go down to the Chilean Andes. The Russians were sticking to their story that the debris fell safely into the Pacific Ocean, but the US was sending a crew to look for something in the Andes ?. Bart Hendrickx -----Original Message----- From: fpspace-bounces at www.friends-partners.org [mailto:fpspace-bounces at www.friends-partners.org] On Behalf Of Paolo Ulivi Sent: vrijdag 28 oktober 2011 7:36 Cc: fpspace at friends-partners.org Subject: Re: [FPSPACE] Mars-96 Impact Location -- Any Russian official source EVER admitted it was Andes Mountains? it was reported in Flight International that wreckage had been found in a salt plateau in Bolivia http://www.flightglobal.com/pdfarchive/view/1997/1997%20-%200188.html?search =oyuni On Fri, Oct 28, 2011 at 6:22 AM, James E Oberg wrote: > For a story I'm doing pre-Fobos-Grunt on the 'Ghosts of Mars Probes Past', > regarding the controversy over where Mars-96 actually landed > [see http://www.jamesoberg.com/plutonium.html], > > has anyone ever seen any Russian?space official admit it might have landed > in the Andes Mountains and NOT in the deep Pacific? Or do all official > websites > still state that it did fall safely into the ocean? > > thanks! > > > _______________________________________________ > FPSPACE mailing list > FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org > http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace > > _______________________________________________ FPSPACE mailing list FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace ----- No virus found in this message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 10.0.1411 / Virus Database: 2092/3978 - Release Date: 10/27/11 From drwoods at stny.rr.com Sat Oct 29 21:02:57 2011 From: drwoods at stny.rr.com (David R. Woods) Date: Sat, 29 Oct 2011 21:02:57 -0400 Subject: [FPSPACE] FPSpace server problems Message-ID: <4EACA241.90302@stny.rr.com> -------- Original Message -------- Subject: Re: FPSpace server problems Date: Sat, 29 Oct 2011 20:59:08 +0200 From: Greg To: David R. Woods Dave, before I could fix this, I ended up traveling - just got into Cairo yesterday and probably here for two weeks. So .. I doubt I'll have time to find out why our SSL servers are not working (something about certificates) so I just reverted back to old version of configuration files and commented out all references to SSL. Your web stuff should be back up. I'll try to implement a better fix once I get back home. Thanks for your patience with this. Greg -------- Original Message -------- > Subject: Re: FPSpace server problems > Date: Tue, 25 Oct 2011 11:42:48 -0400 > From: Greg > To: David R. Woods > > > > David, I'm sorry for this trouble - I was trying to fix other problems on the > web server last night (trying to get the old F&P server back up) and everything > else broke. I'll try to have all working again by this evening. The nightmare > of this O/S upgrade continues but I think/hope is about over .. Greg > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From drwoods at stny.rr.com Sun Oct 30 17:02:18 2011 From: drwoods at stny.rr.com (David R. Woods) Date: Sun, 30 Oct 2011 17:02:18 -0400 Subject: [FPSPACE] FPSpace server problems Message-ID: <4EADBB5A.5030400@stny.rr.com> -------- Original Message -------- Subject: Re: FPSpace server problems Date: Sun, 30 Oct 2011 15:03:43 +0200 From: Greg Cole To: David R. Woods David, I think/hope fixed everything this morning - please let me know if all ok now .. I will be in meetings the next 9-10 hours but will check email again when get back to hotel this evening .. Greg From clj at panix.com Sun Oct 30 17:41:13 2011 From: clj at panix.com (Chris Jones) Date: Sun, 30 Oct 2011 17:41:13 -0400 Subject: [FPSPACE] NASA commentary on Progress M-13M Message-ID: <20111030174113.2fd1c127@Cloyd> I watched the NASA TV coverage of the Progress M-13M launch (you can see it here http://www.spaceref.com/news/viewsr.rss.spacewire.html?pid=38902). In addition to calling it Progress 45 throughout, the NASA commentator (who I think I will choose to call Dick Navelless) referred to the upcoming escape tower jettison about 2 minutes after launch (when Progress craft don't launch with escape towers). Way to call 'em, Dick. From agzak at optonline.net Sun Oct 30 18:47:38 2011 From: agzak at optonline.net (Anatoly Zak) Date: Sun, 30 Oct 2011 18:47:38 -0400 Subject: [FPSPACE] NASA commentary on Progress M-13M In-Reply-To: <20111030174113.2fd1c127@Cloyd> Message-ID: NASA also "congratulated" Roskosmos with the "success", even though the spacecraft is yet to reach the station: "...this successful flight sets the stage for the next Soyuz launch, planned for mid-November." http://www.nasa.gov/home/hqnews/2011/oct/HQ_11-366_Progress_Launch_Statement .html :) On 10/30/11 5:41 PM, "Chris Jones" wrote: > I watched the NASA TV coverage of the Progress M-13M launch (you can see it > here http://www.spaceref.com/news/viewsr.rss.spacewire.html?pid=38902). In > addition to calling it Progress 45 throughout, the NASA commentator (who I > think I will choose to call Dick Navelless) referred to the upcoming escape > tower jettison about 2 minutes after launch (when Progress craft don't > launch with escape towers). > > Way to call 'em, Dick. > _______________________________________________ > FPSPACE mailing list > FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org > http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace From cdomashnev at acm.org Sun Oct 30 20:04:29 2011 From: cdomashnev at acm.org (Constantine A. Domashnev) Date: Sun, 30 Oct 2011 20:04:29 -0400 Subject: [FPSPACE] NASA commentary on Progress M-13M Message-ID: <000801cc9760$a95fe370$0800a8c0@vosem> To the best of my recollection: after the docking hatch rim was wiped, the departing TMA-21 crew radioed from the Soyuz: "??? - ???????". ["Close the hatch."] One could hear on NASA TV the voice-over of an interpreter at the Johnson MCC saying "Hatch is closed" ["??? - ??????"] with the docking hatch still open. Not quite on the money. Not a big deal; just something to be aware of ... -- KD From bharwood at earthlink.net Sun Oct 30 21:02:47 2011 From: bharwood at earthlink.net (William Harwood) Date: Sun, 30 Oct 2011 21:02:47 -0400 Subject: [FPSPACE] NASA commentary on Progress M-13M In-Reply-To: <20111030174113.2fd1c127@Cloyd> References: <20111030174113.2fd1c127@Cloyd> Message-ID: <21F849D4-42B7-4977-A4EC-B981F49285FF@earthlink.net> Hi. I don't normally post comments, but your observations regarding the NASA commentary during the Progress launch this morning struck a nerve. First of all, his name is Rob Navias, and he knows more about the Russian space program than many on this list. Yes, he misspoke when he mentioned the escape tower, but only people who have never done live broadcasting expect perfection. Everyone misspeaks from time to time, and it's certainly no justification for attacking someone on such a personal level. His body of work as a wire service reporter, from the Patty Hearst kidnapping to the Jim Jones/People's Temple tragedy to live coverage of STS-1, STS-51L, STS-26 and dozens of other shuttle flights is above reproach. He is a fanatic about accuracy and after more than 50 trips to Moscow/Kazakhstan over the past decade, he personally knows many of the people involved and makes every effort to "get it right." He has provided informative commentary for multiple Soyuz/Progress launchings and is responsible for getting Russian TV back to the U.S. so you and I can watch these flights. Given the interpretation issues, satellite links, time zones and nationalities involved, it's not a trivial undertaking. No one likes mistakes, but I would argue it's not all that remarkable when one happens during live coverage of a Russian launch event. It's remarkable there aren't many more. As for calling it Progress 45, that's the official terminology at NASA. Attacking the commentator for following the official terminology of his employer is a bit unfair. Even the Russians sign off on NASA documentation using that same terminology! In any case, that one's not the fault of the commentator. That complaint should be addressed to NASA ISS program manager Mike Suffredini or Bill Gerstenmaier, NASA's associate administrator for space operations. Again, I'm not trying to start anything and I'll I won't post anything else on this topic. But as a space reporter with nearly three decades of experience who worked with Navias back in our wire service days, I know the depth of his commitment to providing quality coverage. This was a simple slip of the tongue and the criticism was both unfair and unwarranted. Regards, Bill Harwood Merritt Island, FL From jameseoberg at comcast.net Sun Oct 30 22:45:29 2011 From: jameseoberg at comcast.net (James E Oberg) Date: Sun, 30 Oct 2011 21:45:29 -0500 Subject: [FPSPACE] Russia abolishes 'winter time' Message-ID: <9E45D9A8F80D4286BA9116636AF2F24E@ownerfbf08f40c> Sorry, I just saw this, it may prevent confusion in converting Moscow space event times in the days ahead when other countries are jumping back from 'summer time'. Russia won't, ever again. http://www.timeanddate.com/news/time/russia-winter-time.html -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From ljk4 at msn.com Sun Oct 30 22:57:15 2011 From: ljk4 at msn.com (LARRY KLAES ) Date: Mon, 31 Oct 2011 02:57:15 +0000 Subject: [FPSPACE] Fwd: We remember two distinguished planetary scientists and friends Message-ID: ---------- Sent from AT&T Wireless using Windows Live Hotmail -----Original Message----- From: PSRD Sent: 10/31/2011 2:27:29 AM To: PSRDMAIL at soest.hawaii.edu Subject: We remember two distinguished planetary scientists and friends Announcement from Planetary Science Research Discoveries [PSRD] With sadness we mark the passing of Dr. Michael Drake in September and Dr. Ronald Greeley this month. Please read our tributes. http://www.psrd.hawaii.edu/Archive/PSRDremembers_Mike.Drake.html http://www.psrd.hawaii.edu/Archive/PSRDremembers_Ron.Greeley.html ------- PSRD is an educational web site supported by NASA's SMD Cosmochemistry Program and the Hawaii Space Grant Consortium to share the latest research on meteorites, asteroids, planets, moons, interstellar dust, and other materials in our Solar System. You are subscribed to our free mailing list. We never send attachments. For more information please see http://www.psrd.hawaii.edu/PSRDsubscribe.html ------- Brought to you by Jeff Taylor and Linda Martel, Hawaii Institute of Geophysics and Planetology, University of Hawaii psrd at higp.hawaii.edu voice (808) 956-3899 fax (808) 956-6322 http://www.psrd.hawaii.edu -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From ljk4 at msn.com Sun Oct 30 23:08:06 2011 From: ljk4 at msn.com (LARRY KLAES ) Date: Mon, 31 Oct 2011 03:08:06 +0000 Subject: [FPSPACE] Fwd: [New post] Conspiracy Theories in Aerospace History: A Lesson in Critical Thinking for the Internet Age Message-ID: ---------- Sent from AT&T Wireless using Windows Live Hotmail -----Original Message----- From: Roger Launius's Blog Sent: 10/31/2011 12:02:08 AM To: ljk4 at msn.com Subject: [New post] Conspiracy Theories in Aerospace History: A Lesson in Critical Thinking for the Internet Age New post on Roger Launius's Blog [http://1.gravatar.com/blavatar/5ab615dc2687e96bf21dc4fa4be2f3ff?s=32&ts=1320019328] [http://0.gravatar.com/avatar/488baba4b54ec638fa19eeebd09b6b69?s=50&d=identicon&r=G] Conspiracy Theories in Aerospace History: A Lesson in Critical Thinking for the Internet Age by launiusr [http://launiusr.files.wordpress.com/2011/10/thumbs.jpg?w=600&h=100]Check out the educational webinar that I participated in on Friday, October 28. "Conspiracy Theories in Aerospace History: A Lesson in Critical Thinking for the Internet Age" brought together several curators from the National Air and Space Museum, an educator from???National History Day,???and a naval historian to explore the issue of critical thinking, source evaluation, and reality checking on some of the wildest stories in the histo ry of flight. We reviewed four case studies. 1. The death of Amelia Earhart in 1937 in a plane crash in the Pacific Ocean. 2. The Japanese attack on Pearl Harbor in 1941 and whether or not American officials knew before that an attack was imminent. 3. The Roswell crash in 1947 and the question of UFOs. 4. The denials of the Apollo Moon landings. We asked questions about the nature of these theories, their origins, veracity, and evidence. We especially discussed the role of the Internet as an open source of information of all types and how to assess the legitimacy of an y piece of evidence that might be presented. We had more than 2,000 teachers, students, and others participate in the webinar. Now the entire proceeding it available on-line and available here. Check out the conference archives from this educational webinar: * Thinking Critically About the Apollo Moon Landings * Thinking Critically About Amelia Earhart's Disappearance * Thinking Critically About UFOs * Thinking Critically About the Attack on Pearl Harbor We hope you find this an interesting and useful educational program. Please check it out. launiusr | October 31, 2011 at 12:01 am | Tags: 1960s, Amelia Earhart, Apollo, cold war, Department of Defense, Franklin D. Roosevelt, History, JFK, Moon, Moon race, NASA, presidential power, public perceptions, public policy, Rosell, U.S. Civil Space, UFOs, World War II | Categories: Apollo, aviation, History, Personal, Politics, Space, World War II | URL: http://wp.me/pwYu1-Ep Comment See all comments Unsubscribe or change your email settings at Manage Subscriptions. Trouble clicking? Copy and paste this URL into your browser: http://launiusr.wordpress.com/2011/10/31/conspiracy-theories-in-aerospace-history-a-lesson-in-critical-thinking-for-the-internet-age-2/ Thanks for flying with [http://s.wordpress.com/i/emails/wp-footericon.png] WordPress.com -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From pjp961 at svol.net Mon Oct 31 19:19:03 2011 From: pjp961 at svol.net (Peter Pesavento) Date: Mon, 31 Oct 2011 19:19:03 -0400 Subject: [FPSPACE] Report: Unmanned Shenzou 8 launches Message-ID: <4eaf2d1b.059dec0a.70df.525e@mx.google.com> Associated Press via Yahoo http://news.yahoo.com/report-china-unmanned-spacecraft-launches-222340913.ht ml back next Report: China unmanned spacecraft launches AP - 45 mins ago BEIJING (AP) - China's unmanned spacecraft Shenzhou 8 blasted off Tuesday morning, the Chinese state media reported. It is the latest step in what will be a decade-long effort by China to place a manned permanent space station in orbit. The state-run Xinhua News Agency said the spacecraft took off from a base in the far western city of Jiuquan. Minutes later, the news agency cited Chang Wanquan, who leads China's space program, announcing the launch a success. China launched its own space station program after being rebuffed in its attempts to join the 16-nation International Space Station, largely on objections from the United States. The U.S. is wary of the Chinese program's military links and the sharing of technology with its chief economic and political competitor. Earlier Chinese news reports did not specify a launch date for Shenzhou 8. Chinese space officials rarely speak to foreign media. The Shenzhou 8 will attempt to dock with an experimental module, carrying out maneuvers to couple with the Tiangong 1 module now in orbit. The 8.5-ton, box car-sized Tiangong 1 launched last month. Following Shenzhou 8, two more missions, at least one of them manned, are to meet up with the module next year for further practice, with astronauts staying for up to one month. Plans call for launching two other experimental modules for more tests before the actual station is launched in three sections between 2020 and 2022. At about 60 tons when completed, the Chinese station will be considerably smaller than the International Space Station, which is expected to continue operating through 2028. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From kgottschalk at uwc.ac.za Sat Oct 1 09:55:30 2011 From: kgottschalk at uwc.ac.za (Keith Gottschalk) Date: Sat, 01 Oct 2011 15:55:30 +0200 Subject: [FPSPACE] all systems go for IAC2011 Message-ID: <4E8737F2020000A60001324D@uwc.ac.za> It's now two years & four months since I sat in an astronomer's office & he asked: should we - & can we - submit a bid to host the first International Astronautical Congress in Africa in its six decades? I urged Peter Martinez to say yes (his doctorate is on asteroseismology so we knew he could make waves :) Then, since South Africa had only one member of the IAF, I had to beg my own University of the Western Cape to join, when we don't even have an engineering faculty [US: school / college]. We South Africans thought it wise to appoint in addition to the normal Local Organizing Committee a Preparatory Committee to deal with broader issues, on which I served. The easiest part was proving to the IAF exco that Cape Town's International Convention Centre could accommodate the anticipated 1600 delegates. We are a long haul destination, which would make some drop out due to airfare cost. Numbers would also be lower because our entire South African space industry, broadly defined, numbers about 200 professionals, which is less than one factory of SpaceX, Boeing, or Lockmart. By happy coincidence, the 2010 FIFA soccer cup hype preempted the anxiety queries about mugging & other crime which we anticipated because of the western press sensationalism on this. The CTICC & the neighbouring central business precinct & waterfront has the South African record for saturation coverage from over one hundred spy TV cameras & a supplementary business-funded police service. For any FPSPACErs flying in, Cape Town is the San Francisco of Africa, & it's now the southern spring. Think of 'Frisco in April, & you'll know what clothes to bring. All our chlorinated tap water is safe to drink, so don't spend 1000 times the price per litre on the latest silly fad of buying bottled water. Our biggest disappointment was being unable to arrange any good deal for the artists & cultural persons who'd like to exhibit. The IAC prices are stiff, aimed at a largely corporate engineer delegate, & so more than double the conference registration cost of a typical international academic conference. We negotiated half prices for African delegates, but even so there are under 200 delegates from Africa. The same costs per sq. metre apply to exhibitors, aimed at corporate exhibitors, which wipes out artists who are at best on university salaries. & at worst are self employed & self-underemployed. So we tried to negotiate an off-site venue for the artists, to help those who could not afford the $700 - 1000 registration. But alas the answer we got from some of the artists was that "exhibiting at a gala dinner is outdated. We want to provoke debate". So I could in the end only advise ITTACUS & other artists to maybe team up with the Association of Astronomical Artists & try to negotiate directly with the IAF exco that in future years, as they have a "Student Zone" they should also have an "Artists' zone", & extend student prices to artists. Anyone coming is more than welcome to contact me through my email address. As my high school maths marks make clear, my own two papers will be presented at symposium E4.4 on African & South African space history. Though with my RLV interests, I will also attend the sessions on hypersonic & combined cycle propulsion, & on future space transport systems where the Skylon rep will present. On Monday 3rd @ 20h00 I will, as part of our fringe programme, give a space poems & slide show off-site at a pub-restaurant called a "Touch of Madness" in Trill Rd., Observatory. hoping to meet some of you, Keith. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- All Email originating from UWC is covered by disclaimer http://www.uwc.ac.za/emaildisclaimer From pjp961 at svol.net Sat Oct 1 15:35:34 2011 From: pjp961 at svol.net (Peter Pesavento) Date: Sat, 1 Oct 2011 15:35:34 -0400 Subject: [FPSPACE] Presidential Contender (USA) Michelle Bachmann claims PRC has blinded US satellites with ground lasers Message-ID: <4e876bae.0515640a.3bb3.2cc2@mx.google.com> I am only supplying this to fpspace because it is a news story, and not to the accuracy of the claims. Michelle Bachmann is well known for making inaccurate claims while on the campaign trail.but it gets her press copy... http://news.yahoo.com/bachmann-china-blinded-united-states-satellites-214426 298.html Daily Caller via yahoo Bachmann: 'China has blinded United States satellites' The Daily Caller - 21 hrs ago Minnesota Rep. and presidential candidate Michele Bachmann talked foreign policy Friday during an interview on the Laura Ingraham Show. Specifically, she zeroed in on China, saying the country has attacked American satellites with lasers. "I'm not sharing something I shouldn't," said Bachmann, "but China has blinded United States' satellites with their lasers. They've also supplied arms to the Taliban, and they've helped North Korea deliver missiles to Iran and Pakistan . And they've assisted Iran with their nuclear program." But Bachmann didn't stop there. She doubled down on her criticisms by saying that China has also been engaged in industrial espionage against the West. "Just keep these things in mind when it comes to China - they are a very bad actor," she concluded. She prefaced her comments by reminding listeners that she's currently a member of the House Intelligence Committee and thus has access to "classified secrets." The congresswoman's comments are the second time this week she sought to highlight her foreign policy views. On Thursday, she commented on the recent uprisings in the Middle East, positing that the overthrow of dictators could pose a threat to Israel. Then, she said that President Barack Obama is to blame for the Arab Spring. "You want to know why we have [the] Arab Spring?" Bachmann asked. "Barack Obama has laid the table for the Arab Spring by demonstrating weakness from the United States of America." -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From jbcharle at gmail.com Sat Oct 1 18:13:54 2011 From: jbcharle at gmail.com (John) Date: Sat, 1 Oct 2011 17:13:54 -0500 Subject: [FPSPACE] all systems go for IAC2011 In-Reply-To: <4E8737F2020000A60001324D@uwc.ac.za> References: <4E8737F2020000A60001324D@uwc.ac.za> Message-ID: <9810CA74-9B9B-459C-AB19-091B31536BF6@gmail.com> Keith, I had hoped to attend IAC but only managed to secure the #3 backup slot on the approved list of NASA-funded travelers. My wife is even more disappointed: this destination is on her bucket list. Oh well, best wishes for great success! John Charles Houston, Texas On Oct 1, 2011, at 8:55, "Keith Gottschalk" wrote: > It's now two years & four months since I sat in an astronomer's office & he asked: should we - & can we - submit a bid to host the first International Astronautical Congress in Africa in its six decades? > > I urged Peter Martinez to say yes (his doctorate is on asteroseismology so we knew he could make waves :) Then, since South Africa had only one member of the IAF, I had to beg my own University of the Western Cape to join, when we don't even have an engineering faculty [US: school / college]. We South Africans thought it wise to appoint in addition to the normal Local Organizing Committee a Preparatory Committee to deal with broader issues, on which I served. > > The easiest part was proving to the IAF exco that Cape Town's International Convention Centre could accommodate the anticipated 1600 delegates. We are a long haul destination, which would make some drop out due to airfare cost. Numbers would also be lower because our entire South African space industry, broadly defined, numbers about 200 professionals, which is less than one factory of SpaceX, Boeing, or Lockmart. By happy coincidence, the 2010 FIFA soccer cup hype preempted the anxiety queries about mugging & other crime which we anticipated because of the western press sensationalism on this. The CTICC & the neighbouring central business precinct & waterfront has the South African record for saturation coverage from over one hundred spy TV cameras & a supplementary business-funded police service. > > For any FPSPACErs flying in, Cape Town is the San Francisco of Africa, & it's now the southern spring. Think of 'Frisco in April, & you'll know what clothes to bring. All our chlorinated tap water is safe to drink, so don't spend 1000 times the price per litre on the latest silly fad of buying bottled water. > > Our biggest disappointment was being unable to arrange any good deal for the artists & cultural persons who'd like to exhibit. The IAC prices are stiff, aimed at a largely corporate engineer delegate, & so more than double the conference registration cost of a typical international academic conference. We negotiated half prices for African delegates, but even so there are under 200 delegates from Africa. The same costs per sq. metre apply to exhibitors, aimed at corporate exhibitors, which wipes out artists who are at best on university salaries. & at worst are self employed & self-underemployed. So we tried to negotiate an off-site venue for the artists, to help those who could not afford the $700 - 1000 registration. But alas the answer we got from some of the artists was that "exhibiting at a gala dinner is outdated. We want to provoke debate". So I could in the end only advise ITTACUS & other artists to maybe team up with the Association of Astronomical Artists & try to negotiate directly with the IAF exco that in future years, as they have a "Student Zone" they should also have an "Artists' zone", & extend student prices to artists. > > Anyone coming is more than welcome to contact me through my email address. As my high school maths marks make clear, my own two papers will be presented at symposium E4.4 on African & South African space history. Though with my RLV interests, I will also attend the sessions on hypersonic & combined cycle propulsion, & on future space transport systems where the Skylon rep will present. On Monday 3rd @ 20h00 I will, as part of our fringe programme, give a space poems & slide show off-site at a pub-restaurant called a "Touch of Madness" in Trill Rd., Observatory. > > hoping to meet some of you, > Keith. > All Email originating from UWC is covered by disclaimer http://www.uwc.ac.za/emaildisclaimer > _______________________________________________ > FPSPACE mailing list > FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org > http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From phillipclark at btinternet.com Sun Oct 2 03:16:48 2011 From: phillipclark at btinternet.com (Phillip Clark) Date: Sun, 2 Oct 2011 08:16:48 +0100 Subject: [FPSPACE] Presidential Contender (USA) Michelle Bachmann claims PRChas blinded US satellites with ground lasers In-Reply-To: <4e876bae.0515640a.3bb3.2cc2@mx.google.com> References: <4e876bae.0515640a.3bb3.2cc2@mx.google.com> Message-ID: <6831965F2A154A21895039CB6FF8C104@WINDOWSPGK1XFS> Ah, this is just like the Cold War all over again, when the US Right Wing would scream about the Soviets using weapons that we now know never existed. I just hope that such rhetoric is not taken seriously without a little thing called proof. Phillip Clark ----- Original Message ----- From: Peter Pesavento To: fpspace at friends-partners.org Sent: Saturday, October 01, 2011 8:35 PM Subject: [FPSPACE] Presidential Contender (USA) Michelle Bachmann claims PRChas blinded US satellites with ground lasers I am only supplying this to fpspace because it is a news story, and not to the accuracy of the claims. Michelle Bachmann is well known for making inaccurate claims while on the campaign trail.but it gets her press copy... http://news.yahoo.com/bachmann-china-blinded-united-states-satellites-214426298.html Daily Caller via yahoo Bachmann: 'China has blinded United States satellites' The Daily Caller - 21 hrs ago Minnesota Rep. and presidential candidate Michele Bachmann talked foreign policy Friday during an interview on the Laura Ingraham Show. Specifically, she zeroed in on China, saying the country has attacked American satellites with lasers. "I'm not sharing something I shouldn't," said Bachmann, "but China has blinded United States' satellites with their lasers. They've also supplied arms to the Taliban, and they've helped North Korea deliver missiles to Iran and Pakistan . And they've assisted Iran with their nuclear program." But Bachmann didn't stop there. She doubled down on her criticisms by saying that China has also been engaged in industrial espionage against the West. "Just keep these things in mind when it comes to China - they are a very bad actor," she concluded. She prefaced her comments by reminding listeners that she's currently a member of the House Intelligence Committee and thus has access to "classified secrets." The congresswoman's comments are the second time this week she sought to highlight her foreign policy views. On Thursday, she commented on the recent uprisings in the Middle East, positing that the overthrow of dictators could pose a threat to Israel. Then, she said that President Barack Obama is to blame for the Arab Spring. "You want to know why we have [the] Arab Spring?" Bachmann asked. "Barack Obama has laid the table for the Arab Spring by demonstrating weakness from the United States of America." ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ _______________________________________________ FPSPACE mailing list FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From cpvick at globalsecurity.org Sun Oct 2 11:01:51 2011 From: cpvick at globalsecurity.org (Charles Vick) Date: Sun, 2 Oct 2011 11:01:51 -0400 Subject: [FPSPACE] Presidential Contender (USA) Michelle Bachmann claims PRChas blinded US satellites with ground lasers In-Reply-To: <6831965F2A154A21895039CB6FF8C104@WINDOWSPGK1XFS> References: <4e876bae.0515640a.3bb3.2cc2@mx.google.com> <6831965F2A154A21895039CB6FF8C104@WINDOWSPGK1XFS> Message-ID: <001201cc8114$37b157c0$a7140740$@globalsecurity.org> Yes - More US excuse for Politicians want a bee's rabble-rousers propagandas believing their own lies. Has this country become so elitist politically partisan charged greed out of control political padding that the citizenry have to contemplate the unthinkable against its own government and its agencies to restore many aspects of governance enforcement of policy & fiscal responsibility for the present generation and especially our future generation's relevance? Unfortunately today the obvious is all too apparent. Never mind muddling along fading away From: fpspace-bounces at www.friends-partners.org [mailto:fpspace-bounces at www.friends-partners.org] On Behalf Of Phillip Clark Sent: Sunday, October 02, 2011 3:17 AM To: fpspace at friends-partners.org Subject: Re: [FPSPACE] Presidential Contender (USA) Michelle Bachmann claims PRChas blinded US satellites with ground lasers Ah, this is just like the Cold War all over again, when the US Right Wing would scream about the Soviets using weapons that we now know never existed. I just hope that such rhetoric is not taken seriously without a little thing called proof. Phillip Clark ----- Original Message ----- From: Peter Pesavento To: fpspace at friends-partners.org Sent: Saturday, October 01, 2011 8:35 PM Subject: [FPSPACE] Presidential Contender (USA) Michelle Bachmann claims PRChas blinded US satellites with ground lasers I am only supplying this to fpspace because it is a news story, and not to the accuracy of the claims. Michelle Bachmann is well known for making inaccurate claims while on the campaign trail.but it gets her press copy... http://news.yahoo.com/bachmann-china-blinded-united-states-satellites-214426 298.html Daily Caller via yahoo Bachmann: 'China has blinded United States satellites' The Daily Caller - 21 hrs ago Minnesota Rep. and presidential candidate Michele Bachmann talked foreign policy Friday during an interview on the Laura Ingraham Show. Specifically, she zeroed in on China, saying the country has attacked American satellites with lasers. "I'm not sharing something I shouldn't," said Bachmann, "but China has blinded United States' satellites with their lasers. They've also supplied arms to the Taliban, and they've helped North Korea deliver missiles to Iran and Pakistan . And they've assisted Iran with their nuclear program." But Bachmann didn't stop there. She doubled down on her criticisms by saying that China has also been engaged in industrial espionage against the West. "Just keep these things in mind when it comes to China - they are a very bad actor," she concluded. She prefaced her comments by reminding listeners that she's currently a member of the House Intelligence Committee and thus has access to "classified secrets." The congresswoman's comments are the second time this week she sought to highlight her foreign policy views. On Thursday, she commented on the recent uprisings in the Middle East, positing that the overthrow of dictators could pose a threat to Israel. Then, she said that President Barack Obama is to blame for the Arab Spring. "You want to know why we have [the] Arab Spring?" Bachmann asked. "Barack Obama has laid the table for the Arab Spring by demonstrating weakness from the United States of America." _____ _______________________________________________ FPSPACE mailing list FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From dokter.nuyens at telenet.be Sun Oct 2 12:44:58 2011 From: dokter.nuyens at telenet.be (Zeger Nuyens) Date: Sun, 02 Oct 2011 18:44:58 +0200 Subject: [FPSPACE] Presidential Contender (USA) Michelle Bachmann claims PRChas blinded US satellites with ground lasers Message-ID: <4E88950A.8070508@telenet.be> Really, no connection at all with Sarah Palin? Zeger Nuyens > Ah, this is just like the Cold War all over again, when the US Right Wing would scream about the Soviets using weapons that we now know never existed. > > I just hope that such rhetoric is not taken seriously without a little thing called proof. > > Phillip Clark From jameseoberg at comcast.net Sun Oct 2 16:55:14 2011 From: jameseoberg at comcast.net (James E Oberg) Date: Sun, 2 Oct 2011 15:55:14 -0500 Subject: [FPSPACE] Presidential Contender (USA) Michelle Bachmann claimsPRChas blinded US satellites with ground lasers References: <4e876bae.0515640a.3bb3.2cc2@mx.google.com> <6831965F2A154A21895039CB6FF8C104@WINDOWSPGK1XFS> Message-ID: <565D5C76F1FF497DACC3460DE5B10359@ownerfbf08f40c> "Ah, this is just like the Cold War all over again, when the US Right Wing would scream about the Soviets using weapons that we now know never existed.' Yes, I well remember at the height of the Cold War that particularly vicious presidential campaign when the incumbant president was accused of being soft on communism and of allowing the USSR to amass a terrifying lead in ICBMs for nuclear attack on the US. The country needed a much tougher policy against the USSR and a crash program to eliminate this 'missile gap'. Richard Nixon was involved in this campaign, I recall. Awful distortions were thrown against the incumbants and the 'Missile Gap' screamers did eventually eke out a narrow victory, alas. ----- Original Message ----- From: Phillip Clark To: fpspace at friends-partners.org Sent: Sunday, October 02, 2011 2:16 AM Subject: Re: [FPSPACE] Presidential Contender (USA) Michelle Bachmann claimsPRChas blinded US satellites with ground lasers Ah, this is just like the Cold War all over again, when the US Right Wing would scream about the Soviets using weapons that we now know never existed. Phillip Clark ----- -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From dsfportree at hotmail.com Sun Oct 2 18:56:41 2011 From: dsfportree at hotmail.com (David Portree) Date: Sun, 2 Oct 2011 16:56:41 -0600 Subject: [FPSPACE] Wenchang and typhoons In-Reply-To: <1317386383.10611.YahooMailClassic@web80204.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <1317386383.10611.YahooMailClassic@web80204.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: I think this said "Wenching" at first. Imagine my disappointment. David S. F. Portree dsfportree at hotmail.com dportree at usgs.gov http://beyondapollo.blogspot.com/ http://astrogeology.usgs.gov/About/People/DavidPortree/ > Date: Fri, 30 Sep 2011 05:39:43 -0700 > From: thomsona at flash.net > To: fpspace at friends-partners.org > Subject: [FPSPACE] Wenchang and typhoons > > > Hopefully the new spaceport and theme park are going to be sturdily designed; the launch pads seem to be close to shore. OTOH, the situation is not unlike KSC, which has gotten along with similar weather circumstances. > > http://blogs.voanews.com/breaking-news/2011/09/29/deadly-typhoon-strikes-southern-chinese-island/ > > "Typhoon Nesat struck the southern Chinese island of Hainan Thursday afternoon, after pounding Hong Kong with heavy winds and rains earlier in the day. > > "Forecasters say the storm hit Wenchang city with sustained winds up to 150 kilometers an hour, making it the strongest typhoon to hit China this year. Xinhua news agency said almost 58,000 people were evacuated from low-lying areas ahead of Hainan's arrival." > > _______________________________________________ > FPSPACE mailing list > FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org > http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From pjp961 at svol.net Mon Oct 3 17:32:58 2011 From: pjp961 at svol.net (Peter Pesavento) Date: Mon, 3 Oct 2011 17:32:58 -0400 Subject: [FPSPACE] On Russia's missiles...Last three Typhoon class submarines and their armaments to be scrapped Message-ID: <4e8a2a15.6617ec0a.73b2.148e@mx.google.com> http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/europe/russia/8796904/Red-October- no-more-Russia-scraps-Cold-War-era-Typhoon-submarine.html >From the UK Telegraph (along with illustration graphic at the URL link above). -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From ljk4 at msn.com Tue Oct 4 07:40:42 2011 From: ljk4 at msn.com (LARRY KLAES) Date: Tue, 4 Oct 2011 07:40:42 -0400 Subject: [FPSPACE] So, did the Apollo astronauts take the Lunar Rover for a real joy ride? Message-ID: Harrison Schmitt once said they did: http://www.strangehistory.net/2011/10/03/joy-riding-on-the-moon/ -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From jbcharle at gmail.com Tue Oct 4 11:35:37 2011 From: jbcharle at gmail.com (John) Date: Tue, 4 Oct 2011 10:35:37 -0500 Subject: [FPSPACE] So, did the Apollo astronauts take the Lunar Rover for a real joy ride? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Larry, Not saying it didn't happen. But Apollo EVA times and progress were tightly controlled and monitored in real time with continuous downlink. On Apollo 16 John Young did an authorized off-road test of the LRV which was filmed by Charlie Duke. Al Shepard's golf swings were on live TV. Closest thing I recall hearing about an off-the-record activity during a surface EVA was when Conrad and Bean were vigorously digging through their sample bag on Apollo 12 looking for the camera timer while they claimed to be resting. (Hence their extremely dirty suits.) Plus who measured their height and distance? Maybe new LRO images can find LRV tracks with a 100-meter gap? That would confirm and identify the time, place and driver. This sounds like one of those stories so good that if it isn't true, it should be. JBC Sent from my iPhone. Please forgive typos. On Oct 4, 2011, at 6:41, "LARRY KLAES" wrote: > Harrison Schmitt once said they did: > > http://www.strangehistory.net/2011/10/03/joy-riding-on-the-moon/ > _______________________________________________ > FPSPACE mailing list > FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org > http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From davidlrickman at aol.com Thu Oct 6 20:54:42 2011 From: davidlrickman at aol.com (David L. Rickman) Date: Thu, 6 Oct 2011 20:54:42 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [FPSPACE] Lunniy Korabl Cabin/Krechet-94 Flight Simulation Message-ID: <8CE52A2D558C0A3-10BC-304A9@webmail-m097.sysops.aol.com> FPSpacers, Here is a link to a video still I would like to place: http://farm7.static.flickr.com/6106/6218749360_3614a3833d_z.jpg It appears to be a test of the Krechet-94 functionality/or Lunar cosmonaut Training, possibly taking place during a parabolic dive simulating lunar gravity. Note that the person behind the cosmonaut is wearing a strap from left shoulder to right waist, possibly to keep him in a position to help steady the cosmonaut during the ascents. Note also that the Lunar Cabin appears to be in the final configuration, with the spherical water reclamation tank to the left of the cosmonauts shoulder, and the interior light source (not the light source used for this filming) just above that. My questions are: What aircraft, what time-frame, and how long would a lunar weight parabolic dive last compared to a Zero-G test? As always, any help answering any of these questions would be greatly appreciated! Best Regards, David L. Rickman 549 Caribou Road Asheville, NC 28803 USA Follow my progress as I recreate the Soviet Lunniy Korabl spaceship in 1:5 scale at http://lunniykorabl.blogspot.com -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From jameseoberg at comcast.net Fri Oct 7 07:42:17 2011 From: jameseoberg at comcast.net (James E Oberg) Date: Fri, 7 Oct 2011 06:42:17 -0500 Subject: [FPSPACE] Roskosmos decides to abandon development of Rus-M booster Message-ID: <9C18AFE020C64413AAD1530B4BC076FE@ownerfbf08f40c> http://en.rian.ru/russia/20111007/167466227.html http://www.itar-tass.com/en/c154/242211.html Roskosmos decides to abandon development of Rus-M booster MOSCOW, October 7 (Itar-Tass) - The Federal Space Agency (Roskosmos) decided to abandon the development of a promising booster Rus-M, Roskosmos chief Vladimir Popovkin said at a question-and-answer governmental session in the State Duma on Friday. "We do not need a new rocket, we will use those that we have," he said. Popovkin elaborated that more than 37% of Roskosmos budget was allocated to develop a launch vehicle by 2015, however, these funds are very small, "so, the launch of a new booster in 2015 is not in question." -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From pjp961 at svol.net Fri Oct 7 08:17:31 2011 From: pjp961 at svol.net (Peter Pesavento) Date: Fri, 7 Oct 2011 08:17:31 -0400 Subject: [FPSPACE] No flaws found in rocket engine batch production that included Progress launch failure Message-ID: <4e8eee37.4b13e70a.0c8f.730f@mx.google.com> Associated Press via Yahoo http://news.yahoo.com/russian-space-chief-no-flaws-found-rockets-111436885.h tml Russian space chief: no flaws found in rockets AP - 57 mins ago MOSCOW (AP) - Russia's space chief says that an inspection has found no flaws in a batch of rocket engines similar to the one that has caused a crash of an unmanned cargo ship and raised doubts about future missions to the International Space Station. With NASA's space shuttles retired as of July, Russia's Soyuz rocket is the only means of getting astronauts to and from the space station. The Soyuz that failed in August is similar to the ones used to launch astronauts. The crash was blamed on an "accidental" manufacturing flaw. Russian Space Agency head Vladimir Popovkin said Friday that a check of rocket engines of the same batch has found no faults. The next Soyuz launches have been postponed pending the outcome of the probe. Popovkin said a cargo ship will be launched on Oct. 30 and a manned mission will follow on Nov. 14. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From ljk4 at msn.com Fri Oct 7 09:29:39 2011 From: ljk4 at msn.com (LARRY KLAES ) Date: Fri, 7 Oct 2011 13:29:39 +0000 Subject: [FPSPACE] Fwd: EPSC-DPS: Map of Moon Reveals Titanium Treasure Troves Message-ID: ---------- Sent from AT&T Wireless using Windows Live Hotmail -----Original Message----- From: AAS Press Officer Dr. Rick Fienberg Sent: 10/7/2011 12:34:56 PM To: Rick Fienberg Subject: EPSC-DPS: Map of Moon Reveals Titanium Treasure Troves THE FOLLOWING RELEASE WAS RECEIVED JOINTLY FROM THE EUROPEAN PLANETARY SCIENCE CONGRESS PRESS OFFICE AND THE AAS DIVISION FOR PLANETARY SCIENCES AND IS FORWARDED FOR YOUR INFORMATION. (FORWARDING DOES NOT IMPLY ENDORSEMENT BY THE AMERICAN ASTRONOMICAL SOCIETY.) Rick Fienberg, AAS Press Officer: rick.fienberg at aas.org, +1 202-328-2010 x116. 7 October 2011 Media Contacts: Anita Heward Europlanet Press Officer +44 (0) 7756 034243 anita.heward at europlanet-eu.org Vishnu Reddy Press Officer, AAS Division for Planetary Sciences +49 555 15787 579623 reddy at space.edu Nicole Staab Arizona State University nicole.staab at asu.edu ** Science contacts appear below. ** EPSC-DPS Press Office (7 October only) +33 (0)2 51 88 21 00 (English enquiries) +33 (0)2 51 88 21 01 (French enquiries) Text & Image: http://www.europlanet-eu.org/outreach/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=360&Itemid=41 SUBTLY SHADED MAP OF MOON REVEALS TITANIUM TREASURE TROVES A map of the Moon combining observations in visible and ultraviolet wavelengths shows a treasure trove of areas rich in titanium ores. Not only is titanium a valuable element, it is key to helping scientists unravel the mysteries of the Moon's interior. Mark Robinson and Brett Denevi will be presenting the results from the Lunar Reconnaissance Orbiter mission today at the joint meeting of the European Planetary Science Congress and the American Astronomical Society's Division for Planetary Sciences. "Looking up at the Moon, its surface appears painted with shades of grey -- at least to the human eye. But with the right instruments, the Moon can appear colorful," said Robinson, of Arizona State University. "The maria appear reddish in some places and blue in others. Although subtle, these color variations tell us important things about the chemistry and evolution of the lunar surface. They indicate the titanium and iron abundance, as well as the maturity of a lunar soil." The Lunar Reconnaissance Orbiter Camera (LROC) Wide Angle Camera (WAC) is imaging the surface in seven different wavelengths at a resolution of between 100 and 400 meters per pixel. Specific minerals reflect or absorb strongly certain parts of the electromagnetic spectrum, so the wavelengths detected by LROC WAC help scientists better understand the chemical composition of the lunar surface. Robinson and his team previously developed a technique using Hubble Space Telescope images to map titanium abundances around a small area centered on the Apollo 17 landing site. Samples around the site spanned a broad range of titanium levels. By comparing the Apollo data from the ground with the Hubble images, the team found that the titanium levels corresponded to the ratio of ultraviolet to visible light reflected by the lunar soils. "Our challenge was to find out whether the technique would work across broad areas, or whether there was something special about the Apollo 17 area," said Robinson. Robinson's team constructed a mosaic from around 4,000 LROC WAC images collected over one month. Using the technique they had developed with the Hubble imagery, they used the WAC ratio of the brightness in the ultraviolet to visible light to deduce titanium abundance, backed up by surface samples gathered by Apollo and Luna missions. The highest titanium abundances in similar kinds of rocks on Earth are around one percent or less. The new map shows that in the maria, titanium abundances range from about one percent to a little more than ten percent. In the highlands, everywhere titanium is less than one percent. The new titanium values match those measured in the ground samples to about one percent. "We still don't really understand why we find much higher abundances of titanium on the Moon compared to similar types of rocks on Earth. What the lunar titanium-richness does tell us is something about the conditions inside the Moon shortly after it formed, knowledge that geochemists value for understanding the evolution of the Moon," said Robinson. Lunar titanium is mostly found in the mineral ilmenite, a compound containing iron, titanium and oxygen. Future miners living and working on the Moon could break down ilmenite to liberate these elements. In addition, Apollo data shows that titanium-rich minerals are more efficient at retaining particles from the solar wind, such as helium and hydrogen. These gases would also provide a vital resource for future human inhabitants of lunar colonies. "The new map is a valuable tool for lunar exploration planning. Astronauts will want to visit places with both high scientific value and a high potential for resources that can be used to support exploration activities. Areas with high titanium provide both -- a pathway to understanding the interior of the Moon and potential mining resources," said Robinson. The new maps also shed light on how space weather changes the lunar surface. Over time, the lunar surface materials are altered by the impact of charged particles from the solar wind and high-velocity micrometeorite impacts. Together these processes work to pulverize rock into a fine powder and alter the surface's chemical composition and hence its color. Recently exposed rocks, such as the rays that are thrown out around impact craters, appear bluer and have higher reflectance than more mature soil. Over time this 'young' material darkens and reddens, disappearing into the background after about 500 million years. "One of the exciting discoveries we've made is that the effects of weathering show up much more quickly in ultraviolet than in visible or infrared wavelengths. In the LROC ultraviolet mosaics, even craters that we thought were very young appear relatively mature. Only small, very recently formed craters show up as fresh regolith exposed on the surface," said Denevi, of Johns Hopkins University Applied Physics Laboratory. The mosaics have also given important clues to why lunar swirls -- sinuous features associated with magnetic fields in the lunar crust -- are highly reflective. The new data suggest that when a magnetic field is present, it deflects the charged solar wind, slowing the maturation process and resulting in the bright swirl. The rest of the Moon's surface, which does not benefit from the protective shield of a magnetic field, is more rapidly weathered by the solar wind. This result may suggest that bombardment by charged particles may be more important than micrometeorites in weathering the Moon's surface. Science Contacts: Mark Robinson Arizona State University School of Earth and Space Exploration robinson at ser.asu.edu Brett Denevi The Johns Hopkins University Applied Physics Laboratory brett.denevi at jhuapl.edu Figure 1: http://www.europlanet-eu.org/outreach/images/stories/ep/news/epsc2011/lroc_picture1.jpg LROC WAC mosaic showing the boundary between Mare Serenitatis and Mare Tranquillitatis. The relative blue color of the Tranquillitatis mare is due to higher abundances of the titanium-bearing mineral ilmenite. Enhanced color formed as 689 nm filter image in red, 415 nm in green, and 321 nm in blue [NASA/GSFC/Arizona State University]. Figure 2: http://www.europlanet-eu.org/outreach/images/stories/ep/news/epsc2011/lroc_picture2.jpg Full-resolution WAC three-color composite (566 nm filter image in red, 360 nm in green, and 321 nm in blue) highlighting regions with varying mare compositions and enigmatic small volcanic structures known as "domes" [NASA/GSFC/Arizona State University]. Figure 3: http://www.europlanet-eu.org/outreach/images/stories/ep/news/epsc2011/lroc_picture3.jpg LROC WAC color ratio 321/415 nm shows little variation due to crater rays. The dark haloed crater, Giordano Bruno, in the upper center is thought to be quite young and thus "immature" and thus still has a distinct UV signature. The most immature material on the Moon as defined by the UV maturity signal are the enigmatic "swirls". The swirls are likely due to local relatively intense magnetic fields standing off the solar wind and thus protecting mineral grains from the maturing effects of solar wind sputtering [NASA/GSFC/Arizona State University]. Figure 4: http://www.europlanet-eu.org/outreach/images/stories/ep/news/epsc2011/lroc_picture4.jpg LROC Wide Angle Camera mosaic centered on the lunar swirl Reiner Gamma and corresponding UV/visible light ratio (321/415 nm) [NASA/GSFC/Arizona State University]. Further Information Lunar Reconnaissance Orbiter was built and is managed by NASA's Goddard Space Flight Center, Greenbelt, Md. The exploration phase was funded by NASA's Exploration Systems Missions Directorate in Washington, D.C. LRO operates under NASA's Science Mission Directorate. # # # EPSC-DPS Joint Meeting 2011 The EPSC-DPS Joint Meeting 2011 represents the first cooperation between the European Planetary Science Congress (EPSC) organized by the Europlanet Research Infrastructure and the Division for Planetary Sciences of the American Astronomical Society. The meeting is being organized in association with the European Geosciences Union and with the support of the Universit??? de Nantes. More than 1,800 abstracts for oral presentations and posters have been submitted for the meeting. EPSC-DPS 2011 provides a platform for the worldwide planetary sciences community to exchange and present results, develop new ideas and network. It has a distinctively interactive style, with an extensive mix of talks, workshops and posters, intended to provide a stimulating environment for the community to meet. The meeting covers the entire scope of the planetary sciences. Details of the congress can be found at the official website: http://meetings.copernicus.org/epsc-dps2011/ Session overview: http://www.europlanet-eu.org/outreach/images/stories/ep/epsc-dps2011schedule.pdf EUROPLANET The Europlanet Research Infrastructure is a major (???6 million) program co-funded by the European Union under the Seventh Framework Programme of the European Commission. Europlanet's Networking Activities provide European planetary scientists with the opportunity to define key science goals, and to exchange ideas and personnel. Europlanet provides TransNational Access to leading laboratory and field site facilities tailored to the needs of planetary research for Planetary Sciences, developing them further through highly focused Joint Research Activities. It is building a Virtual Planetary Observatory where all types of planetary data can be accessed. Europlanet Project website: http://www.europlanet-ri.eu Europlanet Outreach website: http://www.europlanet-eu.org Follow @europlanetmedia on Twitter DPS The Division for Planetary Sciences (DPS) of the American Astronomical Society (AAS) is the largest organization of professional planetary scientists in the world. The DPS was formed in 1968 as a sub-organization within the AAS devoted to solar system and extrasolar planet research. Today it is the largest special interest Division of the AAS. DPS website: http://dps.aas.org ------------------------------------------------------------------------ If you do not wish to receive press releases that are forwarded to the news media by the American Astronomical Society, please unsubscribe by replying accordingly to any incoming press release, or send e-mail to rick.fienberg at aas.org. Requests for referrals to experts on astronomy and space science should be sent to the same address. Rick Fienberg, AAS Press Officer, +1 202-328-2010 x116, @AAS_Press (Twitter). -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From cpvick at globalsecurity.org Fri Oct 7 09:35:05 2011 From: cpvick at globalsecurity.org (Charles Vick) Date: Fri, 7 Oct 2011 09:35:05 -0400 Subject: [FPSPACE] Roskosmos decides to abandon development of Rus-M booster In-Reply-To: <9C18AFE020C64413AAD1530B4BC076FE@ownerfbf08f40c> References: <9C18AFE020C64413AAD1530B4BC076FE@ownerfbf08f40c> Message-ID: <002601cc84f5$ecd90000$c68b0000$@globalsecurity.org> That will be devastating to Samara , Energiya, KBKhA [Chemical Automatics Design Bureau (KB)] of Voronezh, NPO Energomash of Khimki, Moscow r, Samara based TsSKB Progress, S. P. Korolev, Rocket Space Corporation Energiya, of Korolev, Moscow region and the KB Makeyev of Miass organizations. But makes Khrunichev the victor further it makes the new Cosmodrome of Vostochniy (Eastern) Cosmodrome highly questionable to justify. From: fpspace-bounces at www.friends-partners.org [mailto:fpspace-bounces at www.friends-partners.org] On Behalf Of James E Oberg Sent: Friday, October 07, 2011 7:42 AM To: fpspace at friends-partners.org Subject: [FPSPACE] Roskosmos decides to abandon development of Rus-M booster http://en.rian.ru/russia/20111007/167466227.html http://www.itar-tass.com/en/c154/242211.html Roskosmos decides to abandon development of Rus-M booster MOSCOW, October 7 (Itar-Tass) - The Federal Space Agency (Roskosmos) decided to abandon the development of a promising booster Rus-M, Roskosmos chief Vladimir Popovkin said at a question-and-answer governmental session in the State Duma on Friday. "We do not need a new rocket, we will use those that we have," he said. Popovkin elaborated that more than 37% of Roskosmos budget was allocated to develop a launch vehicle by 2015, however, these funds are very small, "so, the launch of a new booster in 2015 is not in question." -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From kgottschalk at uwc.ac.za Fri Oct 7 09:39:59 2011 From: kgottschalk at uwc.ac.za (Keith Gottschalk) Date: Fri, 07 Oct 2011 15:39:59 +0200 Subject: [FPSPACE] Roskosmos decides to abandon development of Rus-M booster Message-ID: <4E8F1D4F020000A600013746@uwc.ac.za> I assume that the main purpose of Vostochniy is to limit the ability of Khazakhstan to keep on rack-raising the rent on Baikonyur. Just as SpaceX limits the amount the Russians can raise the tickets for astronauts toISS. - Keith >>> "Charles Vick" 10/07/11 3:35 PM >>> That will be devastating to Samara , Energiya, KBKhA [Chemical Automatics Design Bureau (KB)] of Voronezh, NPO Energomash of Khimki, Moscow r, Samara based TsSKB Progress, S. P. Korolev, Rocket Space Corporation Energiya, of Korolev, Moscow region and the KB Makeyev of Miass organizations. But makes Khrunichev the victor further it makes the new Cosmodrome of Vostochniy (Eastern) Cosmodrome highly questionable to justify. From: fpspace-bounces at www.friends-partners.org [mailto:fpspace-bounces at www.friends-partners.org] On Behalf Of James E Oberg Sent: Friday, October 07, 2011 7:42 AM To: fpspace at friends-partners.org Subject: [FPSPACE] Roskosmos decides to abandon development of Rus-M booster http://en.rian.ru/russia/20111007/167466227.html http://www.itar-tass.com/en/c154/242211.html Roskosmos decides to abandon development of Rus-M booster MOSCOW, October 7 (Itar-Tass) * The Federal Space Agency (Roskosmos) decided to abandon the development of a promising booster Rus-M, Roskosmos chief Vladimir Popovkin said at a question-and-answer governmental session in the State Duma on Friday. *We do not need a new rocket, we will use those that we have,* he said. Popovkin elaborated that more than 37% of Roskosmos budget was allocated to develop a launch vehicle by 2015, however, these funds are very small, *so, the launch of a new booster in 2015 is not in question.* -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- All Email originating from UWC is covered by disclaimer http://www.uwc.ac.za/emaildisclaimer From agzak at optonline.net Fri Oct 7 09:49:23 2011 From: agzak at optonline.net (Anatoly Zak) Date: Fri, 07 Oct 2011 09:49:23 -0400 Subject: [FPSPACE] Roskosmos decides to abandon development of Rus-M booster In-Reply-To: <002601cc84f5$ecd90000$c68b0000$@globalsecurity.org> Message-ID: It is certainly unpleasant news to Samara, but it is still busy with Soyuz family, so the company would be able to maintain its work force for the time being. However the latest idea of bringing Soyuz to Vostochny is obviously extremely silly and, probably, would die too. As they say in Russia, when you say ?A? you have to say ?B?. If they decided to kill Rus-M, they should abandon Vostochny as well. Anatoly Zak http://www.RussianSpaceWeb.com On 10/7/11 9:35 AM, "Charles Vick" wrote: > That will be devastating to Samara , Energiya, KBKhA [Chemical Automatics > Design Bureau (KB)] of Voronezh, NPO Energomash of Khimki, Moscow r, Samara > based TsSKB Progress, S. P. Korolev, Rocket Space Corporation Energiya, of > Korolev, Moscow region and the KB Makeyev of Miass organizations. But makes > Khrunichev the victor further it makes the new Cosmodrome of Vostochniy > (Eastern) Cosmodrome highly questionable to justify. > > > From: fpspace-bounces at www.friends-partners.org > [mailto:fpspace-bounces at www.friends-partners.org] On Behalf Of James E Oberg > Sent: Friday, October 07, 2011 7:42 AM > To: fpspace at friends-partners.org > Subject: [FPSPACE] Roskosmos decides to abandon development of Rus-M booster > > > http://en.rian.ru/russia/20111007/167466227.html > http://www.itar-tass.com/en/c154/242211.html > > > Roskosmos decides to abandon development of Rus-M booster > MOSCOW, October 7 (Itar-Tass) ? The Federal Space Agency (Roskosmos) decided > to abandon the development of a promising booster Rus-M, Roskosmos chief > Vladimir Popovkin said at a question-and-answer governmental session in the > State Duma on Friday. > > ?We do not need a new rocket, we will use those that we have,? he said. > > Popovkin elaborated that more than 37% of Roskosmos budget was allocated to > develop a launch vehicle by 2015, however, these funds are very small, ?so, > the launch of a new booster in 2015 is not in question.? > > > _______________________________________________ > FPSPACE mailing list > FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org > http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From thomsona at flash.net Fri Oct 7 09:57:32 2011 From: thomsona at flash.net (Allen Thomson) Date: Fri, 7 Oct 2011 06:57:32 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [FPSPACE] Roskosmos decides to abandon development of Rus-M booster Message-ID: <1317995852.94680.YahooMailClassic@web80205.mail.mud.yahoo.com> > If they decided to kill Rus-M, they should abandon Vostochny as well. How far along is construction at Vostochny? The Google Earth coverage is old and just shows the former ICBM facilities. From cpvick at globalsecurity.org Fri Oct 7 10:13:49 2011 From: cpvick at globalsecurity.org (Charles Vick) Date: Fri, 7 Oct 2011 10:13:49 -0400 Subject: [FPSPACE] Roskosmos decides to abandon development of Rus-M booster In-Reply-To: References: <002601cc84f5$ecd90000$c68b0000$@globalsecurity.org> Message-ID: <000701cc84fb$55b7d330$01277990$@globalsecurity.org> To delay RUS-M is ok but cancelling is quite another thing meaning they must rethink Baikonur totally and become diplomats for once From: fpspace-bounces at www.friends-partners.org [mailto:fpspace-bounces at www.friends-partners.org] On Behalf Of Anatoly Zak Sent: Friday, October 07, 2011 9:49 AM To: Untitled Subject: Re: [FPSPACE] Roskosmos decides to abandon development of Rus-M booster It is certainly unpleasant news to Samara, but it is still busy with Soyuz family, so the company would be able to maintain its work force for the time being. However the latest idea of bringing Soyuz to Vostochny is obviously extremely silly and, probably, would die too. As they say in Russia, when you say "A" you have to say "B". If they decided to kill Rus-M, they should abandon Vostochny as well. Anatoly Zak http://www.RussianSpaceWeb.com On 10/7/11 9:35 AM, "Charles Vick" wrote: That will be devastating to Samara , Energiya, KBKhA [Chemical Automatics Design Bureau (KB)] of Voronezh, NPO Energomash of Khimki, Moscow r, Samara based TsSKB Progress, S. P. Korolev, Rocket Space Corporation Energiya, of Korolev, Moscow region and the KB Makeyev of Miass organizations. But makes Khrunichev the victor further it makes the new Cosmodrome of Vostochniy (Eastern) Cosmodrome highly questionable to justify. From: fpspace-bounces at www.friends-partners.org [mailto:fpspace-bounces at www.friends-partners.org] On Behalf Of James E Oberg Sent: Friday, October 07, 2011 7:42 AM To: fpspace at friends-partners.org Subject: [FPSPACE] Roskosmos decides to abandon development of Rus-M booster http://en.rian.ru/russia/20111007/167466227.html http://www.itar-tass.com/en/c154/242211.html Roskosmos decides to abandon development of Rus-M booster MOSCOW, October 7 (Itar-Tass) - The Federal Space Agency (Roskosmos) decided to abandon the development of a promising booster Rus-M, Roskosmos chief Vladimir Popovkin said at a question-and-answer governmental session in the State Duma on Friday. "We do not need a new rocket, we will use those that we have," he said. Popovkin elaborated that more than 37% of Roskosmos budget was allocated to develop a launch vehicle by 2015, however, these funds are very small, "so, the launch of a new booster in 2015 is not in question." _____ _______________________________________________ FPSPACE mailing list FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From agzak at optonline.net Fri Oct 7 10:14:48 2011 From: agzak at optonline.net (Anatoly Zak) Date: Fri, 07 Oct 2011 10:14:48 -0400 Subject: [FPSPACE] Roskosmos decides to abandon development of Rus-M booster In-Reply-To: <1317995852.94680.YahooMailClassic@web80205.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: It is mostly a paper project. The investment so far has been probably minimal: http://www.russianspaceweb.com/svobodny.html#2010 Anatoly Zak On 10/7/11 9:57 AM, "Allen Thomson" wrote: >> If they decided to kill Rus-M, they should abandon Vostochny as well. > > How far along is construction at Vostochny? The Google Earth coverage is old > and just shows the former ICBM facilities. > > > > _______________________________________________ > FPSPACE mailing list > FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org > http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace From cpvick at globalsecurity.org Fri Oct 7 10:25:13 2011 From: cpvick at globalsecurity.org (Charles Vick) Date: Fri, 7 Oct 2011 10:25:13 -0400 Subject: [FPSPACE] Roskosmos decides to abandon development of Rus-M booster In-Reply-To: References: <002601cc84f5$ecd90000$c68b0000$@globalsecurity.org> Message-ID: <001101cc84fc$edcbe750$c963b5f0$@globalsecurity.org> I guess Popovkin is determined to force out the funds for unmanned military science programs and not the future S&T development of the country's economy a very bad omen as I see it From: fpspace-bounces at www.friends-partners.org [mailto:fpspace-bounces at www.friends-partners.org] On Behalf Of Anatoly Zak Sent: Friday, October 07, 2011 9:49 AM To: Untitled Subject: Re: [FPSPACE] Roskosmos decides to abandon development of Rus-M booster It is certainly unpleasant news to Samara, but it is still busy with Soyuz family, so the company would be able to maintain its work force for the time being. However the latest idea of bringing Soyuz to Vostochny is obviously extremely silly and, probably, would die too. As they say in Russia, when you say "A" you have to say "B". If they decided to kill Rus-M, they should abandon Vostochny as well. Anatoly Zak http://www.RussianSpaceWeb.com On 10/7/11 9:35 AM, "Charles Vick" wrote: That will be devastating to Samara , Energiya, KBKhA [Chemical Automatics Design Bureau (KB)] of Voronezh, NPO Energomash of Khimki, Moscow r, Samara based TsSKB Progress, S. P. Korolev, Rocket Space Corporation Energiya, of Korolev, Moscow region and the KB Makeyev of Miass organizations. But makes Khrunichev the victor further it makes the new Cosmodrome of Vostochniy (Eastern) Cosmodrome highly questionable to justify. From: fpspace-bounces at www.friends-partners.org [mailto:fpspace-bounces at www.friends-partners.org] On Behalf Of James E Oberg Sent: Friday, October 07, 2011 7:42 AM To: fpspace at friends-partners.org Subject: [FPSPACE] Roskosmos decides to abandon development of Rus-M booster http://en.rian.ru/russia/20111007/167466227.html http://www.itar-tass.com/en/c154/242211.html Roskosmos decides to abandon development of Rus-M booster MOSCOW, October 7 (Itar-Tass) - The Federal Space Agency (Roskosmos) decided to abandon the development of a promising booster Rus-M, Roskosmos chief Vladimir Popovkin said at a question-and-answer governmental session in the State Duma on Friday. "We do not need a new rocket, we will use those that we have," he said. Popovkin elaborated that more than 37% of Roskosmos budget was allocated to develop a launch vehicle by 2015, however, these funds are very small, "so, the launch of a new booster in 2015 is not in question." _____ _______________________________________________ FPSPACE mailing list FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From cpvick at globalsecurity.org Fri Oct 7 10:34:09 2011 From: cpvick at globalsecurity.org (Charles Vick) Date: Fri, 7 Oct 2011 10:34:09 -0400 Subject: [FPSPACE] Roskosmos decides to abandon development of Rus-M booster References: <002601cc84f5$ecd90000$c68b0000$@globalsecurity.org> Message-ID: <001601cc84fe$2d6f99f0$884ecdd0$@globalsecurity.org> This makes me wonder if the economic bubble has broken over there? From: Charles Vick [mailto:cpvick at globalsecurity.org] Sent: Friday, October 07, 2011 10:25 AM To: 'Anatoly Zak'; 'Untitled' Subject: RE: [FPSPACE] Roskosmos decides to abandon development of Rus-M booster I guess Popovkin is determined to force out the funds for unmanned military science programs and not the future S&T development of the country's economy a very bad omen as I see it From: fpspace-bounces at www.friends-partners.org [mailto:fpspace-bounces at www.friends-partners.org] On Behalf Of Anatoly Zak Sent: Friday, October 07, 2011 9:49 AM To: Untitled Subject: Re: [FPSPACE] Roskosmos decides to abandon development of Rus-M booster It is certainly unpleasant news to Samara, but it is still busy with Soyuz family, so the company would be able to maintain its work force for the time being. However the latest idea of bringing Soyuz to Vostochny is obviously extremely silly and, probably, would die too. As they say in Russia, when you say "A" you have to say "B". If they decided to kill Rus-M, they should abandon Vostochny as well. Anatoly Zak http://www.RussianSpaceWeb.com On 10/7/11 9:35 AM, "Charles Vick" wrote: That will be devastating to Samara , Energiya, KBKhA [Chemical Automatics Design Bureau (KB)] of Voronezh, NPO Energomash of Khimki, Moscow r, Samara based TsSKB Progress, S. P. Korolev, Rocket Space Corporation Energiya, of Korolev, Moscow region and the KB Makeyev of Miass organizations. But makes Khrunichev the victor further it makes the new Cosmodrome of Vostochniy (Eastern) Cosmodrome highly questionable to justify. From: fpspace-bounces at www.friends-partners.org [mailto:fpspace-bounces at www.friends-partners.org] On Behalf Of James E Oberg Sent: Friday, October 07, 2011 7:42 AM To: fpspace at friends-partners.org Subject: [FPSPACE] Roskosmos decides to abandon development of Rus-M booster http://en.rian.ru/russia/20111007/167466227.html http://www.itar-tass.com/en/c154/242211.html Roskosmos decides to abandon development of Rus-M booster MOSCOW, October 7 (Itar-Tass) - The Federal Space Agency (Roskosmos) decided to abandon the development of a promising booster Rus-M, Roskosmos chief Vladimir Popovkin said at a question-and-answer governmental session in the State Duma on Friday. "We do not need a new rocket, we will use those that we have," he said. Popovkin elaborated that more than 37% of Roskosmos budget was allocated to develop a launch vehicle by 2015, however, these funds are very small, "so, the launch of a new booster in 2015 is not in question." _____ _______________________________________________ FPSPACE mailing list FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From agzak at optonline.net Fri Oct 7 10:35:07 2011 From: agzak at optonline.net (Anatoly Zak) Date: Fri, 07 Oct 2011 10:35:07 -0400 Subject: [FPSPACE] Roskosmos decides to abandon development of Rus-M booster In-Reply-To: <000701cc84fb$55b7d330$01277990$@globalsecurity.org> Message-ID: RKK Energia long believed that Rus-M and Votochny were unaffordable pipe dreams. They would actually prefer to fly sooner from Baikonur on a Zenit-derived booster: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/science-environment-10725093 In the future, if real statesmen at NASA, ESA and Roskosmos reach an agreement on the joint moon base or even Mars expedition, they can easily build a heavy-lifting rocket ... and launch it from Kourou! :) Anatoly Zak On 10/7/11 10:13 AM, "Charles Vick" wrote: > To delay RUS-M is ok but cancelling is quite another thing meaning they must > rethink Baikonur totally and become diplomats for once > > > > From: fpspace-bounces at www.friends-partners.org > [mailto:fpspace-bounces at www.friends-partners.org] On Behalf Of Anatoly Zak > Sent: Friday, October 07, 2011 9:49 AM > To: Untitled > Subject: Re: [FPSPACE] Roskosmos decides to abandon development of Rus-M > booster > > It is certainly unpleasant news to Samara, but it is still busy with Soyuz > family, so the company would be able to maintain its work force for the time > being. However the latest idea of bringing Soyuz to Vostochny is obviously > extremely silly and, probably, would die too. As they say in Russia, when you > say ?A? you have to say ?B?. If they decided to kill Rus-M, they should > abandon Vostochny as well. > > Anatoly Zak > http://www.RussianSpaceWeb.com > > > > > > > On 10/7/11 9:35 AM, "Charles Vick" wrote: > That will be devastating to Samara , Energiya, KBKhA [Chemical Automatics > Design Bureau (KB)] of Voronezh, NPO Energomash of Khimki, Moscow r, Samara > based TsSKB Progress, S. P. Korolev, Rocket Space Corporation Energiya, of > Korolev, Moscow region and the KB Makeyev of Miass organizations. But makes > Khrunichev the victor further it makes the new Cosmodrome of Vostochniy > (Eastern) Cosmodrome highly questionable to justify. > > > From: fpspace-bounces at www.friends-partners.org > [mailto:fpspace-bounces at www.friends-partners.org] On Behalf Of James E Oberg > Sent: Friday, October 07, 2011 7:42 AM > To: fpspace at friends-partners.org > Subject: [FPSPACE] Roskosmos decides to abandon development of Rus-M booster > > > http://en.rian.ru/russia/20111007/167466227.html > http://www.itar-tass.com/en/c154/242211.html > > > Roskosmos decides to abandon development of Rus-M booster > MOSCOW, October 7 (Itar-Tass) ? The Federal Space Agency (Roskosmos) decided > to abandon the development of a promising booster Rus-M, Roskosmos chief > Vladimir Popovkin said at a question-and-answer governmental session in the > State Duma on Friday. > > ?We do not need a new rocket, we will use those that we have,? he said. > > Popovkin elaborated that more than 37% of Roskosmos budget was allocated to > develop a launch vehicle by 2015, however, these funds are very small, ?so, > the launch of a new booster in 2015 is not in question.? > > > _______________________________________________ > FPSPACE mailing list > FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org > http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From cpvick at globalsecurity.org Fri Oct 7 11:02:23 2011 From: cpvick at globalsecurity.org (Charles Vick) Date: Fri, 7 Oct 2011 11:02:23 -0400 Subject: [FPSPACE] Roskosmos decides to abandon development of Rus-M booster In-Reply-To: References: <000701cc84fb$55b7d330$01277990$@globalsecurity.org> Message-ID: <003301cc8502$1f0a76b0$5d1f6410$@globalsecurity.org> I guess this is the de-emphasis of manned flight that Popovkin spoke of in August as desired looking for financial return for investment. This defines his leadership as being pragmatic at best. From: fpspace-bounces at www.friends-partners.org [mailto:fpspace-bounces at www.friends-partners.org] On Behalf Of Anatoly Zak Sent: Friday, October 07, 2011 10:35 AM To: Untitled Subject: Re: [FPSPACE] Roskosmos decides to abandon development of Rus-M booster RKK Energia long believed that Rus-M and Votochny were unaffordable pipe dreams. They would actually prefer to fly sooner from Baikonur on a Zenit-derived booster: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/science-environment-10725093 In the future, if real statesmen at NASA, ESA and Roskosmos reach an agreement on the joint moon base or even Mars expedition, they can easily build a heavy-lifting rocket ... and launch it from Kourou! :) Anatoly Zak On 10/7/11 10:13 AM, "Charles Vick" wrote: To delay RUS-M is ok but cancelling is quite another thing meaning they must rethink Baikonur totally and become diplomats for once From: fpspace-bounces at www.friends-partners.org [mailto:fpspace-bounces at www.friends-partners.org] On Behalf Of Anatoly Zak Sent: Friday, October 07, 2011 9:49 AM To: Untitled Subject: Re: [FPSPACE] Roskosmos decides to abandon development of Rus-M booster It is certainly unpleasant news to Samara, but it is still busy with Soyuz family, so the company would be able to maintain its work force for the time being. However the latest idea of bringing Soyuz to Vostochny is obviously extremely silly and, probably, would die too. As they say in Russia, when you say "A" you have to say "B". If they decided to kill Rus-M, they should abandon Vostochny as well. Anatoly Zak http://www.RussianSpaceWeb.com On 10/7/11 9:35 AM, "Charles Vick" wrote: That will be devastating to Samara , Energiya, KBKhA [Chemical Automatics Design Bureau (KB)] of Voronezh, NPO Energomash of Khimki, Moscow r, Samara based TsSKB Progress, S. P. Korolev, Rocket Space Corporation Energiya, of Korolev, Moscow region and the KB Makeyev of Miass organizations. But makes Khrunichev the victor further it makes the new Cosmodrome of Vostochniy (Eastern) Cosmodrome highly questionable to justify. From: fpspace-bounces at www.friends-partners.org [mailto:fpspace-bounces at www.friends-partners.org] On Behalf Of James E Oberg Sent: Friday, October 07, 2011 7:42 AM To: fpspace at friends-partners.org Subject: [FPSPACE] Roskosmos decides to abandon development of Rus-M booster http://en.rian.ru/russia/20111007/167466227.html http://www.itar-tass.com/en/c154/242211.html Roskosmos decides to abandon development of Rus-M booster MOSCOW, October 7 (Itar-Tass) - The Federal Space Agency (Roskosmos) decided to abandon the development of a promising booster Rus-M, Roskosmos chief Vladimir Popovkin said at a question-and-answer governmental session in the State Duma on Friday. "We do not need a new rocket, we will use those that we have," he said. Popovkin elaborated that more than 37% of Roskosmos budget was allocated to develop a launch vehicle by 2015, however, these funds are very small, "so, the launch of a new booster in 2015 is not in question." _____ _______________________________________________ FPSPACE mailing list FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From cdomashnev at acm.org Fri Oct 7 11:22:11 2011 From: cdomashnev at acm.org (Constantine Domashnev) Date: Fri, 7 Oct 2011 11:22:11 -0400 Subject: [FPSPACE] Roskosmos decides to abandon development of Rus-M booster In-Reply-To: <003301cc8502$1f0a76b0$5d1f6410$@globalsecurity.org> Message-ID: <4F2BBBE3E2194B139E2F92DFF0BCC1DD@Tosha> >From what I understand, the exact wording is rather "to suspend" as oppose to "to abandon". KD From cpvick at globalsecurity.org Fri Oct 7 11:45:11 2011 From: cpvick at globalsecurity.org (Charles Vick) Date: Fri, 7 Oct 2011 11:45:11 -0400 Subject: [FPSPACE] Roskosmos decides to abandon development of Rus-M booster In-Reply-To: <4F2BBBE3E2194B139E2F92DFF0BCC1DD@Tosha> References: <003301cc8502$1f0a76b0$5d1f6410$@globalsecurity.org> <4F2BBBE3E2194B139E2F92DFF0BCC1DD@Tosha> Message-ID: <004701cc8508$19653f00$4c2fbd00$@globalsecurity.org> That is my impression until mission decisions programs are developed and the new launch infrastructure will take much longer to build regardless of the funding as that is like building the N1 facility all over again 1962-1971 in reality based on imagery or the better part of two five year plans alone. I just think Baikonur would be more responsible economically -----Original Message----- From: fpspace-bounces at www.friends-partners.org [mailto:fpspace-bounces at www.friends-partners.org] On Behalf Of Constantine Domashnev Sent: Friday, October 07, 2011 11:22 AM To: fpspace at www.friends-partners.org Subject: Re: [FPSPACE] Roskosmos decides to abandon development of Rus-M booster >From what I understand, the exact wording is rather "to suspend" as oppose to "to abandon". KD _______________________________________________ FPSPACE mailing list FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace From cpvick at globalsecurity.org Fri Oct 7 11:48:02 2011 From: cpvick at globalsecurity.org (Charles Vick) Date: Fri, 7 Oct 2011 11:48:02 -0400 Subject: [FPSPACE] Roskosmos decides to abandon development of Rus-M booster In-Reply-To: <4F2BBBE3E2194B139E2F92DFF0BCC1DD@Tosha> References: <003301cc8502$1f0a76b0$5d1f6410$@globalsecurity.org> <4F2BBBE3E2194B139E2F92DFF0BCC1DD@Tosha> Message-ID: <004801cc8508$7f6aa5b0$7e3ff110$@globalsecurity.org> I also expect more emphasis on Baikonur and communication satellites as well as navigation and meteorological satellites that pay back on investments. -----Original Message----- From: fpspace-bounces at www.friends-partners.org [mailto:fpspace-bounces at www.friends-partners.org] On Behalf Of Constantine Domashnev Sent: Friday, October 07, 2011 11:22 AM To: fpspace at www.friends-partners.org Subject: Re: [FPSPACE] Roskosmos decides to abandon development of Rus-M booster >From what I understand, the exact wording is rather "to suspend" as oppose to "to abandon". KD _______________________________________________ FPSPACE mailing list FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace From thomsona at flash.net Fri Oct 7 11:52:56 2011 From: thomsona at flash.net (Allen Thomson) Date: Fri, 7 Oct 2011 08:52:56 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [FPSPACE] Roskosmos decides to abandon development of Rus-M booster Message-ID: <1318002776.40707.YahooMailClassic@web80204.mail.mud.yahoo.com> It appears that Vostochny may go ahead for a while: http://www.rg.ru/2011/10/07/rus-anons.html ????????? ????????? ?? ?????????? ??????-???????? "????-?" ????? ?????????? ???????? ???????? ??????? ?? "????????????????? ????" ? ??????? ??????, ??? ??????????? ????????? ?????? ?????????? ?? ?????????? ????????????? ??????-???????? "????-?", ????? ??????? ? ?????????? "?????????" ??? ???????????? ?? 2015 ???. ?? ?????? ?????????, ?? ?????????? ????? ??????-???????? ???????? ????? 37 ????????? ??????? ????????? ?? 2015 ????, ?? ???? ??????? ??? ????? ?? ???????, ??????? ? ????? 2015 ???? ???? ?? ????. "?? ?????????, ??? ????? ?????? ??? ?? ?????, ?? ???? ????? ?????? ? ?? ??????. ?? ???????? ??????????? ?????? ?? ????. ???????????? ?????? ??????? ??????? ???? ?????????? ????????????? ??????-???????? "????-?". ?? ? ????? ??????? ???? ?????? ? "??????????" ? 2015 ????, ???????????, ?? ????? ???? ? ????", - ???????? ????????? ??? ???????. ????? ?????????? ???????, ??? ? ????????? ????? ???? ?????????????????? ?? ????????????? ?????????? "?????????" ? ?? ???????? ????? "????-2" ? ????. "?? ?????? ???? ???????? ?? ????????, ??? ??? ?????? ?????? ? ????? ???? ?????? ??????? ? ?????????? ?????? ?? "??????????" - ????????? ?????? ?????? ??? ????????? ? ?????????? ?????", - ??????? ??. [snip] -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From thomsona at flash.net Fri Oct 7 12:07:29 2011 From: thomsona at flash.net (Allen Thomson) Date: Fri, 7 Oct 2011 09:07:29 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [FPSPACE] Roskosmos decides to abandon development of Rus-M booster Message-ID: <1318003649.87200.YahooMailClassic@web80201.mail.mud.yahoo.com> > From what I understand, the exact wording is rather "to suspend" as oppose to "to abandon". What Popovkin is quoted as saying is "?? ?????????, ??? ????? ?????? ??? ?? ?????, ?? ???? ????? ?????? ? ?? ??????. ?? ???????? ??????????? ?????? ?? ????. ???????????? ?????? ??????? ??????? ???? ?????????? ????????????? ??????-???????? "????-?". This may be stretching my Russian further than prudent and others who have a better understanding should comment, but I think "????" here means "for the time being" without any definite implication that things will be resumed later. IOW, work on the rocket is being halted (??????????) and they may or may not think about resuming it in the future. From pjp961 at svol.net Fri Oct 7 12:21:36 2011 From: pjp961 at svol.net (Peter Pesavento) Date: Fri, 7 Oct 2011 12:21:36 -0400 Subject: [FPSPACE] Any news update on the status of the Chinese space station module in orbit? Message-ID: <4e8f2737.8dcfe30a.28b8.fffffabd@mx.google.com> Thought I would ask if there are any news updates on the Chinese space station module now in orbit, and how it is faring. Thanks in advance. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From cpvick at globalsecurity.org Fri Oct 7 12:26:39 2011 From: cpvick at globalsecurity.org (Charles Vick) Date: Fri, 7 Oct 2011 12:26:39 -0400 Subject: [FPSPACE] Roskosmos decides to abandon development of Rus-M booster In-Reply-To: <1318002776.40707.YahooMailClassic@web80204.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <1318002776.40707.YahooMailClassic@web80204.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <004c01cc850d$e4ca8b50$ae5fa1f0$@globalsecurity.org> News of the day Roskosmos has abandoned development of the Launcher "RUS-m" "Rossiyskaya Gazeta"-www.rg.ru 07.10.2011, 13:32 Head of Roskosmos, Vladimir Popovkin today on "Government hour" in the State Duma said the space agency has decided to renounce the development of advanced Launcher "RUS-m" start which launched from the "East" was scheduled for the year 2015. According to Popovkina, to develop a new rocket more than 37 per cent of the budget agency before the year 2015, but these funds still lacks, therefore alerting the year 2015 is not speech. "We felt that the new missile is not necessary, we are able to fly and old. We reported the country's leadership. The country's leadership decided to discontinue construction of the Launcher "RUS-m". No launch this missile with "East" in the year 2015, of course, there could be no "quotes Popovkina RIA News. Head of Roskosmos noted that now need to concentrate on the construction of spaceport "East" and missile launches of Soyuz-2 "with him. "On the basis of those times we check, as the rockets fly and take a decision on further plans for" East "-run old missiles or return to the development of a new," he said. It was planned that the new prospective piloted transport system under the working title "RUS-m will replace the spaceships of the Soyuz. From: Allen Thomson [mailto:thomsona at flash.net] Sent: Friday, October 07, 2011 11:53 AM To: 'Constantine Domashnev'; fpspace at www.friends-partners.org; Charles Vick Subject: Re: [FPSPACE] Roskosmos decides to abandon development of Rus-M booster It appears that Vostochny may go ahead for a while: http://www.rg.ru/2011/10/07/rus-anons.html ????????? ????????? ?? ?????????? ??????-???????? "????-?" ????? ?????????? ???????? ???????? ??????? ?? "????????????????? ????" ? ??????? ??????, ??? ??????????? ????????? ?????? ?????????? ?? ?????????? ????????????? ??????-???????? "????-?", ????? ??????? ? ?????????? "?????????" ??? ???????????? ?? 2015 ???. ?? ?????? ?????????, ?? ?????????? ????? ??????-???????? ???????? ????? 37 ????????? ??????? ????????? ?? 2015 ????, ?? ???? ??????? ??? ????? ?? ???????, ??????? ? ????? 2015 ???? ???? ?? ????. "?? ?????????, ??? ????? ?????? ??? ?? ?????, ?? ???? ????? ?????? ? ?? ??????. ?? ???????? ??????????? ?????? ?? ????. ???????????? ?????? ??????? ??????? ???? ?????????? ????????????? ??????-???????? "????-?". ?? ? ????? ??????? ???? ?????? ? "??????????" ? 2015 ????, ???????????, ?? ????? ???? ? ????", - ???????? ????????? ??? ???????. ????? ?????????? ???????, ??? ? ????????? ????? ???? ?????????????????? ?? ????????????? ?????????? "?????????" ? ?? ???????? ????? "????-2" ? ????. "?? ?????? ???? ???????? ?? ????????, ??? ??? ?????? ?????? ? ????? ???? ?????? ??????? ? ?????????? ?????? ?? "??????????" - ????????? ?????? ?????? ??? ????????? ? ?????????? ?????", - ??????? ??. [snip] -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From spaceflightnews at gmail.com Fri Oct 7 12:29:49 2011 From: spaceflightnews at gmail.com (space fan) Date: Fri, 7 Oct 2011 17:29:49 +0100 Subject: [FPSPACE] Ryumin inspired to become a cosmonaut by death of Soyuz 11 crew Message-ID: <027d01cc850e$565725d0$03057170$@gmail.com> EXTRACT: '. Ryumin said that Gagarin's original flight had little effect on him as at the time it had seemed unimaginable for a human to go to space, he said his inspiration to become a cosmonaut came later while he had been working on the construction of spacecraft and following the death of a USSR crew in a space flight. At the time there was insufficient training for cosmonauts and in his opinion the crew hadn't properly prepared for their flight. "If they had followed their documentation precisely they had a chance to survive. It was at that moment that I decided to become a cosmonaut," he said, speaking through a translator. His inspiration was that he could do better and he acknowledged that he had been young and self-assured at the time.' http://www.engineeringnews.co.za/article/astronauts-share-views-on-the-futur e-of-space-flight-at-big-sa-event-2011-10-07 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From dpayson at mail.ru Fri Oct 7 12:30:57 2011 From: dpayson at mail.ru (Dmitry Payson) Date: Fri, 7 Oct 2011 20:30:57 +0400 Subject: [FPSPACE] Roskosmos decides to abandon development of Rus-M booster In-Reply-To: <004801cc8508$7f6aa5b0$7e3ff110$@globalsecurity.org> References: <003301cc8502$1f0a76b0$5d1f6410$@globalsecurity.org> <4F2BBBE3E2194B139E2F92DFF0BCC1DD@Tosha> <004801cc8508$7f6aa5b0$7e3ff110$@globalsecurity.org> Message-ID: <008401cc850e$7e738cc0$7b5aa640$@mail.ru> While CPV is right mentioning the obvious shift to more 'practical' space applications, I would like to remark that the concept of Roscosmos' activities paying back on investments is kind of semantic trap that often makes the space program top level discussions rather complicated. Navigation satellites do not pay back on the space segment investments; rather, they provide the universally accessible free infrastructure for ground-based services in a way like the state investments in the road network support the national economy as a whole. See early Galileo PPP plans. Meteorological satellites do not pay back on the investments, as they are part of the state-owned (and growingly international) infrastructure; also, Roshydromet national weather authority is a major beneficiary here, not Roscosmos. Communication satellites do pay back on investments, but national fixed and broadcasting constellation (Express-AMs, etc.) is mostly funded and operated by the separate player, the Russian Satellite Communication Company (RSCC), the state enterprise controlled by the Ministry of Communications, not Roscosmos or any space industry enterprise. Generally speaking, the government agency's functions should cover the fields that do not include the immediate revenue streams. Those include manned programs, fundamental research, bulky dual use infrastructure like cosmodromes and launch vehicle (to a degree), satnav infrastructure and advanced R&Ds for future technologies. In an ideal world, the exact function for the space agency is developing the assets and infrastructure that do not pay on investments, at least in the commercially recognized sense. We'll see what the trajectory towards the near-ideal world solution is going to be like. Dmitry Payson -----Original Message----- From: fpspace-bounces at www.friends-partners.org [mailto:fpspace-bounces at www.friends-partners.org] On Behalf Of Charles Vick Sent: Friday, October 07, 2011 7:48 PM To: 'Constantine Domashnev'; fpspace at www.friends-partners.org Subject: Re: [FPSPACE] Roskosmos decides to abandon development of Rus-M booster I also expect more emphasis on Baikonur and communication satellites as well as navigation and meteorological satellites that pay back on investments. -----Original Message----- From: fpspace-bounces at www.friends-partners.org [mailto:fpspace-bounces at www.friends-partners.org] On Behalf Of Constantine Domashnev Sent: Friday, October 07, 2011 11:22 AM To: fpspace at www.friends-partners.org Subject: Re: [FPSPACE] Roskosmos decides to abandon development of Rus-M booster >From what I understand, the exact wording is rather "to suspend" as oppose to "to abandon". KD _______________________________________________ FPSPACE mailing list FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace _______________________________________________ FPSPACE mailing list FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace From rmcsbarbosa at gmail.com Fri Oct 7 13:04:29 2011 From: rmcsbarbosa at gmail.com (Rui Barbosa) Date: Fri, 7 Oct 2011 18:04:29 +0100 Subject: [FPSPACE] Any news update on the status of the Chinese space station module in orbit? In-Reply-To: <4e8f2737.8dcfe30a.28b8.fffffabd@mx.google.com> References: <4e8f2737.8dcfe30a.28b8.fffffabd@mx.google.com> Message-ID: The latest official update: http://news.xinhuanet.com/english2010/sci/2011-10/07/c_131177092.htm Rui C. Barbosa Braga - Portugal www.zenite.nu/orbita On Fri, Oct 7, 2011 at 5:21 PM, Peter Pesavento wrote: > Thought I would ask if there are any news updates on the Chinese space > station module now in orbit, and how it is faring.**** > > ** ** > > Thanks in advance.**** > > _______________________________________________ > FPSPACE mailing list > FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org > http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From agzak at optonline.net Fri Oct 7 13:09:02 2011 From: agzak at optonline.net (Anatoly Zak) Date: Fri, 07 Oct 2011 13:09:02 -0400 Subject: [FPSPACE] Roskosmos decides to abandon development of Rus-M booster In-Reply-To: <003301cc8502$1f0a76b0$5d1f6410$@globalsecurity.org> Message-ID: It could be seen as pragmatic, but they now claim that Soyuz-2 would be moved to Vostochny, which might be even costlier than using it for Rus-M. It doesn?t make any sense at all, unless these statements were designed to confuse Kazakhstan and not to upset the Kremlin. Anatoly Zak http://www.RussianSpaceWeb.com On 10/7/11 11:02 AM, "Charles Vick" wrote: > This defines his leadership as being pragmatic at best. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From rmcsbarbosa at gmail.com Fri Oct 7 13:29:02 2011 From: rmcsbarbosa at gmail.com (Rui Barbosa) Date: Fri, 7 Oct 2011 18:29:02 +0100 Subject: [FPSPACE] Any news update on the status of the Chinese space station module in orbit? In-Reply-To: <4e8f2737.8dcfe30a.28b8.fffffabd@mx.google.com> References: <4e8f2737.8dcfe30a.28b8.fffffabd@mx.google.com> Message-ID: And also from CCTV News http://english.cntv.cn/program/newshour/20111007/103920.shtml On Fri, Oct 7, 2011 at 5:21 PM, Peter Pesavento wrote: > Thought I would ask if there are any news updates on the Chinese space > station module now in orbit, and how it is faring.**** > > ** ** > > Thanks in advance.**** > > _______________________________________________ > FPSPACE mailing list > FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org > http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From cpvick at globalsecurity.org Fri Oct 7 15:54:41 2011 From: cpvick at globalsecurity.org (Charles Vick) Date: Fri, 7 Oct 2011 15:54:41 -0400 Subject: [FPSPACE] Roskosmos decides to abandon development of Rus-M booster In-Reply-To: <008401cc850e$7e738cc0$7b5aa640$@mail.ru> References: <003301cc8502$1f0a76b0$5d1f6410$@globalsecurity.org> <4F2BBBE3E2194B139E2F92DFF0BCC1DD@Tosha> <004801cc8508$7f6aa5b0$7e3ff110$@globalsecurity.org> <008401cc850e$7e738cc0$7b5aa640$@mail.ru> Message-ID: <003501cc852a$f420c250$dc6246f0$@globalsecurity.org> Dear Dmitry, we have been doing these large Science & Technology (S&T) projects in the Westand Russia is not unaware of this in its policy direction --which is rarely, if ever, explained. It has been the plan at least since the Eisenhower and subsequent Kennedy administrations to do the following: To apply from the total available discretionary government funding about 40% to basic Scientific Research to push the basic sciences and about 60 % of the available funding to push the basic technologies, (Research & Development) to drive the national economy and to provide for the Citizenry's wellbeing. Above all, it is to provide for the National Security of the nation by keeping the USA technologically industrial base ahead of the rest of the world that opposes our social system by two to two-and-one-half generations strategically. That basic intent applies to the Russian Federation and that is what I am focused on though the administrator has indicated those a fore mention programs which you are correct about but it was in the contest of national economic proviso's. I would add also that weather satellites can have quite an impact as a warning to the national economy impact. cpv -----Original Message----- From: Dmitry Payson [mailto:dpayson at mail.ru] Sent: Friday, October 07, 2011 12:31 PM To: 'Charles Vick'; fpspace at www.friends-partners.org Subject: RE: [FPSPACE] Roskosmos decides to abandon development of Rus-M booster While CPV is right mentioning the obvious shift to more 'practical' space applications, I would like to remark that the concept of Roscosmos' activities paying back on investments is kind of semantic trap that often makes the space program top level discussions rather complicated. Navigation satellites do not pay back on the space segment investments; rather, they provide the universally accessible free infrastructure for ground-based services in a way like the state investments in the road network support the national economy as a whole. See early Galileo PPP plans. Meteorological satellites do not pay back on the investments, as they are part of the state-owned (and growingly international) infrastructure; also, Roshydromet national weather authority is a major beneficiary here, not Roscosmos. Communication satellites do pay back on investments, but national fixed and broadcasting constellation (Express-AMs, etc.) is mostly funded and operated by the separate player, the Russian Satellite Communication Company (RSCC), the state enterprise controlled by the Ministry of Communications, not Roscosmos or any space industry enterprise. Generally speaking, the government agency's functions should cover the fields that do not include the immediate revenue streams. Those include manned programs, fundamental research, bulky dual use infrastructure like cosmodromes and launch vehicle (to a degree), satnav infrastructure and advanced R&Ds for future technologies. In an ideal world, the exact function for the space agency is developing the assets and infrastructure that do not pay on investments, at least in the commercially recognized sense. We'll see what the trajectory towards the near-ideal world solution is going to be like. Dmitry Payson -----Original Message----- From: fpspace-bounces at www.friends-partners.org [mailto:fpspace-bounces at www.friends-partners.org] On Behalf Of Charles Vick Sent: Friday, October 07, 2011 7:48 PM To: 'Constantine Domashnev'; fpspace at www.friends-partners.org Subject: Re: [FPSPACE] Roskosmos decides to abandon development of Rus-M booster I also expect more emphasis on Baikonur and communication satellites as well as navigation and meteorological satellites that pay back on investments. -----Original Message----- From: fpspace-bounces at www.friends-partners.org [mailto:fpspace-bounces at www.friends-partners.org] On Behalf Of Constantine Domashnev Sent: Friday, October 07, 2011 11:22 AM To: fpspace at www.friends-partners.org Subject: Re: [FPSPACE] Roskosmos decides to abandon development of Rus-M booster >From what I understand, the exact wording is rather "to suspend" as oppose to "to abandon". KD _______________________________________________ FPSPACE mailing list FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace _______________________________________________ FPSPACE mailing list FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace From cpvick at globalsecurity.org Fri Oct 7 15:58:29 2011 From: cpvick at globalsecurity.org (Charles Vick) Date: Fri, 7 Oct 2011 15:58:29 -0400 Subject: [FPSPACE] Roskosmos decides to abandon development of Rus-M booster In-Reply-To: References: <003301cc8502$1f0a76b0$5d1f6410$@globalsecurity.org> Message-ID: <003b01cc852b$7c62cf00$75286d00$@globalsecurity.org> Are we not sure they will not launch manned flights from the French Guiana site in the future? effectively vetoing the Kazakhs unless the switch to a Russian Zenit which is presently preferred. From: fpspace-bounces at www.friends-partners.org [mailto:fpspace-bounces at www.friends-partners.org] On Behalf Of Anatoly Zak Sent: Friday, October 07, 2011 1:09 PM To: Untitled Subject: Re: [FPSPACE] Roskosmos decides to abandon development of Rus-M booster It could be seen as pragmatic, but they now claim that Soyuz-2 would be moved to Vostochny, which might be even costlier than using it for Rus-M. It doesn't make any sense at all, unless these statements were designed to confuse Kazakhstan and not to upset the Kremlin. Anatoly Zak http://www.RussianSpaceWeb.com On 10/7/11 11:02 AM, "Charles Vick" wrote: This defines his leadership as being pragmatic at best. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From davidlrickman at aol.com Fri Oct 7 16:38:55 2011 From: davidlrickman at aol.com (David L. Rickman) Date: Fri, 7 Oct 2011 16:38:55 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [FPSPACE] Soviet Lunniy Korabl Helicopter Simulator Update Message-ID: <8CE534843D0D3C4-718-3A5BC@webmail-m057.sysops.aol.com> Hello FPSpacers, Adding to what I posted a little over a month ago: I now have three separate Russian sources giving three different accounts of what helicopter was used to simulate the Lunniy Korabl for training purposes; the ??-4, ??-6, and ??-9. The only solid evidence I have is the photo presented in the August issue of the Russian periodical, "?????", seen here: http://farm7.static.flickr.com/6061/6131508147_6f8aaf0306_z.jpg I have enlisted the help of a Russian Aviation Enthusiast, Sergei Ostrozhinsky. With his help we have only ruled out the ??-6 at this time, "because its wheels (have) another proportions: main wheel bigger, nose-wheel smaller. Moreover, it has a rounded bottom." I have forwarded Sergei more information about the size of the Planeta PRL DA-019 and DA-018 Landing Radar. I'll keep everyone posted on the progress! Best always, David L.Rickman 549 Caribou Road Asheville, NC 28803 USA Follow my progress as I recreate the Soviet Lunniy Korabl spaceship in 1:5 scale at http://lunniykorabl.blogspot.com -----Original Message----- From: davidlrickman To: fpspace Sent: Sun, Sep 4, 2011 3:01 pm Subject: [FPSPACE] Anniversary of a Soviet lunar lander helicopter simulator test Hi FPSpacers, I know it's been a year and a half since we had this discussion, but I came across a photo that I hadn't seen before and thought I'd share (just in case others hadn't seen it). It's the Planeta PRL DA-019 and DA-018 attached to a Mi-6 Helicopter for Lunar Landing Simulation Test: http://4image.uz/images/5913.jpg Not exactly the same as the one actually used on the Lunniy Korabl, but almost there. Best Regards, David L. Rickman -----Original Message----- From: David R. Woods To: fpspace Sent: Sat, Apr 17, 2010 5:15 pm Subject: [FPSPACE] Anniversary of a Soviet lunar lander helicopter simulator test Folks, An interesting item appeared on the Anniversaries section of the Roscosmos web page at http://www.roscosmos.ru. Today was marked as the anniversary of the SU (Soviet Union) 17 April 1970 flight test of a helicopter simulator of a spacecraft used to land on the lunar surface. There were no further details. It is generally assumed that once the Apollo 11 mission had been conducted, that the Soviet lunar cosmonaut team was disbanded to concentrate instead on space station programs. Therefore there should have been no further lander training tests after that. I have done a little searching through my records and I can not find any reference to this event or program. Does anyone have any further details? Dave ????????? ??????????? ??? What space anniversaries 17 ?????? 1970 | ?????????? ?????? ????????? ?? ??????? ??????? ??? ??????? ?? ??????????? ???? ?? ??????????? ?????????. 17 April 1970 | The flight tests of the SU lunar spacecraft to land on the lunar surface for the helicopter simulator. 17 April 1970 | Took place the flight tests SU of lunar ship for the landing on the surface of the Moon on the helicopter imitator _______________________________________________ FPSPACE mailing list FPSPACE at friends-partners.org http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace _______________________________________________ FPSPACE mailing list FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From agzak at optonline.net Fri Oct 7 17:49:08 2011 From: agzak at optonline.net (Anatoly Zak) Date: Fri, 07 Oct 2011 17:49:08 -0400 Subject: [FPSPACE] Roskosmos decides to abandon development of Rus-M booster In-Reply-To: <4F2BBBE3E2194B139E2F92DFF0BCC1DD@Tosha> Message-ID: Just watched recording of Popovkin's speech in Duma. In context, it is clear that Rus-M was abandoned not suspended, as a duplication to Angara. There will be no way back. Popovkin went on to say that after Angara starts flying, the agency might decide to build a pad for it in Vostochny. In the meantime, a wacky idea to put Soyuz in Vostochny apparently came from one of Popovkin's deputies in an impromptu interview and then was spread by TV people, who, as we all know, usually have no brains and can't differentiate between declarations of official plans and informal thoughts :) Anatoly Zak http://www.RussianSpaceWeb.com On 10/7/11 11:22 AM, "Constantine Domashnev" wrote: > From what I understand, the exact wording is rather "to suspend" as oppose > to "to abandon". > > KD > > _______________________________________________ > FPSPACE mailing list > FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org > http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace From cpvick at globalsecurity.org Fri Oct 7 19:08:30 2011 From: cpvick at globalsecurity.org (Charles Vick) Date: Fri, 7 Oct 2011 19:08:30 -0400 Subject: [FPSPACE] Roskosmos decides to abandon development of Rus-M booster In-Reply-To: References: <4F2BBBE3E2194B139E2F92DFF0BCC1DD@Tosha> Message-ID: <001001cc8546$07e6c170$17b44450$@globalsecurity.org> That to me is a very dangerous long term Science & Technology decision and bring the New manned spacecraft PTK-NP (RUS) development of the S. P. Korolev Rocket Space Corporation and Zenit combination up to challenge win or lose all including Vostochny economic decision or the deathblow for the S. P. Korolev Corporation in the long term and manned spaceflight? I am very reserved on Angara options as incompatible which is why I said the New Manned Spacecraft PTK-NP (RUS) is highly questionable. This is an extremely bad oman from my perspective for the Russian Federation Future. This is a military, industry Coup D??tat for the Khrunichev Space Center over S. P. Korolev Corporation that no doubt may be taken over as an industry consolidation by Khrunichev. Be that as it may the game is over from my perspective. It totally remind me of the forced congressional office of management and budget design of SLS to pay off the padded politicians solid motor industry rammed down our throats that I find totally intolerable and walk away from as I fade away in semi-retirement total discuss. Enough. Never mind the future of future generations... cpv -----Original Message----- From: fpspace-bounces at www.friends-partners.org [mailto:fpspace-bounces at www.friends-partners.org] On Behalf Of Anatoly Zak Sent: Friday, October 07, 2011 5:49 PM To: fpspace at www.friends-partners.org Subject: Re: [FPSPACE] Roskosmos decides to abandon development of Rus-M booster Just watched recording of Popovkin's speech in Duma. In context, it is clear that Rus-M was abandoned not suspended, as a duplication to Angara. There will be no way back. Popovkin went on to say that after Angara starts flying, the agency might decide to build a pad for it in. In the meantime, a wacky idea to put Soyuz in Vostochny apparently came from one of Popovkin's deputies in an impromptu interview and then was spread by TV people, who, as we all know, usually have no brains and can't differentiate between declarations of official plans and informal thoughts :) Anatoly Zak http://www.RussianSpaceWeb.com On 10/7/11 11:22 AM, "Constantine Domashnev" wrote: > From what I understand, the exact wording is rather "to suspend" as > oppose to "to abandon". > > KD > > _______________________________________________ > FPSPACE mailing list > FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org > http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace _______________________________________________ FPSPACE mailing list FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace From jameseoberg at comcast.net Fri Oct 7 20:14:35 2011 From: jameseoberg at comcast.net (jameseoberg at comcast.net) Date: Sat, 8 Oct 2011 00:14:35 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [FPSPACE] Roskosmos decides to abandon development of Rus-M booster In-Reply-To: <001001cc8546$07e6c170$17b44450$@globalsecurity.org> Message-ID: <1888273060.77679.1318032875269.JavaMail.root@sz0079a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net> This remains a members-only link to the article, I'll try to get my pdf file posted on my home page/ Aerospace America (AIAA) ? // ? October 2011 issue PERSPECTIVES ON THE RUS-M BOOSTER PROJECT Plans for building Rus-M, Russia's next-generation crew-carrying space booster, face mounting problems. by James Oberg http://www.aerospaceamerica.org/Pages/TableOfContents.aspx -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From cdomashnev at acm.org Fri Oct 7 20:36:45 2011 From: cdomashnev at acm.org (Constantine A. Domashnev) Date: Fri, 7 Oct 2011 20:36:45 -0400 Subject: [FPSPACE] Roskosmos decides to abandon development of Rus-M booster Message-ID: <000801cc8552$5dbb7300$0800a8c0@vosem> Hi, >From what I can tell at the moment of this writing, the majority of news agencies/reporters seem to use the 'to suspend' wording. To what degree it is "wishful thinking", I cannot tell. KD Pittsburgh, PA -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From drwoods at stny.rr.com Sat Oct 8 21:50:14 2011 From: drwoods at stny.rr.com (David R. Woods) Date: Sat, 08 Oct 2011 21:50:14 -0400 Subject: [FPSPACE] Mercury Messenger spacecraft first solar day results Message-ID: <4E90FDD6.9020506@stny.rr.com> Has anyone seen any of the results that were to be presented at this conference? ******************************** http://messenger.jhuapl.edu/ October 5, 2011 *MESSENGER Team Presents New Mercury Findings at Planetary Conference* Nantes, France?MESSENGER scientists will highlight the latest results on Mercury from MESSENGER observations obtained during the first six months (the first Mercury solar day) in orbit. These findings will be presented October 5 in 30 papers and posters as part of a special session of the joint meeting of the European Planetary Science Congress and the Division for Planetary Sciences of the American Astronomical Society in Nantes, Frances. From phillipclark at btinternet.com Mon Oct 10 03:12:24 2011 From: phillipclark at btinternet.com (Phillip Clark) Date: Mon, 10 Oct 2011 08:12:24 +0100 Subject: [FPSPACE] Cosmos 2472 down? Message-ID: There have been no new element sets for Cosmos 2472, the latest Kobalt-M photoreconnaissance satellite, issued since October 8.77. Therefore, I am wondering whether it has come down. Phillip Clark -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From thomsona at flash.net Tue Oct 11 09:03:12 2011 From: thomsona at flash.net (Allen Thomson) Date: Tue, 11 Oct 2011 06:03:12 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [FPSPACE] Shenzhou-8, Tiangong plans Message-ID: <1318338192.92061.YahooMailClassic@web80207.mail.mud.yahoo.com> http://english.peopledaily.com.cn/202936/7614095.html China's Shenzhou-8 spacecraft launch on target 13:46, October 11, 2011 After the space laboratory module Tiangong-1 successfully entered orbit, the launch of the Shenzhou-8 spacecraft is imminent. Locking in a remarkable "kiss in space," the two will come together in early November, according to space experts. "The preparation for launch is proceeding now," Yin Jiangang, an expert tied to China's space program, told the Global Times on Monday, "according to the original plan, Shenzhou-8 will be launched at the end of October or beginning of November, depending on the technical preparations and weather conditions." The unmanned Shenzhou-8 spacecraft will conduct its first docking test within two days of reaching Tiangong-1 to form a combined spacecraft, according to the Ministry of National Defense. After flying together for about 12 days, the two space modules will separate and prepare for another docking test. After the two docking tests, Shenzhou-8 will return to Earth, while Tiangong-1 will remain in long-term orbit to await the next round of docking practice. In preparation for the docking test, Tiangong-1 was designed to lower its orbit and carry out phase modulations ahead of the launch of its counterpart. "Tiangong-1 controls the progress of the docking at all times," Zhang Bonan, chief designer of Tiangong-1, said to the Science and Technology Daily, "It keeps sending signals to let its counterpart know where it is and to guide the flight path after the docking." If the docking test is successful, China will be the third country to have independently developed space docking technology after the US and Russia. Yin expressed his confidence about the Shenzhou-8 launch, but admitted risks still existed. He believed that the docking test would "lay a sound foundation for the large-scale construction of China's own space station and space experiments in the future." "Tiangong-1 once combined will forms a small-scale space station. China's space station, in its true capacity, may be sent up piece-by-piece from the new satellite launch center in Wenchang, Hainan Province after 2014," Yin told the Global Times, "That will be the task for spacecraft like Shenzhou-11 and -12." According to China's ambitious space plan, Shenzhou-8 through -10 will conduct docking tests with Tiangong-1. Different from the pioneering docking spaceship, Shenzhou-9 and -10 may be manned by an astronaut to complete manual space docking with Tiangong-1. Before 2016, China is planning to send Tiangong-2 and Tiangong-3 into orbit. [snip] From jameseoberg at comcast.net Tue Oct 11 17:49:45 2011 From: jameseoberg at comcast.net (James E Oberg) Date: Tue, 11 Oct 2011 16:49:45 -0500 Subject: [FPSPACE] With Shenzhou/Tiangong rendezvous nearing, WHAT was that Shijian-12 rendezvous sequence last year? Message-ID: <2B56EBA2E16A4048BC73FE024528FDF9@ownerfbf08f40c> With Shenzhou/Tiangong rendezvous nearing, WHAT was that Shijian-12 rendezvous sequence last year? Last year's articles: http://www.thespacereview.com/article/1689/1 and http://www.wired.com/dangerroom/2010/08/chinas-secret-satellite-rendezvous-suggestive-of-a-military-program/ and Two Chinese satellites rendezvous in orbit http://www.newscientist.com/article/dn19379-two-chinese-satellites-rendezvous-in-orbit.html Satellite-watchers worry about China http://cosmiclog.msnbc.msn.com/_news/2010/08/30/5003915-satellite-watchers-worry-about-china restarting the forum http://forum.nasaspaceflight.com/index.php?action=post;topic=21988.75;num_replies=85 In hindsight are there any new insights into these rendezvous maneuvers? Is there any hint from official or unofficial Chinese sources? With the first attempt at PUBLIC rendezvous only a few weeks away, the nature of this still very SECRET series of maneuvers needs to be better understood. Or did I miss somebody's full report? -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From phillipclark at btinternet.com Wed Oct 12 03:13:24 2011 From: phillipclark at btinternet.com (Phillip Clark) Date: Wed, 12 Oct 2011 08:13:24 +0100 Subject: [FPSPACE] With Shenzhou/Tiangong rendezvous nearing, WHAT was that Shijian-12 rendezvous sequence last year? In-Reply-To: <2B56EBA2E16A4048BC73FE024528FDF9@ownerfbf08f40c> References: <2B56EBA2E16A4048BC73FE024528FDF9@ownerfbf08f40c> Message-ID: Since the Shijian 12 rendezvous tests last year were too late to be seriously considered to be related to the Tiangong 1 programme, I had assumed that they were part of a satellite inspector programme. Phillip Clark ----- Original Message ----- From: James E Oberg To: fpspace at friends-partners.org Sent: Tuesday, October 11, 2011 10:49 PM Subject: [FPSPACE] With Shenzhou/Tiangong rendezvous nearing,WHAT was that Shijian-12 rendezvous sequence last year? With Shenzhou/Tiangong rendezvous nearing, WHAT was that Shijian-12 rendezvous sequence last year? Last year's articles: http://www.thespacereview.com/article/1689/1 and http://www.wired.com/dangerroom/2010/08/chinas-secret-satellite-rendezvous-suggestive-of-a-military-program/ and Two Chinese satellites rendezvous in orbit http://www.newscientist.com/article/dn19379-two-chinese-satellites-rendezvous-in-orbit.html Satellite-watchers worry about China http://cosmiclog.msnbc.msn.com/_news/2010/08/30/5003915-satellite-watchers-worry-about-china restarting the forum http://forum.nasaspaceflight.com/index.php?action=post;topic=21988.75;num_replies=85 In hindsight are there any new insights into these rendezvous maneuvers? Is there any hint from official or unofficial Chinese sources? With the first attempt at PUBLIC rendezvous only a few weeks away, the nature of this still very SECRET series of maneuvers needs to be better understood. Or did I miss somebody's full report? ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ _______________________________________________ FPSPACE mailing list FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From jameseoberg at comcast.net Wed Oct 12 13:26:03 2011 From: jameseoberg at comcast.net (James E Oberg) Date: Wed, 12 Oct 2011 12:26:03 -0500 Subject: [FPSPACE] 'Iran Failed With Space Monkey Launch: Report' Message-ID: <24AAE80871074328BFF0A3E9D66A2E56@ownerfbf08f40c> AFP: 'Iran Failed With Space Monkey Launch: Report' Paris, Oct 12 -- Iran acknowledged as a failure Wednesday its attempt to send a live monkey into space last month -- touted as its first step towards launching a man into space. "The Kavoshgar-5 rocket carrying a capsule with a live animal (a monkey) was launched during Shahrivar," an Iranian calendar month spanning August 23 to September 22, Deputy Science Minister Mohammad Mehdinejad-Nouri was quoted as saying by the ISNA news agency. "However, the launch was not publicised as all of its anticipated objectives were not accomplished," Mehdinejad-Nouri told reporters. He said the launch of a live animal into space was "strategic, and a priority," and expressed hope that future launches would attain more of the objectives set. On October 3, Iran indefinitely postponed plans to send a live monkey into space, without giving any reasons. "One cannot give a set date for this project and as soon as our nation's scientists announce the readiness (of the project) it will be announced," said Hamid Fazeli, head of Iran's Space Organisation. The project envisaged launching a capsule with life support using the Kavoshgar-5 rocket to an altitude of 120 kilometres (75 miles) for a 20-minute sub-orbital flight. The project was unveiled in February by President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad. At the time, Fazeli touted the launch of a large animal as the first step towards sending a man into space, which Tehran says is scheduled for 2020. In mid-March, Iran announced the successful launch of an earlier version of the rocket, Kavoshgar-4, carrying a test capsule designed to house the monkey. Iran has already sent small animals into space -- a rat, turtles and worms -- aboard a capsule carried by its Kavoshgar-3 rocket in 2010. The Islamic republic, which first put a satellite into orbit in 2009, has outlined an ambitious space programme amid Western concerns the rocket technology may be linked to developing ballistic missiles that could deliver nuclear warheads. Tehran has repeatedly denied that its nuclear and scientific programmes mask military ambitions. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From ljk4 at msn.com Wed Oct 12 23:44:30 2011 From: ljk4 at msn.com (LARRY KLAES) Date: Wed, 12 Oct 2011 23:44:30 -0400 Subject: [FPSPACE] FW: Centauri Dreams - Thoughts on a Different Apollo In-Reply-To: <90e6ba6136b82d17f204af1ee9b3@google.com> References: <90e6ba6136b82d17f204af1ee9b3@google.com> Message-ID: Date: Wed, 12 Oct 2011 19:20:16 +0000 Subject: Centauri Dreams From: gilster at mindspring.com To: ljk4 at msn.com Centauri Dreams Centauri Dreams Thoughts on a Different Apollo Posted: 12 Oct 2011 05:34 AM PDT Did the Apollo missions produce enough good science to justify their cost? It?s a question Freeman Dyson has speculated on in the past, calling the missions a success because they were ?conceived and honestly presented to the public as an international sporting event and not as a contribution to science.? Symbolic of this is the fact that the first item to be unpacked after each landing was the television camera that relayed mission imagery back to Earth. Apollo inevitably labored under the camera?s gaze, but no great scientific discoveries came from it, and the entertainment emphasis inevitably detracted from the missions? scientific objectives. Image: Buzz Aldrin leaves the lunar lander in this photo snapped by Neil Armstrong. What might Apollo have been if it had been conceived from the start to produce good science? Imagine this: Our six Apollo landings put two astronauts each on the surface for a period of several days. At their disposal were two tons of supplies and equipment. For the entire project, Apollo gave us a total of about 50 man-days on the Moon using an aggregate 12 tons of equipment. What if Apollo had produced 40 man-days per ton of equipment instead of the 4 it actually delivered? This could have been achieved by unmanned freight carriers conducting half the landings, providing six astronauts with 60 tons of supplies and equipment, sufficient for 400 days on the Moon. You wind up with 2400 man-days of exploration instead of the 50 we achieved with Apollo. Let me quote John Cramer on this, because I?m drawing these thoughts from a column he wrote for Analog all the way back in 1988. Dyson had been visiting the University of Washington, where Cramer was then on the physics faculty, and his last lecture there contained these thoughts. Cramer took note of the advantages a much longer stay on the Moon could have brought: With this much time, Dyson suggested, the Apollo project might have achieved some significant science. There would have been time to explore the lunar poles , to circumnavigate the body, to set up radio-astronomy dishes on the Moon?s radio-quiet back side, to take the time to investigate and theorize and observe and test and probe. There would have been the time and opportunity to bring into play those intrinsically human skills which have lead in previous years-long voyages of discovery to new insights and understanding. The real Apollo, of course, was carried out in a few days by test pilots operating at a dead run, with one eye on the clock and the other on the prime-time news schedule. There was simply no time for science. Dyson?s revisionist version of Apollo is another road not taken. The Problem of Premature Choice Apollo was a success, but on the terms the mission was built around, and it could have been done much better. The Space Shuttle, however, was something much different, an example of what Dyson refers to as the ?Problem of Premature Choice,? which he defines as ?betting all your money on one horse before you have found whether she is lame.? Translated into bureaucratic terms, this means that a project can become large enough that exploring alternative engineering methods is seen as a waste that could become embarrassing to the public officials who have supported the project all along. Thus one of several alternatives is hastily selected, the rest eliminated, and the premature selection prevents the accurate analysis of the other methods. Dyson himself has always been an example of independent thinking, but one whose priorities in space exploration favor science, which he thinks should command center stage. As he told his University of Washington audience, the contrast between the Space Shuttle and the International Ultraviolet Explorer (IUE) is instructive. The IUE came with mirror and optics from NASA, a solar power system from ESA, and communications gear from the UK. Countless astronomers and astrophysicists have used it to study tens of thousands of stellar objects in ultraviolet and visible wavelengths, and the IUE was available when supernova SN1987A occurred, providing exceptionally useful light curves that are suddenly back in the news as we try to figure out why neutrinos observed at CERN behaved differently from those from this event. The IUE, which had been expected to last for three years, ended up serving us for eighteen, being finally shut down in 1996, some eight years after Dyson gave his talk at the University of Washington. The IUE provided a great scientific return in a mission that remains to this day little known. Learning where the payoff is ? and deciding what kind of payoff you want to achieve ? is key to the process. Looking at NASA?s future as of 1988, John Cramer asked this question: Will there be further plodding along the dismal path that has lead from the triumph of Apollo to the Challenger Disaster? Will the agency continue to place science far down in the priority queue, going always for the Premature Choice and the job security of mammoth engineering projects? Will NASA continue to withhold any investments in the future, in advanced propulsion technologies, and in new ideas? I hope not. Choosing the Right Technology The questions don?t seem to have changed much over the course of the last 23 years, although the scope of our ambitions has been downsized since that even earlier time (1952) when Wernher von Braun proposed a manned expedition to Mars that would have required moving 70 men and 4200 tons of equipment into orbit around the Red Planet, debarking 50 men and 150 tons of equipment to the surface in three ships, using what was essentially World War II technology. Image: A Chesley Bonestell illustration from a 1952 issue of Collier?s showing his take on the von Braun Mars expedition. A premature choice would have been dangerous here as well. Among the things Apollo did right was to work with adequate communications channels. Where von Braun chose a 1 kHz bandwidth for the link between the Mars expedition and Earth (essentially allowing the two to communicate via Morse code), Apollo was designed for spectacle and television, and used a communications bandwidth thousands of times broader. Dyson is all about getting the mix right, the right technology (competitively chosen) coupled to serious scientific purpose to achieve a lasting result. John Cramer?s long-running Alternate View column in Analog can be accessed online. Talking to Cramer at the 100 Year Starship Symposium, I mentioned how useful I had found it over the years, and he told me that the site housing his column had been one of the first to appear on the Internet in Washington, preceding even the Microsoft website. Talk about getting ahead of the curve! Readers will enjoy Dr. Cramer?s take on everything from quantum mechanics to virtual reality over decades of speculation and analysis, a true resource for the interstellar minded. It?s also a source, as this 1988 column showed, of insightful commentary on getting our priorities right. You are subscribed to email updates from Centauri Dreams To stop receiving these emails, you may unsubscribe now. Email delivery powered by Google Google Inc., 20 West Kinzie, Chicago IL USA 60610 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From ljk4 at msn.com Thu Oct 13 13:01:49 2011 From: ljk4 at msn.com (LARRY KLAES) Date: Thu, 13 Oct 2011 13:01:49 -0400 Subject: [FPSPACE] Daring Russian Sample Return mission to Martian Moon Phobos aims for November Liftoff Message-ID: Daring Russian Sample Return mission to Martian Moon Phobos aims for November Liftoff by Ken Kremer on October 13, 2011 In just over 3 weeks time, Russia plans to launch a bold mission to Mars who?s objective, if successful , is to land on the Martian Moon Phobos and return a cargo of precious soil samples back to Earth about three years later. The purpose is to determine the origin and evolution of Phobos and how that relates to Mars and the evolution of the solar system. Liftoff of the Phobos-Grunt space probe will end a nearly two decade long hiatus in Russia?s exploration of the Red Planet following the failed Mars 96 mission and is currently scheduled to head to space just weeks prior to this year?s other Mars mission ? namely NASA?s next Mars rover, the Curiosity Mars Science Laboratory (MSL). http://www.universetoday.com/89845/daring-russian-sample-return-mission-to-martian-moon-phobos-aims-for-november-liftoff/ -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From ljk4 at msn.com Fri Oct 14 06:20:50 2011 From: ljk4 at msn.com (LARRY KLAES ) Date: Fri, 14 Oct 2011 10:20:50 +0000 Subject: [FPSPACE] Fwd: [JAXA:0311] Astronaut Hoshide Begins to Tweet! Message-ID: ---------- Sent from AT&T Wireless using Windows Live Hotmail -----Original Message----- From: JAXA Press Release Mail Service Sent: 10/14/2011 7:58:25 AM To: ljk4 at msn.com Subject: [JAXA:0311] Astronaut Hoshide Begins to Tweet! October 14, 2011 (JST) Astronaut Hoshide Begins to Tweet! Astronaut Akihiko Hoshide of the Japan Aerospace Exploration Agency (JAXA) joined Twitter on October 14, 2011. Astronaut Hoshide has been assigned as a flight engineer for the Expedition 32/33 crew to stay at the International Space Station (ISS) for about six months from June 2012. During his last mission to space, STS-124 (J1 mission,) Astronaut Hoshide became the first Japanese to manipulate the ISS robotic arm, and conducted the assembly operation of the Japanese Experiment Module "Kibo," including installing the Kibo's Pressurized Module (PM) onto the ISS, moving the Experiment Logistics Module Pressurized Section to the PM, activating the PM, and initializing the Kibo's robotic arm. The mission this time is his second flight, and his first long-term space stay and engagement in a space experiment. On his Twitter page, he plans to introduce his training on the ground prior to his space trip, then report on his collaborative work with the Kibo's operation and control team based on his experience of daily ISS operations as a Capcom*. He will also tweet about science experiments, and his feelings while preparing for the mission, and during the mission. JAXA will provide real-time information on activities at the ISS and Kibo through the communication service tool, Twitter. * Capcom: a Capsule Communicator who is in charge of communicating with astronauts for the ISS control and operation. 1. Astronaut Akihito Hoshide's Twitter Details User name: Aki_Hoshide URL: http://twitter.com/Aki_Hoshide 2. Brief Personal History of JAXA Astronaut Akihiko Hoshide http://www.jaxa.jp/press/2011/10/20111014_hoshide_e.html#profile 3. Reference URL JAXA Website http://iss.jaxa.jp/en/ JAXA Astronaut Akihiko Hoshide http://iss.jaxa.jp/en/astro/biographies/hoshide/index.html URL: http://www.jaxa.jp/press/2011/10/20111014_hoshide_e.html -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Publisher : Public Affairs Department Japan Aerospace Exploration Agency (JAXA) Marunouchi Kitaguchi Building, 1-6-5, Marunouchi, Chiyoda-ku, Tokyo 100-8260 Japan TEL:+81-3-6266-6400 JAXA WEB SITE : http://www.jaxa.jp/index_e.html About This Mail Service : To change registered e-mail address, or to cancel this service, please access to http://www.jaxa.jp/pr/mail/index_e.html -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From pjp961 at svol.net Fri Oct 14 13:47:10 2011 From: pjp961 at svol.net (Peter Pesavento) Date: Fri, 14 Oct 2011 13:47:10 -0400 Subject: [FPSPACE] More about the Iraninan Monkey mission that didn't succeed Message-ID: <4e9875b1.c2c5e70a.3468.ffffcc7a@mx.google.com> http://news.yahoo.com/bad-news-irans-space-monkey-184046067.html News source is from Turkey -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From jeoberg at comcast.net Fri Oct 14 16:54:56 2011 From: jeoberg at comcast.net (James E Oberg) Date: Fri, 14 Oct 2011 15:54:56 -0500 Subject: [FPSPACE] More about the Iraninan Monkey mission that didn't succeed References: <4e9875b1.c2c5e70a.3468.ffffcc7a@mx.google.com> Message-ID: <7188154946DD44359BD218D72E76F81C@ownerfbf08f40c> Is it an independent news source or just another excited newspaper piggy-backing on the original story? I suspect the latter. AFP said there was an Iranian press report that they quoted. I cannot find that original report. ----- Original Message ----- From: Peter Pesavento To: fpspace at friends-partners.org Sent: Friday, October 14, 2011 12:47 PM Subject: [FPSPACE] More about the Iraninan Monkey mission that didn't succeed http://news.yahoo.com/bad-news-irans-space-monkey-184046067.html News source is from Turkey ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ _______________________________________________ FPSPACE mailing list FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From ljk4 at msn.com Fri Oct 14 20:57:06 2011 From: ljk4 at msn.com (LARRY KLAES) Date: Fri, 14 Oct 2011 20:57:06 -0400 Subject: [FPSPACE] FW: Centauri Dreams - Remembering Colliers and Looking Ahead In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Date: Fri, 14 Oct 2011 19:08:32 +0000 Subject: Centauri Dreams From: gilster at mindspring.com To: ljk4 at msn.com Centauri Dreams Centauri Dreams Remembering Collier?s and Looking Ahead Posted: 14 Oct 2011 06:37 AM PDT We?ve been talking lately about space missions designed to maximize science vs. those that are at least partly geared toward public relations. But most missions will have both components, the need for public support being woven into the fabric of our ambitions. As we try, then, to ramp up the scientific return, what can we also do to keep the public engaged and instill interest in space exploration? One answer came from Wernher von Braun?s massive project for space exploration, described in a series of articles on space presented by Collier?s magazine from March of 1952 to April, 1954. Let?s put aside all the technical problems of the von Braun concept and concentrate on it as an incentive for space missions. Al Jackson, with whom I enjoyed dinner and several good conversations in Orlando at the 100 Year Starship Symposium, recently sent me The Ugly Spaceship and the Astounding Dream, an article he wrote for the AIAA?s Horizons magazine. Al is completely upfront about the fact that it was the Collier?s series that brought him into space research in the first place. Now a visiting scientist at the Lunar and Planetary Institute, Al has seen aerospace from the government side (as astronaut trainer on the Lunar Module Simulator) to industry, knew Robert Bussard as well as Robert Forward, and wrote a number of papers on interstellar matters for JBIS, including work in the late 1970s on a laser-powered interstellar ramjet that I want to discuss soon in these pages. Image: Chesley Bonestell?s take on the von Braun lunar lander, an ugly spaceship with a mind-blowing cargo of ideas. The Collier?s series, tapping the artistic genius of Chesley Bonestell, produced what Al calls ?the most influential feat of popular science writing ever,? with its depiction of a complete manned space program ranging from Earth-circling space stations to lunar landings and that massive expedition to Mars. And ?massive? is the right word, for von Braun imagined a flotilla of ten spaceships with a crew of 70 making the Mars journey, fifty of them landing on the surface. 950 ferry flights were needed to assemble the spaceships, but von Braun?s vision included the space infrastructure to make that happen, all based on ideas he had been working on in 1947 and 1948, published first in a German journal and then brought out in a hardcover edition: Marsprojekt; Studie einer interplanetrischen Expedition. Sonderheft der Zeitschrift Weltraumfahrt (1952). But it was the October 18, 1952 issue of Collier?s that Al, then almost twelve years old, found the most fascinating, the one with the ugliest, most un-aerodynamic spaceship he had ever seen shown on final descent to the Moon. It was in the pages of this issue that he learned that aerodynamic shapes count for little in space, and as he tells us in his article, the entire series would wind up changing his life: I came to love that ugly space ship! It cemented itself to my soul. It led me to a life in science, a B.A. degree in Mathematics, an M.A. degree in Physics and a Ph.D. in physics. Most startling, to me, that series led me to 35 years of work in spaceflight, first Apollo, the Shuttle program, and now the ISS. All due to the romance of space expressed by Chesley Bonestell, Wernher von Braun and Willy Ley. Collier?s produced spectacle and soaring ideas, doubtless contributing to the careers of numerous scientists and engineers, even if we now find the technical specifications of the von Braun program daunting. But I sometimes wonder what we might do today to recapture some of the spectacle produced by the Apollo landings, which similarly energized broad portions of the population. Space-minded people like myself are fascinated with the Dawn mission to Vesta and Ceres, and equally drawn to the allure of the Pluto/Charon encounter coming up in 2015. But what would have the most impact on those less obsessed with deep space? I think I may have found the right concept. It?s the notion of exploring another planet by balloon, exemplified by MGA, the Mars Geoscience Aerobot, studied by a JPL team in the 1990s under the acronym MABVAP ? Mars Aerobot Validation Program. It?s an idea with an international pedigree: A balloon system for Mars designed for a Soviet space probe was also under development through the work of Jacques Blamont (CNES), although the project was eventually dropped for financial reasons. In essence, though, the ideas are similar. The idea is to deliver a superpressure balloon system to Mars, an aerobot that would remain aloft for as much as three months, circumnavigating Mars more than 25 times. Along with an infrared spectroscopy system, a magnetometer, instruments for studying Martian weather and a radar sounder, the balloon would be equipped with an ultrahigh resolution stereo imager. Robert Zubrin and a team at Martin Marietta have more recently been working on the Mars Aerial Platform (MAP), a plan to use eight balloons to map the global circulation of Mars? atmosphere, examine its surface and subsurface with remote sensing techniques, and return thousands of high resolution images of the Martian surface. The views returned by an aerial circumnavigation of Mars would be little short of spectacular, as Zubrin notes in the new edition of his The Case for Mars (2011): Today, nearly five hundred years since Copernicus and Kepler, Brahe and Galileo, most people still think of Earth as the only world in the universe. The other planets remain mere points of light, their wanderings through the night sky of interest to a select few. They are abstractions, notions taught in schools. The MAP cameras offer the possibility of taking humanity?s eyes to another planet in a way that has never been done before. Through the gondola?s cameras we will see Mars in its spectacular vastness: its enormous canyons, its towering mountains, its dry lake and river beds, its rocky plains and frozen fields. We will see that Mars is truly another world, no longer a notion but a possible destination. And, just as the New World entranced and enticed mariners here on Earth, so can Mars entice a new generation of voyagers, a generation ready to fashion the ships and sails proper for heavenly air. Remember, I?m thinking in terms of how to kindle public interest in space and keep those fires burning, and to me the ability to see the topography of Mars through close-up imaging of its entire surface could create an experience as breathtaking for some budding scientists as the Collier?s series was for Al Jackson. We go from looking at rover tracks and landscapes limited by a rover?s range to the ability to move freely over Mars, from Olympus Mons to the Valles Marineris. Similar missions have been proposed for Titan, with a certain scientific return as well as the potential for serious public engagement as the aerobot probes the surface of the mysterious moon. An autonomous flying robot was actually delivered to Venus on each of the two Soviet Vega probes, entering the atmosphere in June of 1985. The first balloon failed after less than an hour, but the second operated for almost two Earth days until its batteries failed. Deployed onto the darkside of the planet at an altitude of about 50 kilometers, the balloons operated for their brief lives in an altitude where pressure and temperature were not dissimilar to those of Earth. While the scientific return from the Vega balloons was minimal, the concept was validated. Using aerostats equipped with high-definition imaging capabilities on Mars, we may be able to re-create some of the sizzle of exploration that the Voyagers had, giving a boost to science-minded young people and providing vistas for public viewing through remote sensing that could one day be looked back on as the key players in creating new careers in science. We may or may not one day get to the stars, but if we do, it will be because the right people came across the right incentives, leading them into careers that could change the way we do space exploration. You are subscribed to email updates from Centauri Dreams To stop receiving these emails, you may unsubscribe now. Email delivery powered by Google Google Inc., 20 West Kinzie, Chicago IL USA 60610 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From ljk4 at msn.com Fri Oct 14 20:59:14 2011 From: ljk4 at msn.com (LARRY KLAES) Date: Fri, 14 Oct 2011 20:59:14 -0400 Subject: [FPSPACE] ESA asks Russia to fill in for NASA to explore Mars Message-ID: While the U.S. Stalls, Europe Moves On to MarsOct. 14, 2011 | 13:21 PDT | 20:21 UTC By Charlene Anderson The European Space Agency (ESA) seems to have gotten tired of waiting for NASA to commit to its share of the joint 2016/2018 Mars missions that were planned to lay the groundwork for an eventual delivery of samples of Mars to Earth. Space News is reporting that, to save the two-mission plan, ESA Director-General Jean-Jacques Dordain has formally invited Russia in as a full partner. He's asking the Russian space agency, Roscosmos, to provide its Proton rocket to launch the European Mars telecommunications orbiter and a small lander in 2016. NASA has told ESA that its budget will not allow it to commit to launching the 2016 mission, and the hoped-for 2018 launch of the ExoMars rover on an Atlas 5 is not confirmed. If Russia accepts ESA's partnership offer, the rover will launch on a Proton. Full article here: http://www.planetary.org/blog/article/00003222/ -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From ljk4 at msn.com Fri Oct 14 21:09:46 2011 From: ljk4 at msn.com (LARRY KLAES) Date: Fri, 14 Oct 2011 21:09:46 -0400 Subject: [FPSPACE] Remember when trying to get any images and info on a Soviet space mission was hard... Message-ID: Phobos-Grunt update; lots of new images and video!Oct. 14, 2011 | 15:39 PDT | 22:39 UTC http://www.planetary.org/blog/article/00003223/ -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From jeoberg at comcast.net Fri Oct 14 23:17:15 2011 From: jeoberg at comcast.net (James E Oberg) Date: Fri, 14 Oct 2011 22:17:15 -0500 Subject: [FPSPACE] Remember when trying to get any images and info on a Soviet space mission was hard... References: Message-ID: <9B7BB9D5A6AD493D92E19C6837ECF37E@ownerfbf08f40c> Has anyone seen the detailed ascent/insertion timeline? Specifically, will the interplanetary burn[s] be made during comm, or 'in the blind'? ----- Original Message ----- From: LARRY KLAES To: fpspace Sent: Friday, October 14, 2011 8:09 PM Subject: [FPSPACE] Remember when trying to get any images and info on a Soviet space mission was hard... Phobos-Grunt update; lots of new images and video! Oct. 14, 2011 | 15:39 PDT | 22:39 UTC http://www.planetary.org/blog/article/00003223/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ _______________________________________________ FPSPACE mailing list FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From phillipclark at btinternet.com Sat Oct 15 04:26:18 2011 From: phillipclark at btinternet.com (Phillip Clark) Date: Sat, 15 Oct 2011 09:26:18 +0100 Subject: [FPSPACE] More about the Iraninan Monkey mission that didn'tsucceed In-Reply-To: <7188154946DD44359BD218D72E76F81C@ownerfbf08f40c> References: <4e9875b1.c2c5e70a.3468.ffffcc7a@mx.google.com> <7188154946DD44359BD218D72E76F81C@ownerfbf08f40c> Message-ID: <6F5533CACC694BE8BF2FA07C9E60C7AA@WINDOWSPGK1XFS> http://www.iranmilitaryforum.net/index.php?topic=9848.30 Of course, some translation will be required. Phillip Clark ----- Original Message ----- From: James E Oberg To: Peter Pesavento ; fpspace at friends-partners.org Sent: Friday, October 14, 2011 9:54 PM Subject: Re: [FPSPACE] More about the Iraninan Monkey mission that didn'tsucceed Is it an independent news source or just another excited newspaper piggy-backing on the original story? I suspect the latter. AFP said there was an Iranian press report that they quoted. I cannot find that original report. ----- Original Message ----- From: Peter Pesavento To: fpspace at friends-partners.org Sent: Friday, October 14, 2011 12:47 PM Subject: [FPSPACE] More about the Iraninan Monkey mission that didn't succeed http://news.yahoo.com/bad-news-irans-space-monkey-184046067.html News source is from Turkey ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- _______________________________________________ FPSPACE mailing list FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ _______________________________________________ FPSPACE mailing list FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From jeoberg at comcast.net Sat Oct 15 08:30:49 2011 From: jeoberg at comcast.net (James E Oberg) Date: Sat, 15 Oct 2011 07:30:49 -0500 Subject: [FPSPACE] More about the Iraninan Monkey mission thatdidn'tsucceed References: <4e9875b1.c2c5e70a.3468.ffffcc7a@mx.google.com> <7188154946DD44359BD218D72E76F81C@ownerfbf08f40c> <6F5533CACC694BE8BF2FA07C9E60C7AA@WINDOWSPGK1XFS> Message-ID: <37975BFB57CD4D7484CDC99F673F381B@ownerfbf08f40c> Phil, I don't see anything new here. In fact, since this forum has participants with access to Farsi-languaged press, it does support the view the orriginal French story -- and all subsequent retreads and elaborations [eg, turkish] from that story, are based on some misunderstanding. AFP said it got its information from a published story. That original published story has yet to be found. ----- Original Message ----- From: Phillip Clark To: fpspace at friends-partners.org Sent: Saturday, October 15, 2011 3:26 AM Subject: Re: [FPSPACE] More about the Iraninan Monkey mission thatdidn'tsucceed http://www.iranmilitaryforum.net/index.php?topic=9848.30 Of course, some translation will be required. Phillip Clark ----- Original Message ----- From: James E Oberg To: Peter Pesavento ; fpspace at friends-partners.org Sent: Friday, October 14, 2011 9:54 PM Subject: Re: [FPSPACE] More about the Iraninan Monkey mission that didn'tsucceed Is it an independent news source or just another excited newspaper piggy-backing on the original story? I suspect the latter. AFP said there was an Iranian press report that they quoted. I cannot find that original report. ----- Original Message ----- From: Peter Pesavento To: fpspace at friends-partners.org Sent: Friday, October 14, 2011 12:47 PM Subject: [FPSPACE] More about the Iraninan Monkey mission that didn't succeed http://news.yahoo.com/bad-news-irans-space-monkey-184046067.html News source is from Turkey -------------------------------------------------------------------------- _______________________________________________ FPSPACE mailing list FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- _______________________________________________ FPSPACE mailing list FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ _______________________________________________ FPSPACE mailing list FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From agzak at optonline.net Sat Oct 15 08:53:33 2011 From: agzak at optonline.net (Anatoly Zak) Date: Sat, 15 Oct 2011 08:53:33 -0400 Subject: [FPSPACE] Remember when trying to get any images and info on a Soviet space mission was hard... In-Reply-To: <9B7BB9D5A6AD493D92E19C6837ECF37E@ownerfbf08f40c> Message-ID: You are clearly not reading a real source on the Phobos-Grunt, or any other Russian mission for this matter :) http://www.russianspaceweb.com/phobos_grunt_scenario.html Quote: ...First two firings would be conducted in accordance with a pre-programmed sequence, while the third maneuver would be commanded on the basis of the latest trajectory tracking data.... I should mention that the launch profile apparently changed again to a two-engine burn. I will update the page before the launch. Anatoly Zak On 10/14/11 11:17 PM, "James E Oberg" wrote: > Has anyone seen the detailed ascent/insertion timeline? > > Specifically, will the interplanetary burn[s] be made during comm, or 'in the > blind'? > > > >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> >> From: LARRY KLAES >> >> To: fpspace >> >> Sent: Friday, October 14, 2011 8:09 PM >> >> Subject: [FPSPACE] Remember when trying to get any images and info on a >> Soviet space mission was hard... >> >> >> >> >> >> Phobos-Grunt update; lots of new images and video! >> >> Oct. 14, 2011 | 15:39 PDT | 22:39 UTC >> >> http://www.planetary.org/blog/article/00003223/ >> >> >> >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> FPSPACE mailing list >> FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org >> http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> FPSPACE mailing list >> FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org >> http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From m.launer at att.net Sun Oct 16 16:46:44 2011 From: m.launer at att.net (Michael Launer) Date: Sun, 16 Oct 2011 13:46:44 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [FPSPACE] Roskosmos decides to abandon development of Rus-M booster In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <1318798004.20517.YahooMailRC@web180804.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> Different print versions of news reports use both and development. Also, it is said that the booster is not needed (meaning before 2015). Clear as mud, perhaps purposely so. MKL ________________________________ From: "fpspace-request at www.friends-partners.org" To: fpspace at www.friends-partners.org Sent: Fri, October 14, 2011 4:55:07 PM Subject: FPSPACE Digest, Vol 91, Issue 5 Send FPSPACE mailing list submissions to ??? fpspace at www.friends-partners.org To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit ??? http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to ??? fpspace-request at www.friends-partners.org You can reach the person managing the list at ??? fpspace-owner at www.friends-partners.org When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific than "Re: Contents of FPSPACE digest..." Today's Topics: ? 1. Re: Roskosmos decides to abandon development??? of??? Rus-M??? booster ? ? ? (jameseoberg at comcast.net) ? 2. Re: Roskosmos decides to abandon development of Rus-M??? booster ? ? ? (Constantine A. Domashnev) ? 3. Mercury Messenger spacecraft first solar day results ? ? ? (David R. Woods) ? 4. Cosmos 2472 down? (Phillip Clark) ? 5. Shenzhou-8, Tiangong plans (Allen Thomson) ? 6. With Shenzhou/Tiangong rendezvous nearing,??? WHAT was that ? ? ? Shijian-12 rendezvous sequence last year? (James E Oberg) ? 7. Re: With Shenzhou/Tiangong rendezvous nearing,??? WHAT was that ? ? ? Shijian-12 rendezvous sequence last year? (Phillip Clark) ? 8. 'Iran Failed With Space Monkey Launch: Report' (James E Oberg) ? 9. FW: Centauri Dreams - Thoughts on a Different Apollo (LARRY KLAES) ? 10. Daring Russian Sample Return mission to Martian Moon Phobos ? ? ? aims for November Liftoff (LARRY KLAES) ? 11. Fwd: [JAXA:0311] Astronaut Hoshide Begins to Tweet! (LARRY KLAES ) ? 12. More about the Iraninan Monkey mission that didn't succeed ? ? ? (Peter Pesavento) ? 13. Re: More about the Iraninan Monkey mission that didn't ? ? ? succeed (James E Oberg) ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Message: 1 Date: Sat, 8 Oct 2011 00:14:35 +0000 (UTC) From: jameseoberg at comcast.net To: Charles Vick Cc: fpspace at www.friends-partners.org Subject: Re: [FPSPACE] Roskosmos decides to abandon development??? of ??? Rus-M??? booster Message-ID: ??? <1888273060.77679.1318032875269.JavaMail.root at sz0079a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net> ??? Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" This remains a members-only link to the article, I'll try to get my pdf file posted on my home page/ Aerospace America (AIAA) ? // ? October 2011 issue PERSPECTIVES ON THE RUS-M BOOSTER PROJECT Plans for building Rus-M, Russia's next-generation crew-carrying space booster, face mounting problems. by James Oberg http://www.aerospaceamerica.org/Pages/TableOfContents.aspx -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: ------------------------------ Message: 2 Date: Fri, 7 Oct 2011 20:36:45 -0400 From: "Constantine A. Domashnev" To: Subject: Re: [FPSPACE] Roskosmos decides to abandon development of ??? Rus-M??? booster Message-ID: <000801cc8552$5dbb7300$0800a8c0 at vosem> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Hi, >From what I can tell at the moment of this writing, the majority of news >agencies/reporters seem to use the 'to suspend' wording. To what degree it is "wishful thinking", I cannot tell. KD Pittsburgh, PA -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: ------------------------------ Message: 3 Date: Sat, 08 Oct 2011 21:50:14 -0400 From: "David R. Woods" To: fpspace at friends-partners.org Subject: [FPSPACE] Mercury Messenger spacecraft first solar day ??? results Message-ID: <4E90FDD6.9020506 at stny.rr.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252; format=flowed Has anyone seen any of the results that were to be presented at this conference? ******************************** http://messenger.jhuapl.edu/ October 5, 2011 *MESSENGER Team Presents New Mercury Findings at Planetary Conference* Nantes, France?MESSENGER scientists will highlight the latest results on Mercury from MESSENGER observations obtained during the first six months (the first Mercury solar day) in orbit. These findings will be presented October 5 in 30 papers and posters as part of a special session of the joint meeting of the European Planetary Science Congress and the Division for Planetary Sciences of the American Astronomical Society in Nantes, Frances. ------------------------------ Message: 4 Date: Mon, 10 Oct 2011 08:12:24 +0100 From: "Phillip Clark" To: "FPSPACE" Subject: [FPSPACE] Cosmos 2472 down? Message-ID: Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" There have been no new element sets for Cosmos 2472, the latest Kobalt-M photoreconnaissance satellite, issued since October 8.77. Therefore, I am wondering whether it has come down. Phillip Clark -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: ------------------------------ Message: 5 Date: Tue, 11 Oct 2011 06:03:12 -0700 (PDT) From: Allen Thomson To: FPSpace Cc: Ted J Molczan Subject: [FPSPACE] Shenzhou-8, Tiangong plans Message-ID: ??? <1318338192.92061.YahooMailClassic at web80207.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii http://english.peopledaily.com.cn/202936/7614095.html China's Shenzhou-8 spacecraft launch on target 13:46, October 11, 2011 After the space laboratory module Tiangong-1 successfully entered orbit, the launch of the Shenzhou-8 spacecraft is imminent. Locking in a remarkable "kiss in space," the two will come together in early November, according to space experts. "The preparation for launch is proceeding now," Yin Jiangang, an expert tied to China's space program, told the Global Times on Monday, "according to the original plan, Shenzhou-8 will be launched at the end of October or beginning of November, depending on the technical preparations and weather conditions." The unmanned Shenzhou-8 spacecraft will conduct its first docking test within two days of reaching Tiangong-1 to form a combined spacecraft, according to the Ministry of National Defense. After flying together for about 12 days, the two space modules will separate and prepare for another docking test. After the two docking tests, Shenzhou-8 will return to Earth, while Tiangong-1 will remain in long-term orbit to await the next round of docking practice. In preparation for the docking test, Tiangong-1 was designed to lower its orbit and carry out phase modulations ahead of the launch of its counterpart. "Tiangong-1 controls the progress of the docking at all times," Zhang Bonan, chief designer of Tiangong-1, said to the Science and Technology Daily, "It keeps sending signals to let its counterpart know where it is and to guide the flight path after the docking." If the docking test is successful, China will be the third country to have independently developed space docking technology after the US and Russia. Yin expressed his confidence about the Shenzhou-8 launch, but admitted risks still existed. He believed that the docking test would "lay a sound foundation for the large-scale construction of China's own space station and space experiments in the future." "Tiangong-1 once combined will forms a small-scale space station. China's space station, in its true capacity, may be sent up piece-by-piece from the new satellite launch center in Wenchang, Hainan Province after 2014," Yin told the Global Times, "That will be the task for spacecraft like Shenzhou-11 and -12." According to China's ambitious space plan, Shenzhou-8 through -10 will conduct docking tests with Tiangong-1. Different from the pioneering docking spaceship, Shenzhou-9 and -10 may be manned by an astronaut to complete manual space docking with Tiangong-1. Before 2016, China is planning to send Tiangong-2 and Tiangong-3 into orbit. [snip] ------------------------------ Message: 6 Date: Tue, 11 Oct 2011 16:49:45 -0500 From: "James E Oberg" To: Subject: [FPSPACE] With Shenzhou/Tiangong rendezvous nearing,??? WHAT was ??? that Shijian-12 rendezvous sequence last year? Message-ID: <2B56EBA2E16A4048BC73FE024528FDF9 at ownerfbf08f40c> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" With Shenzhou/Tiangong rendezvous nearing, WHAT was that Shijian-12 rendezvous sequence last year? Last year's articles: http://www.thespacereview.com/article/1689/1 and http://www.wired.com/dangerroom/2010/08/chinas-secret-satellite-rendezvous-suggestive-of-a-military-program/ and Two Chinese satellites rendezvous in orbit http://www.newscientist.com/article/dn19379-two-chinese-satellites-rendezvous-in-orbit.html Satellite-watchers worry about China http://cosmiclog.msnbc.msn.com/_news/2010/08/30/5003915-satellite-watchers-worry-about-china restarting the forum http://forum.nasaspaceflight.com/index.php?action=post;topic=21988.75;num_replies=85 In hindsight are there any new insights into these rendezvous maneuvers? Is there any hint from official or unofficial Chinese sources? With the first attempt at PUBLIC rendezvous only a few weeks away, the nature of this still very SECRET series of maneuvers needs to be better understood. Or did I miss somebody's full report? -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: ------------------------------ Message: 7 Date: Wed, 12 Oct 2011 08:13:24 +0100 From: "Phillip Clark" To: "fpSPACE" Subject: Re: [FPSPACE] With Shenzhou/Tiangong rendezvous nearing,??? WHAT ??? was that Shijian-12 rendezvous sequence last year? Message-ID: Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Since the Shijian 12 rendezvous tests last year were too late to be seriously considered to be related to the Tiangong 1 programme, I had assumed that they were part of a satellite inspector programme. Phillip Clark ? ----- Original Message ----- ? From: James E Oberg ? To: fpspace at friends-partners.org ? Sent: Tuesday, October 11, 2011 10:49 PM ? Subject: [FPSPACE] With Shenzhou/Tiangong rendezvous nearing,WHAT was that Shijian-12 rendezvous sequence last year? ? With Shenzhou/Tiangong rendezvous nearing, WHAT was that Shijian-12 rendezvous sequence last year? ? Last year's articles: ? ? http://www.thespacereview.com/article/1689/1 and ? http://www.wired.com/dangerroom/2010/08/chinas-secret-satellite-rendezvous-suggestive-of-a-military-program/ and ? Two Chinese satellites rendezvous in orbit ? http://www.newscientist.com/article/dn19379-two-chinese-satellites-rendezvous-in-orbit.html ? Satellite-watchers worry about China ? http://cosmiclog.msnbc.msn.com/_news/2010/08/30/5003915-satellite-watchers-worry-about-china ? ? restarting the forum ? http://forum.nasaspaceflight.com/index.php?action=post;topic=21988.75;num_replies=85 ? ? In hindsight are there any new insights into these rendezvous maneuvers? Is there any hint from official or unofficial Chinese sources? ? ? With the first attempt at PUBLIC rendezvous only a few weeks away, the nature of this still very SECRET series of maneuvers needs to be better understood. ? ? Or did I miss somebody's full report? ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ ? _______________________________________________ ? FPSPACE mailing list ? FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org ? http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: ------------------------------ Message: 8 Date: Wed, 12 Oct 2011 12:26:03 -0500 From: "James E Oberg" To: Subject: [FPSPACE] 'Iran Failed With Space Monkey Launch: Report' Message-ID: <24AAE80871074328BFF0A3E9D66A2E56 at ownerfbf08f40c> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" AFP: 'Iran Failed With Space Monkey Launch: Report' ? ? Paris, Oct 12 -- Iran acknowledged as a failure Wednesday its attempt to send a live monkey into space last month -- touted as its first step towards launching a man into space. ? "The Kavoshgar-5 rocket carrying a capsule with a live animal (a monkey) was launched during Shahrivar," an Iranian calendar month spanning August 23 to September 22, Deputy Science Minister Mohammad Mehdinejad-Nouri was quoted as saying by the ISNA news agency. ? "However, the launch was not publicised as all of its anticipated objectives were not accomplished," Mehdinejad-Nouri told reporters. ? He said the launch of a live animal into space was "strategic, and a priority," and expressed hope that future launches would attain more of the objectives set. ? On October 3, Iran indefinitely postponed plans to send a live monkey into space, without giving any reasons. ? "One cannot give a set date for this project and as soon as our nation's scientists announce the readiness (of the project) it will be announced," said Hamid Fazeli, head of Iran's Space Organisation. ? The project envisaged launching a capsule with life support using the Kavoshgar-5 rocket to an altitude of 120 kilometres (75 miles) for a 20-minute sub-orbital flight. ? The project was unveiled in February by President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad. ? At the time, Fazeli touted the launch of a large animal as the first step towards sending a man into space, which Tehran says is scheduled for 2020. ? In mid-March, Iran announced the successful launch of an earlier version of the rocket, Kavoshgar-4, carrying a test capsule designed to house the monkey. ? Iran has already sent small animals into space -- a rat, turtles and worms -- aboard a capsule carried by its Kavoshgar-3 rocket in 2010. ? The Islamic republic, which first put a satellite into orbit in 2009, has outlined an ambitious space programme amid Western concerns the rocket technology may be linked to developing ballistic missiles that could deliver nuclear warheads. ? Tehran has repeatedly denied that its nuclear and scientific programmes mask military ambitions. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: ------------------------------ Message: 9 Date: Wed, 12 Oct 2011 23:44:30 -0400 From: LARRY KLAES To: fpspace , Subject: [FPSPACE] FW: Centauri Dreams - Thoughts on a Different ??? Apollo Message-ID: Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1252" Date: Wed, 12 Oct 2011 19:20:16 +0000 Subject: Centauri Dreams From: gilster at mindspring.com To: ljk4 at msn.com Centauri Dreams Centauri Dreams Thoughts on a Different Apollo Posted: 12 Oct 2011 05:34 AM PDT Did the Apollo missions produce enough good science to justify their cost? It?s a question Freeman Dyson has speculated on in the past, calling the missions a success because they were? ?conceived and honestly presented to the public as an international sporting event and not as a contribution to science.? Symbolic of this is the fact that the first item to be unpacked after each landing was the television camera that relayed mission imagery back to Earth. Apollo inevitably labored under the camera?s gaze, but no great scientific discoveries came from it, and the entertainment emphasis inevitably detracted from the missions? scientific objectives. Image: Buzz Aldrin leaves the lunar lander in this photo snapped by Neil Armstrong. What might Apollo have been if it had been conceived from the start to produce good science? Imagine this: Our six Apollo landings put two astronauts each on the surface for a period of several days. At their disposal were two tons of supplies and equipment. For the entire project, Apollo gave us a total of about 50 man-days on the Moon using an aggregate 12 tons of equipment. What if Apollo had produced 40 man-days per ton of equipment instead of the 4 it actually delivered? This could have been achieved by unmanned freight carriers conducting half the landings, providing six astronauts with 60 tons of supplies and equipment, sufficient for 400 days on the Moon. You wind up with 2400 man-days of exploration instead of the 50 we achieved with Apollo. Let me quote John Cramer on this, because I?m drawing these thoughts from a column he wrote for Analog all the way back in 1988. Dyson had been visiting the University of Washington, where Cramer was then on the physics faculty, and his last lecture there contained these thoughts. Cramer took note of the advantages a much longer stay on the Moon could have brought: With this much time, Dyson suggested, the Apollo project might have achieved some significant science. There would have been time to explore the lunar poles , to circumnavigate the body, to set up radio-astronomy dishes on the Moon?s radio-quiet back side, to take the time to investigate and theorize and observe and test and probe. There would have been the time and opportunity to bring into play those intrinsically human skills which have lead in previous years-long voyages of discovery to new insights and understanding. The real Apollo, of course, was carried out in a few days by test pilots operating at a dead run, with one eye on the clock and the other on the prime-time news schedule. There was simply no time for science. Dyson?s revisionist version of Apollo is another road not taken. The Problem of Premature Choice Apollo was a success, but on the terms the mission was built around, and it could have been done much better. The Space Shuttle, however, was something much different, an example of what Dyson refers to as the ?Problem of Premature Choice,? which he defines as ?betting all your money on one horse before you have found whether she is lame.? Translated into bureaucratic terms, this means that a project can become large enough that exploring alternative engineering methods is seen as a waste that could become embarrassing to the public officials who have supported the project all along. Thus one of several alternatives is hastily selected, the rest eliminated, and the premature selection prevents the accurate analysis of the other methods. Dyson himself has always been an example of independent thinking, but one whose priorities in space exploration favor science, which he thinks should command center stage. As he told his University of Washington audience, the contrast between the Space Shuttle and the International Ultraviolet Explorer (IUE) is instructive. The IUE came with mirror and optics from NASA, a solar power system from ESA, and communications gear from the UK. Countless astronomers and astrophysicists have used it to study tens of thousands of stellar objects in ultraviolet and visible wavelengths, and the IUE was available when supernova SN1987A occurred, providing exceptionally useful light curves that are suddenly back in the news as we try to figure out why neutrinos observed at CERN behaved differently from those from this event. The IUE, which had been expected to last for three years, ended up serving us for eighteen, being finally shut down in 1996, some eight years after Dyson gave his talk at the University of Washington. The IUE provided a great scientific return in a mission that remains to this day little known. Learning where the payoff is ? and deciding what kind of payoff you want to achieve ? is key to the process. Looking at NASA?s future as of 1988, John Cramer asked this question: Will there be further plodding along the dismal path that has lead from the triumph of Apollo to the Challenger Disaster? Will the agency continue to place science far down in the priority queue, going always for the Premature Choice and the job security of mammoth engineering projects? Will NASA continue to withhold any investments in the future, in advanced propulsion technologies, and in new ideas? I hope not. Choosing the Right Technology The questions don?t seem to have changed much over the course of the last 23 years, although the scope of our ambitions has been downsized since that even earlier time (1952) when Wernher von Braun proposed a manned expedition to Mars that would have required moving 70 men and 4200 tons of equipment into orbit around the Red Planet, debarking 50 men and 150 tons of equipment to the surface in three ships, using what was essentially World War II technology. Image: A Chesley Bonestell illustration from a 1952 issue of Collier?s showing his take on the von Braun Mars expedition. A premature choice would have been dangerous here as well. Among the things Apollo did right was to work with adequate communications channels. Where von Braun chose a 1 kHz bandwidth for the link between the Mars expedition and Earth (essentially allowing the two to communicate via Morse code), Apollo was designed for spectacle and television, and used a communications bandwidth thousands of times broader. Dyson is all about getting the mix right, the right technology (competitively chosen) coupled to serious scientific purpose to achieve a lasting result. John Cramer?s long-running Alternate View column in Analog can be accessed online. Talking to Cramer at the 100 Year Starship Symposium, I mentioned how useful I had found it over the years, and he told me that the site housing his column had been one of the first to appear on the Internet in Washington, preceding even the Microsoft website. Talk about getting ahead of the curve! Readers will enjoy Dr. Cramer?s take on everything from quantum mechanics to virtual reality over decades of speculation and analysis, a true resource for the interstellar minded. It?s also a source, as this 1988 column showed, of insightful commentary on getting our priorities right. ? You are subscribed to email updates from Centauri Dreams To stop receiving these emails, you may unsubscribe now. Email delivery powered by Google Google Inc., 20 West Kinzie, Chicago IL USA 60610 ??? ??? ??? ? ??? ??? ? -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: ------------------------------ Message: 10 Date: Thu, 13 Oct 2011 13:01:49 -0400 From: LARRY KLAES To: fpspace , , ??? Faces from Earth Google Group Subject: [FPSPACE] Daring Russian Sample Return mission to Martian ??? Moon Phobos aims for November Liftoff Message-ID: Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1252" Daring Russian Sample Return mission to Martian Moon Phobos aims for November Liftoff by Ken Kremer on October 13, 2011 In just over 3 weeks time, Russia plans to launch a bold mission to Mars who?s objective, if successful , is to land on the Martian Moon Phobos and return a cargo of precious soil samples back to Earth about three years later.? ? The purpose is to determine the origin and evolution of Phobos and how that relates to Mars and the evolution of the solar system. Liftoff of the Phobos-Grunt space probe will end a nearly two decade long hiatus in Russia?s exploration of the Red Planet following the failed Mars 96 mission and? is currently scheduled to head to space just weeks prior to this year?s other Mars mission ? namely NASA?s? next Mars rover, the Curiosity Mars Science Laboratory (MSL). http://www.universetoday.com/89845/daring-russian-sample-return-mission-to-martian-moon-phobos-aims-for-november-liftoff/? ? ??? ??? ??? ? ??? ??? ? -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: ------------------------------ Message: 11 Date: Fri, 14 Oct 2011 10:20:50 +0000 From: "LARRY KLAES " To: "fpspace at friends-partners.org " Subject: [FPSPACE] Fwd: [JAXA:0311] Astronaut Hoshide Begins to Tweet! Message-ID: Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-15" ---------- Sent from AT&T Wireless using Windows Live Hotmail -----Original Message----- From: JAXA Press Release Mail Service Sent: 10/14/2011 7:58:25 AM To: ljk4 at msn.com Subject: [JAXA:0311] Astronaut Hoshide Begins to Tweet! October 14, 2011 (JST) Astronaut Hoshide Begins to Tweet! Astronaut Akihiko Hoshide of the Japan Aerospace Exploration Agency (JAXA) joined Twitter on October 14, 2011. Astronaut Hoshide has been assigned as a flight engineer for the Expedition 32/33 crew to stay at the International Space Station (ISS) for about six months from June 2012. During his last mission to space, STS-124 (J1 mission,) Astronaut Hoshide became the first Japanese to manipulate the ISS robotic arm, and conducted the assembly operation of the Japanese Experiment Module "Kibo," including installing the Kibo's Pressurized Module (PM) onto the ISS, moving the Experiment Logistics Module Pressurized Section to the PM, activating the PM, and initializing the Kibo's robotic arm. The mission this time is his second flight, and his first long-term space stay and engagement in a space experiment. On his Twitter page, he plans to introduce his training on the ground prior to his space trip, then report on his collaborative work with the Kibo's operation and control team based on his experience of daily ISS operations as a Capcom*. He will also tweet about science experiments, and his feelings while preparing for the mission, and during the mission. JAXA will provide real-time information on activities at the ISS and Kibo through the communication service tool, Twitter. * Capcom: a Capsule Communicator who is in charge of communicating with ? ? ? ? ? astronauts for the ISS control and operation. 1. Astronaut Akihito Hoshide's Twitter Details User name: Aki_Hoshide URL: http://twitter.com/Aki_Hoshide 2. Brief Personal History of JAXA Astronaut Akihiko Hoshide http://www.jaxa.jp/press/2011/10/20111014_hoshide_e.html#profile 3. Reference URL JAXA Website ? http://iss.jaxa.jp/en/ JAXA Astronaut Akihiko Hoshide ? http://iss.jaxa.jp/en/astro/biographies/hoshide/index.html URL: http://www.jaxa.jp/press/2011/10/20111014_hoshide_e.html -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Publisher : Public Affairs Department Japan Aerospace Exploration Agency (JAXA) Marunouchi Kitaguchi Building, 1-6-5, Marunouchi, Chiyoda-ku, Tokyo 100-8260 Japan TEL:+81-3-6266-6400 JAXA WEB SITE : http://www.jaxa.jp/index_e.html About This Mail Service : To change registered e-mail address, or to cancel this service, please access to http://www.jaxa.jp/pr/mail/index_e.html -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: ------------------------------ Message: 12 Date: Fri, 14 Oct 2011 13:47:10 -0400 From: "Peter Pesavento" To: Subject: [FPSPACE] More about the Iraninan Monkey mission that didn't ??? succeed Message-ID: <4e9875b1.c2c5e70a.3468.ffffcc7a at mx.google.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" http://news.yahoo.com/bad-news-irans-space-monkey-184046067.html News source is from Turkey -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: ------------------------------ Message: 13 Date: Fri, 14 Oct 2011 15:54:56 -0500 From: "James E Oberg" To: "Peter Pesavento" , ??? Subject: Re: [FPSPACE] More about the Iraninan Monkey mission that ??? didn't??? succeed Message-ID: <7188154946DD44359BD218D72E76F81C at ownerfbf08f40c> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Is it an independent news source or just another excited newspaper piggy-backing on the original story? I suspect the latter. AFP said there was an Iranian press report that they quoted. I cannot find that original report. ? ----- Original Message ----- ? From: Peter Pesavento ? To: fpspace at friends-partners.org ? Sent: Friday, October 14, 2011 12:47 PM ? Subject: [FPSPACE] More about the Iraninan Monkey mission that didn't succeed ? http://news.yahoo.com/bad-news-irans-space-monkey-184046067.html ? ? News source is from Turkey ? ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ ? _______________________________________________ ? FPSPACE mailing list ? FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org ? http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: ------------------------------ _______________________________________________ FPSPACE mailing list FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace End of FPSPACE Digest, Vol 91, Issue 5 ************************************** -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From ljk4 at msn.com Mon Oct 17 14:21:21 2011 From: ljk4 at msn.com (LARRY KLAES ) Date: Mon, 17 Oct 2011 18:21:21 +0000 Subject: [FPSPACE] Fwd: [New post] A Possible Approach to the Transnational History of Spaceflight Message-ID: ---------- Sent from AT&T Wireless using Windows Live Hotmail -----Original Message----- From: Roger Launius's Blog Sent: 10/17/2011 6:03:43 PM To: ljk4 at msn.com Subject: [New post] A Possible Approach to the Transnational History of Spaceflight New post on Roger Launius's Blog [http://1.gravatar.com/blavatar/5ab615dc2687e96bf21dc4fa4be2f3ff?s=32&ts=1318874623] [http://0.gravatar.com/avatar/488baba4b54ec638fa19eeebd09b6b69?s=50&d=identicon&r=G] A Possible Approach to the Transnational History of Spaceflight by launiusr My colleague, Andrew Jenks of the California State University, Long Beach, has been working on ideas of human spaceflight in the context of transnational history. While his thoughts are still formative, he has developed some for a Russian History Blog. I recommend these ideas to anyone with an interest. They may be accessed at: http://russianhistoryblog.org/2011/10/transnational-history-and-space-flight/ Comments are welcome. launiusr | October 17, 2011 at 6:03 pm | Tags: transnational | Categories: History, Politics, Space | URL: http://wp.me/pwYu1-DN Comment See all comments Unsubscribe or change your email settings at Manage Subscriptions. Trouble clicking? Copy and paste this URL into your browser: http://launiusr.wordpress.com/2011/10/17/a-possible-approach-to-the-transnational-history-of-spaceflight/ Thanks for flying with [http://s.wordpress.com/i/emails/wp-footericon.png] WordPress.com -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From ljk4 at msn.com Tue Oct 18 08:09:15 2011 From: ljk4 at msn.com (LARRY KLAES ) Date: Tue, 18 Oct 2011 12:09:15 +0000 Subject: [FPSPACE] Fwd: [NOVA] "Finding Life Beyond Earth" Message-ID: ---------- Sent from AT&T Wireless using Windows Live Hotmail -----Original Message----- From: NOVA Sent: 10/18/2011 12:02:21 PM To: ljk4 at msn.com Subject: [NOVA] "Finding Life Beyond Earth" If you have trouble viewing this email, read the online version. [http://images.nationalproduction.wgbh.org/EloquaImages/clients/WGBHNationalSites/{8175cab8-09c2-4412-82d9-06de233bd5af}_novabanner.jpg] NOVA PRESENTS Finding Life Beyond Earth: A two-hour special Airing Wednesday October 19 at 9pm ET/PT on PBS (Check local listings) Watch a preview [http://images.nationalproduction.wgbh.org/EloquaImages/clients/WGBHNationalSites/{81128d45-6fe8-4ff0-98c0-5e4bf0aba7f9}_finding-life-beyond-earth-main.jpg] [http://images.nationalproduction.wgbh.org/EloquaImages/clients/WGBHNationalSites/%7Ba3345900-6fd4-4a2a-aba5-2cfbcbd90e67%7D_twitter.png] TWITTER [http://images.nationalproduction.wgbh.org/EloquaImages/clients/WGBHNationalSites/%7B7104f04e-cc2e-4249-9704-803e75b1487d%7D_facebook.png] FACEBOOK [http://images.nationalproduction.wgbh.org/EloquaImages/clients/WGBHNationalSites/%7B06430d46-c4bd-449d-9ff1-b7ab6b828c80%7D_itunes.png] ITUNES [http://images.nationalproduction.wgbh.org/EloquaImages/clients/WGBHNationalSites/%7Bcdc57764-82a7-4d7e-9b2a-6e614b5f1124%7D_youtube.png] YOUTUBE [http://images.nationalproduction.wgbh.org/EloquaImages/clients/WGBHNationalSites/%7Ba363a99b-d5d5-4099-a52b-01d891c0b535%7D_rss.png] RSS [http://images.nationalproduction.wgbh.org/EloquaImages/clients/WGBHNationalSites/%7B648fc06b-8541-4520-a670-eff1ca37b0e7%7D_insidenova.png] INSIDE NOVA Take a spectacular trip to distant realms of our solar system to discover where secret forms of life may lie hidden. Combining the latest telescope images with dazzling animation, this program immerses audiences in the sights and sounds of alien worlds, while top astrobiologists explain how these places are changing how we think about the potential for life in our solar system. We used to think our neighboring planets and moons were fairly boring-mostly cold, dead rocks where life could never take hold. Today, however, the solar system looks wilder than we ever imagined. WEB FEATURES Watch a Preview Watch a preview of the program online now. Tour the Solar System Explore the planets, visit the moon, and gaze at the stars in this 3-D interactive model of the solar system. ________________________________ Findin[http://images.nationalproduction.wgbh.org/EloquaImages/clients/WGBHNationalSites/%7B3eeffd50-c29e-4c92-ba5a-abffc863d00d%7D_finding-life-beyond-earth-ecarddvd.jpg]g Life Beyond Earth is now available on DVD from ShopPBS.org. NOVA email subscribers get an exclusive offer of 20% off your entire order. Enter promotion code NOVAPBS at checkout to receive your discount. Cannot be combined with other offers. Offer valid through 11/30/11. ________________________________ The Spacetime Lemonade Stand NOVA asked people near the MIT campus to explain spacetime in exchange for free lemonade. See what they said. Have you got your own explanation for spacetime? Post your videos on our Facebook page. ________________________________ Become a NOVA and NOVA scienceNOW fan on Facebook, follow us on Twitter, and subscribe to our YouTube channel. ________________________________ Thank you for your interest in NOVA. We welcome your questions, comments, and feedback. You can send a message directly to nova at wgbh.org, or use our feedback form. Funding for NOVA is provided by David H. Koch, the Howard Hughes Medical Institute, the Corporation for Public Broadcasting, and PBS viewers. [http://images.nationalproduction.wgbh.org/EloquaImages/clients/WGBHNationalSites/%7B146e2c6a-82d8-4a79-8ded-d54185694190%7D_26552.png] [http://images.nationalproduction.wgbh.org/EloquaImages/clients/WGBHNationalSites/%7B694257b7-2349-4791-a7b6-1d981af0a964%7D_26553.png] [http://images.nationalproduction.wgbh.org/EloquaImages/clients/WGBHNationalSites/%7B051ac55a-dce0-4251-be35-de17a2492b0b%7D_26554.png] You are receiving this e-mail because you subscribed to the NOVA Newsletter. If you wish to unsubscribe from similar email communications, click here. If you wish to unsubscribe from all email, click here. Please do not reply to this email. If you have feedback, please visit www.pbs.org/wgbh/nova/feedback/. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From japio at dds.nl Thu Oct 20 03:50:44 2011 From: japio at dds.nl (Jakob Terweij) Date: Thu, 20 Oct 2011 09:50:44 +0200 Subject: [FPSPACE] new russian first Message-ID: <20111020095044.4joxa838tzc48o4k@webmail.dds.nl> When everything will go okay Russia will have a first today. From Kourou French Guyana will be launched for the first time a Russian build Soyuz rocket model CT with Gallileo satellite on board so this will be a first for Roskosmos and Starsem new Jakob Terweij j van Lennepstraat 249C 1053 JD Amsterdam +31651549606 From lucspace at hotmail.com Thu Oct 20 04:09:32 2011 From: lucspace at hotmail.com (Luc van den Abeelen) Date: Thu, 20 Oct 2011 10:09:32 +0200 Subject: [FPSPACE] new russian first In-Reply-To: <20111020095044.4joxa838tzc48o4k@webmail.dds.nl> References: <20111020095044.4joxa838tzc48o4k@webmail.dds.nl> Message-ID: The thing is, and I only noticed this a couple of days ago, that this is not a Starsem mission, but purely Arianespace. What is behind this shift? Cheers, Luc > Date: Thu, 20 Oct 2011 09:50:44 +0200 > From: japio at dds.nl > To: fpspace at friends-partners.org > Subject: [FPSPACE] new russian first > > > When everything will go okay Russia will have a first today. > From Kourou French Guyana will be launched for the first time a > Russian build Soyuz rocket model CT with Gallileo satellite on board > so this will be a first for Roskosmos and Starsem > > > new > > Jakob Terweij > j van Lennepstraat 249C > 1053 JD Amsterdam > +31651549606 > > _______________________________________________ > FPSPACE mailing list > FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org > http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From japio at dds.nl Thu Oct 20 04:32:42 2011 From: japio at dds.nl (Jakob Terweij) Date: Thu, 20 Oct 2011 10:32:42 +0200 Subject: [FPSPACE] new russian first In-Reply-To: References: <20111020095044.4joxa838tzc48o4k@webmail.dds.nl> Message-ID: <20111020103242.zi66nszlq9a88sgw@webmail.dds.nl> The launch is at 14.24 hrs MSK(is that local time?) and on the site of roscosmos.ru is a direct feed where you can watch the launch. And Luc about your comment i also dont understand so if Gallileo is launched on a soyuz in Baikonur it is a Starsem launch, now it is the same but in Kourou and suddenly it is Arianespace. interesting! jakob Quoting Luc van den Abeelen : > > The thing is, and I only noticed this a couple of days ago, that > this is not a Starsem mission, but purely Arianespace. What is > behind this shift? > > Cheers, > Luc > >> Date: Thu, 20 Oct 2011 09:50:44 +0200 >> From: japio at dds.nl >> To: fpspace at friends-partners.org >> Subject: [FPSPACE] new russian first >> >> >> When everything will go okay Russia will have a first today. >> From Kourou French Guyana will be launched for the first time a >> Russian build Soyuz rocket model CT with Gallileo satellite on board >> so this will be a first for Roskosmos and Starsem >> >> >> new >> >> Jakob Terweij >> j van Lennepstraat 249C >> 1053 JD Amsterdam >> +31651549606 >> >> _______________________________________________ >> FPSPACE mailing list >> FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org >> http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace > Jakob Terweij j van Lennepstraat 249C 1053 JD Amsterdam +31651549606 From nikolai39 at hotmail.fr Thu Oct 20 05:21:41 2011 From: nikolai39 at hotmail.fr (Nicolas PILLET) Date: Thu, 20 Oct 2011 11:21:41 +0200 Subject: [FPSPACE] new russian first In-Reply-To: <20111020103242.zi66nszlq9a88sgw@webmail.dds.nl> References: <20111020095044.4joxa838tzc48o4k@webmail.dds.nl>, , <20111020103242.zi66nszlq9a88sgw@webmail.dds.nl> Message-ID: STARSEM had been created only to launch Soyouz from Baykonur. When it is launched from French Guyane, it is under direct responsibility of Arianespace. And please note that th e launch pad is not at all in Kourou. It is in the territory of a city called Sinnamary, which is pretty far away from Kourou... > Date: Thu, 20 Oct 2011 10:32:42 +0200 > From: japio at dds.nl > To: lucspace at hotmail.com > CC: fpspace at friends-partners.org > Subject: Re: [FPSPACE] new russian first > > > The launch is at 14.24 hrs MSK(is that local time?) and on the site of > roscosmos.ru is a direct feed where you can watch the launch. > And Luc about your comment i also dont understand so if Gallileo is > launched on a soyuz in Baikonur it is a Starsem launch, now it is the > same but in Kourou and suddenly it is Arianespace. > interesting! > jakob > > > > > > Quoting Luc van den Abeelen : > > > > > The thing is, and I only noticed this a couple of days ago, that > > this is not a Starsem mission, but purely Arianespace. What is > > behind this shift? > > > > Cheers, > > Luc > > > >> Date: Thu, 20 Oct 2011 09:50:44 +0200 > >> From: japio at dds.nl > >> To: fpspace at friends-partners.org > >> Subject: [FPSPACE] new russian first > >> > >> > >> When everything will go okay Russia will have a first today. > >> From Kourou French Guyana will be launched for the first time a > >> Russian build Soyuz rocket model CT with Gallileo satellite on board > >> so this will be a first for Roskosmos and Starsem > >> > >> > >> new > >> > >> Jakob Terweij > >> j van Lennepstraat 249C > >> 1053 JD Amsterdam > >> +31651549606 > >> > >> _______________________________________________ > >> FPSPACE mailing list > >> FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org > >> http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace > > > > > > > > > Jakob Terweij > j van Lennepstraat 249C > 1053 JD Amsterdam > +31651549606 > > _______________________________________________ > FPSPACE mailing list > FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org > http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From agzak at optonline.net Thu Oct 20 05:49:10 2011 From: agzak at optonline.net (Anatoly Zak) Date: Thu, 20 Oct 2011 05:49:10 -0400 Subject: [FPSPACE] new russian first In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Geographically, the Soyuz pad is in Sinnamary, but by all other accounts, (historical and technical) it is an extension of the Guiana space center, which is, of course, in Kourou. It is similar to the situation of the Statue of Liberty, which is inseparable from the history of New York and tourists are often surprised, that it is (geographically and administratively) in New Jersey. Anatoly Zak http://www.russianspaceweb.com On 10/20/11 5:21 AM, "Nicolas PILLET" wrote: > And please note that th e launch pad is not at all in Kourou. It is in the > territory of a city called Sinnamary, which is pretty far away from Kourou... > >> > Date: Thu, 20 Oct 2011 10:32:42 +0200 >> > From: japio at dds.nl >> > To: lucspace at hotmail.com >> > CC: fpspace at friends-partners.org >> > Subject: Re: [FPSPACE] new russian first >> > >> > >> > The launch is at 14.24 hrs MSK(is that local time?) and on the site of >> > roscosmos.ru is a direct feed where you can watch the launch. >> > And Luc about your comment i also dont understand so if Gallileo is >> > launched on a soyuz in Baikonur it is a Starsem launch, now it is the >> > same but in Kourou and suddenly it is Arianespace. >> > interesting! >> > jakob >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > Quoting Luc van den Abeelen : >> > >>> > > >>> > > The thing is, and I only noticed this a couple of days ago, that >>> > > this is not a Starsem mission, but purely Arianespace. What is >>> > > behind this shift? >>> > > >>> > > Cheers, >>> > > Luc >>> > > >>>> > >> Date: Thu, 20 Oct 2011 09:50:44 +0200 >>>> > >> From: japio at dds.nl >>>> > >> To: fpspace at friends-partners.org >>>> > >> Subject: [FPSPACE] new russian first >>>> > >> >>>> > >> >>>> > >> When everything will go okay Russia will have a first today. >>>> > >> From Kourou French Guyana will be launched for the first time a >>>> > >> Russian build Soyuz rocket model CT with Gallileo satellite on board >>>> > >> so this will be a first for Roskosmos and Starsem >>>> > >> >>>> > >> >>>> > >> new >>>> > >> >>>> > >> Jakob Terweij >>>> > >> j van Lennepstraat 249C >>>> > >> 1053 JD Amsterdam >>>> > >> +31651549606 >>>> > >> >>>> > >> _______________________________________________ >>>> > >> FPSPACE mailing list >>>> > >> FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org >>>> > >> http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace >>> > > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > Jakob Terweij >> > j van Lennepstraat 249C >> > 1053 JD Amsterdam >> > +31651549606 >> > >> > _______________________________________________ >> > FPSPACE mailing list >> > FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org >> > http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace > > > > _______________________________________________ > FPSPACE mailing list > FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org > http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From odibusman at gmail.com Thu Oct 20 06:41:14 2011 From: odibusman at gmail.com (Odi Busman) Date: Thu, 20 Oct 2011 12:41:14 +0200 Subject: [FPSPACE] new russian first In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Dear Friends Latest news is that the Galileo launch for today is postponed for 24hrs. Greetings Odi 2011/10/20 Anatoly Zak > Geographically, the Soyuz pad is in Sinnamary, but by all other accounts, > (historical and technical) it is an extension of the Guiana space center, > which is, of course, in Kourou. It is similar to the situation of the Statue > of Liberty, which is inseparable from the history of New York and tourists > are often surprised, that it is (geographically and administratively) in New > Jersey. > > Anatoly Zak > http://www.russianspaceweb.com > > > > On 10/20/11 5:21 AM, "Nicolas PILLET" wrote: > > And please note that th e launch pad is not at all in Kourou. It is in the > territory of a city called Sinnamary, which is pretty far away from > Kourou... > > > Date: Thu, 20 Oct 2011 10:32:42 +0200 > > From: japio at dds.nl > > To: lucspace at hotmail.com > > CC: fpspace at friends-partners.org > > Subject: Re: [FPSPACE] new russian first > > > > > > The launch is at 14.24 hrs MSK(is that local time?) and on the site of > > roscosmos.ru is a direct feed where you can watch the launch. > > And Luc about your comment i also dont understand so if Gallileo is > > launched on a soyuz in Baikonur it is a Starsem launch, now it is the > > same but in Kourou and suddenly it is Arianespace. > > interesting! > > jakob > > > > > > > > > > > > Quoting Luc van den Abeelen : > > > > > > > > The thing is, and I only noticed this a couple of days ago, that > > > this is not a Starsem mission, but purely Arianespace. What is > > > behind this shift? > > > > > > Cheers, > > > Luc > > > > > >> Date: Thu, 20 Oct 2011 09:50:44 +0200 > > >> From: japio at dds.nl > > >> To: fpspace at friends-partners.org > > >> Subject: [FPSPACE] new russian first > > >> > > >> > > >> When everything will go okay Russia will have a first today. > > >> From Kourou French Guyana will be launched for the first time a > > >> Russian build Soyuz rocket model CT with Gallileo satellite on board > > >> so this will be a first for Roskosmos and Starsem > > >> > > >> > > >> new > > >> > > >> Jakob Terweij > > >> j van Lennepstraat 249C > > >> 1053 JD Amsterdam > > >> +31651549606 > > >> > > >> _______________________________________________ > > >> FPSPACE mailing list > > >> FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org > > >> http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Jakob Terweij > > j van Lennepstraat 249C > > 1053 JD Amsterdam > > +31651549606 > > > > _______________________________________________ > > FPSPACE mailing list > > FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org > > http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace > > > ------------------------------ > _______________________________________________ > FPSPACE mailing list > FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org > http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace > > > _______________________________________________ > FPSPACE mailing list > FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org > http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace > > -- Studio Odi Busman Jacob van Lennepkade 257-3 1054 ZT Amsterdam +31 (0)6 10 35 44 24 www.odibusman.com www.google.com -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From cpgorski at gmail.com Thu Oct 20 11:00:40 2011 From: cpgorski at gmail.com (Christopher Gorski) Date: Thu, 20 Oct 2011 11:00:40 -0400 Subject: [FPSPACE] new russian first In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Is this the booster that they want to see succeed before they'll launch another manned Soyuz? Or does this have a different upper stage, and there's another launch coming up this month from Baikonur? Anybody know the cause of the delay? --me On Thu, Oct 20, 2011 at 6:41 AM, Odi Busman wrote: > Dear Friends > > Latest news is that the Galileo launch for today is postponed for 24hrs. > > Greetings > Odi > > 2011/10/20 Anatoly Zak > >> Geographically, the Soyuz pad is in Sinnamary, but by all other >> accounts, (historical and technical) it is an extension of the Guiana space >> center, which is, of course, in Kourou. It is similar to the situation of >> the Statue of Liberty, which is inseparable from the history of New York and >> tourists are often surprised, that it is (geographically and >> administratively) in New Jersey. >> >> Anatoly Zak >> http://www.russianspaceweb.com >> >> >> >> On 10/20/11 5:21 AM, "Nicolas PILLET" wrote: >> >> And please note that th e launch pad is not at all in Kourou. It is in the >> territory of a city called Sinnamary, which is pretty far away from >> Kourou... >> >> > Date: Thu, 20 Oct 2011 10:32:42 +0200 >> > From: japio at dds.nl >> > To: lucspace at hotmail.com >> > CC: fpspace at friends-partners.org >> > Subject: Re: [FPSPACE] new russian first >> > >> > >> > The launch is at 14.24 hrs MSK(is that local time?) and on the site of >> > roscosmos.ru is a direct feed where you can watch the launch. >> > And Luc about your comment i also dont understand so if Gallileo is >> > launched on a soyuz in Baikonur it is a Starsem launch, now it is the >> > same but in Kourou and suddenly it is Arianespace. >> > interesting! >> > jakob >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > Quoting Luc van den Abeelen : >> > >> > > >> > > The thing is, and I only noticed this a couple of days ago, that >> > > this is not a Starsem mission, but purely Arianespace. What is >> > > behind this shift? >> > > >> > > Cheers, >> > > Luc >> > > >> > >> Date: Thu, 20 Oct 2011 09:50:44 +0200 >> > >> From: japio at dds.nl >> > >> To: fpspace at friends-partners.org >> > >> Subject: [FPSPACE] new russian first >> > >> >> > >> >> > >> When everything will go okay Russia will have a first today. >> > >> From Kourou French Guyana will be launched for the first time a >> > >> Russian build Soyuz rocket model CT with Gallileo satellite on board >> > >> so this will be a first for Roskosmos and Starsem >> > >> >> > >> >> > >> new >> > >> >> > >> Jakob Terweij >> > >> j van Lennepstraat 249C >> > >> 1053 JD Amsterdam >> > >> +31651549606 >> > >> >> > >> _______________________________________________ >> > >> FPSPACE mailing list >> > >> FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org >> > >> http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace >> > > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > Jakob Terweij >> > j van Lennepstraat 249C >> > 1053 JD Amsterdam >> > +31651549606 >> > >> > _______________________________________________ >> > FPSPACE mailing list >> > FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org >> > http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace >> >> >> ------------------------------ >> _______________________________________________ >> FPSPACE mailing list >> FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org >> http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> FPSPACE mailing list >> FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org >> http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace >> >> > > > -- > Studio Odi Busman > Jacob van Lennepkade 257-3 > 1054 ZT Amsterdam > +31 (0)6 10 35 44 24 > www.odibusman.com > www.google.com > > > > _______________________________________________ > FPSPACE mailing list > FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org > http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From nikolai39 at hotmail.fr Thu Oct 20 11:04:30 2011 From: nikolai39 at hotmail.fr (Nicolas PILLET) Date: Thu, 20 Oct 2011 17:04:30 +0200 Subject: [FPSPACE] new russian first In-Reply-To: References: , , , Message-ID: This launcher has a different third stage, which uses RD-0124 engine instead of older RD-0110 (the one that failed). From: cpgorski at gmail.com Date: Thu, 20 Oct 2011 11:00:40 -0400 To: odibusman at gmail.com CC: fpspace at friends-partners.org Subject: Re: [FPSPACE] new russian first Is this the booster that they want to see succeed before they'll launch another manned Soyuz? Or does this have a different upper stage, and there's another launch coming up this month from Baikonur? Anybody know the cause of the delay? --me On Thu, Oct 20, 2011 at 6:41 AM, Odi Busman wrote: Dear Friends Latest news is that the Galileo launch for today is postponed for 24hrs. GreetingsOdi 2011/10/20 Anatoly Zak Geographically, the Soyuz pad is in Sinnamary, but by all other accounts, (historical and technical) it is an extension of the Guiana space center, which is, of course, in Kourou. It is similar to the situation of the Statue of Liberty, which is inseparable from the history of New York and tourists are often surprised, that it is (geographically and administratively) in New Jersey. Anatoly Zak http://www.russianspaceweb.com On 10/20/11 5:21 AM, "Nicolas PILLET" wrote: And please note that th e launch pad is not at all in Kourou. It is in the territory of a city called Sinnamary, which is pretty far away from Kourou... > Date: Thu, 20 Oct 2011 10:32:42 +0200 > From: japio at dds.nl > To: lucspace at hotmail.com > CC: fpspace at friends-partners.org > Subject: Re: [FPSPACE] new russian first > > > The launch is at 14.24 hrs MSK(is that local time?) and on the site of > roscosmos.ru is a direct feed where you can watch the launch. > And Luc about your comment i also dont understand so if Gallileo is > launched on a soyuz in Baikonur it is a Starsem launch, now it is the > same but in Kourou and suddenly it is Arianespace. > interesting! > jakob > > > > > > Quoting Luc van den Abeelen : > > > > > The thing is, and I only noticed this a couple of days ago, that > > this is not a Starsem mission, but purely Arianespace. What is > > behind this shift? > > > > Cheers, > > Luc > > > >> Date: Thu, 20 Oct 2011 09:50:44 +0200 > >> From: japio at dds.nl > >> To: fpspace at friends-partners.org > >> Subject: [FPSPACE] new russian first > >> > >> > >> When everything will go okay Russia will have a first today. > >> From Kourou French Guyana will be launched for the first time a > >> Russian build Soyuz rocket model CT with Gallileo satellite on board > >> so this will be a first for Roskosmos and Starsem > >> > >> > >> new > >> > >> Jakob Terweij > >> j van Lennepstraat 249C > >> 1053 JD Amsterdam > >> +31651549606 > >> > >> _______________________________________________ > >> FPSPACE mailing list > >> FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org > >> http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace > > > > > > > > > Jakob Terweij > j van Lennepstraat 249C > 1053 JD Amsterdam > +31651549606 > > _______________________________________________ > FPSPACE mailing list > FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org > http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace _______________________________________________ FPSPACE mailing list FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace _______________________________________________ FPSPACE mailing list FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace -- Studio Odi Busman Jacob van Lennepkade 257-31054 ZT Amsterdam +31 (0)6 10 35 44 24 www.odibusman.com www.google.com _______________________________________________ FPSPACE mailing list FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace _______________________________________________ FPSPACE mailing list FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From agzak at optonline.net Thu Oct 20 11:21:09 2011 From: agzak at optonline.net (Anatoly Zak) Date: Thu, 20 Oct 2011 11:21:09 -0400 Subject: [FPSPACE] new russian first In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On the cause of the delay: http://www.russianspaceweb.com/galileo.html Anatoly Zak On 10/20/11 11:00 AM, "Christopher Gorski" wrote: > Is this the booster that they want to see succeed before they'll launch > another manned Soyuz?? Or does this have a different upper stage, and there's > another launch coming up this month from Baikonur? > > Anybody know the cause of the delay? > > --me > > > > On Thu, Oct 20, 2011 at 6:41 AM, Odi Busman wrote: >> Dear Friends >> >> Latest news is that the Galileo launch for today is postponed for 24hrs. >> >> Greetings >> Odi >> >> 2011/10/20 Anatoly Zak >>> Geographically, the Soyuz pad is in Sinnamary, but by all other accounts, >>> (historical and technical) it is an extension of the Guiana space center, >>> which is, of course, in Kourou. It is similar to the situation of the Statue >>> of Liberty, which is inseparable from the history of New York and tourists >>> are often surprised, that it is (geographically and administratively) in New >>> Jersey. ? >>> >>> Anatoly Zak >>> http://www.russianspaceweb.com >>> >>> >>> >>> On 10/20/11 5:21 AM, "Nicolas PILLET" wrote: >>> >>>> And please note that th e launch pad is not at all in Kourou. It is in the >>>> territory of a city called Sinnamary, which is pretty far away from >>>> Kourou... >>>> >>>>> > Date: Thu, 20 Oct 2011 10:32:42 +0200 >>>>> > From: japio at dds.nl >>>>> > To: lucspace at hotmail.com >>>>> > CC: fpspace at friends-partners.org >>>>> > Subject: Re: [FPSPACE] new russian first >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > The launch is at 14.24 hrs MSK(is that local time?) and on the site of ? >>>>> > roscosmos.ru is a direct feed where you can watch >>>>> the launch. >>>>> > And Luc about your comment i also dont understand so if Gallileo is ? >>>>> > launched on a soyuz in Baikonur it is a Starsem launch, now it is the ? >>>>> > same but in Kourou and suddenly it is Arianespace. >>>>> > interesting! >>>>> > jakob >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > Quoting Luc van den Abeelen : >>>>> > >>>>>> > > >>>>>> > > The thing is, and I only noticed this a couple of days ago, that ?? >>>>>> > > this is not a Starsem mission, but purely Arianespace. What is ?? >>>>>> > > behind this shift? >>>>>> > > >>>>>> > > Cheers, >>>>>> > > Luc >>>>>> > > >>>>>>> > >> Date: Thu, 20 Oct 2011 09:50:44 +0200 >>>>>>> > >> From: japio at dds.nl >>>>>>> > >> To: fpspace at friends-partners.org >>>>>>> > >> Subject: [FPSPACE] new russian first >>>>>>> > >> >>>>>>> > >> >>>>>>> > >> When everything will go okay Russia will have a first today. >>>>>>> > >> ?From Kourou French Guyana will be launched for the first time a >>>>>>> > >> Russian build Soyuz rocket model CT with Gallileo satellite on >>>>>>> board >>>>>>> > >> so this will be a first for Roskosmos and Starsem >>>>>>> > >> >>>>>>> > >> >>>>>>> > >> new >>>>>>> > >> >>>>>>> > >> Jakob Terweij >>>>>>> > >> j van Lennepstraat 249C >>>>>>> > >> 1053 JD Amsterdam >>>>>>> > >> +31651549606 >>>>>>> > >> >>>>>>> > >> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>> > >> FPSPACE mailing list >>>>>>> > >> FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org >>>>>>> > >> http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace >>>>>> > > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > Jakob Terweij >>>>> > j van Lennepstraat 249C >>>>> > 1053 JD Amsterdam >>>>> > +31651549606 >>>>> > >>>>> > _______________________________________________ >>>>> > FPSPACE mailing list >>>>> > FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org >>>>> > http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace >>>> ??????? >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> FPSPACE mailing list >>>> FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org >>>> http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> FPSPACE mailing list >>>> FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org >>>> http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace >>>> >>>> >>>> -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From jameseoberg at comcast.net Fri Oct 21 00:53:44 2011 From: jameseoberg at comcast.net (James E Oberg) Date: Thu, 20 Oct 2011 23:53:44 -0500 Subject: [FPSPACE] Plesetsk history -- 1918-9 American troops in battle near there Message-ID: <807E4C36BE6E41A0886C7CE32BE07F1C@ownerfbf08f40c> I'd sure like to visit Plesetsk some day, and even lay flowers at the nearby American graves.... Yesterday in Pravda, a good historical overview of the Allied interventionists who battled Bolsheviks in the area that became the Plesetsk cosmodrome [and also see the spirited reader comments] -- here ??????????? ????? ?????????? ? ???? 19.10.2011 // ?????? ???????? http://www.pravda.ru/society/fashion/models/19-10-2011/1095811-pleseck-0/ I added this comment: ??? ????? ?????? ????? ? ?????????? ? ???? ????????: This is the best book in English about this campaign: http://www.amazon.com/Ignorant-Armies-M-Halliday/dp/0553284568/ref=cm_cr_pr_product_top -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From kgottschalk at uwc.ac.za Fri Oct 21 07:18:41 2011 From: kgottschalk at uwc.ac.za (Keith Gottschalk) Date: Fri, 21 Oct 2011 13:18:41 +0200 Subject: [FPSPACE] Cape Town 62nd International Astronautical Congress References: <4E984677020000A600013D93@uwc.ac.za> <4E984D7A020000A600013DAE@uwc.ac.za> <4E98514D020000A600013DBF@uwc.ac.za> <4E9C24BE020000A600013ED5@uwc.ac.za> <4EA15964020000A6000142D3@uwc.ac.za> <4EA1674F020000A6000142F1@uwc.ac.za> <4EA16B4E020000A6000142F5@uwc.ac.za> <4EA17131020000A6000142FF@uwc.ac.za> Message-ID: <4EA17131020000A6000142FF@uwc.ac.za> For Friends who have not the time nor inclination to read through all of this, I give it headings so you can scroll down to the section of interest to you. 62nd INTERNATIONAL ASTRONAUTICAL CONGRESS RLVs & NEW HEAVY LIFT LAUNCHERS AFRICA - LATE ENTRANTS INTO SPACE 62nd INTERNATIONAL ASTRONAUTICAL CONGRESS We South Africans can be proud of this smooth-running 62nd IAC, the first to be held in Africa. Catering was much more convenient & budget-priced than in the previous IACs in Korea or Prague. We had umpteen kiosks scattered along each of the three floors of the Convention Centre. All told, we had 2 900 delegates. They had a great time on the tourism side: none were mugged, refuting the sensationalist western media. So Cape Town will enjoy good word of mouth recommendations. As a South African, I was pleased to see more black persons than ever before, including 500 delegates from across Africa, from Tunisia to Nigeria, Kenya, & my own country. The IAF were able to sponsor 32 individuals from 27 developing countries, mostly in Africa. It is also a sign of the 21st century that even when the number of "accompanying persons" plunged from 500 to 217 when a E 50 fee was introduced, the number of women participants was still noticeably higher than at Korea or Prague. Many of C4.2 on Hypersonic & Combined Cycle Propulsion, for example, were women PhD & MSc students presenting their work on scramjets at China's National University of Defence Technology. The Women in Aerospace club launched its African chapter. All told, we had 391 students & 260 young professionals. One third of delegates were under 35 yrs old, to balance the white-haired veterans like myself. Other statistics of the organizers are that 30 000 cups of coffee were drunk (we have the vouchers to prove that). The exhibition was so small that it only filled Hall 4 of the four exhibition halls that form an integral part of Cape Town's International Convention Centre. But I do not think that we South Africans should be too hard on ourselves for that. This is the second worst depression in world history for space budgets. An agency or corporation would rather cut exhibition costs than retrench personnel. South Africa is a long haul destination, making transport costs worse for flying crates round the globe. NASA had initially offered us a fullscale model of the James Web IR telescope, but in the end could not get the transport budget. Instead the NASA stand [provided free popcorn. You can't get more American than that. & we got an Apollo 17 moonrock to touch. Also, in an internet age, agencies & corporations are less inclined to set up stands with physical models & brochures than in earlier decades. The Chinese space agency did not come, nor did its head grace the heads of agency meeting. ISRO sent not its director, but a substitute, & downsized its exhibition stall to a small counter with a man handing out brochures in front of two desktop brass (not aluminium!) models of their PSLV & GSLV. The South African Dept. of Trade & Industry fortunately sponsored through its Aerospace Industry Support Initiative a complex of stalls for the small South African aerospace corporate sector. Our Dept. of S&T also sponsored a stall, & indirectly also the Square Kilometer Array which South Africans are rooting for. The IAC has grown to a complex of four back-to-back & overlapping conference,s crammed into eight days, by means of running up to nineteen technical sessions simultaneously. One consequence of this is that it can today only be accommodated in international convention centres run on business lines, where everything is priced at corporate levels, for those on private sector remuneration, where the employer often pays. So time & again the IAC organizers are compelled to calculate, in a reality where everything is priced in so many $s per square metre per day, if there will be enough full fee delegates at that specific event to justify it being split off another session or event. Just like airline accountants looking at the business class versus cattle class ratios. Since a proportion of IAC delegates will be pensioners like myself, or students, that means revenue per sq. metre may veto nice-to-have events or sessions. One such casualty is that it would be truly enjoyable to have a sponsored artists or cultural zone, like the current student zone. This would enable painters of the International Association of Astronomical Artists to exhibit their planetscapes & spacescapes, & others to stage performance art, since almost none of them are on corporate level remuneration. That is over to future IAF excos to debate for subsidy per sq. metre. The only way I can think of a future IAC being less burdened by financial overheads is that of course university campuses can accommodate three thousand delegates attending twenty simultaneous lectures. While universities regard conferences as third-stream income, they can charge much less than international convention centres for both conferences & modest accommodation. But this would require IAC to give up the symbolism of meeting during world space week - Sputnik & IGY! - & instead convene during either June-July, or Dec-Jan, which is when the universities of both north & south have their vacations. RLVs & NEW HEAVY LIFT LAUNCHERS Session D2.4 Future Space Transportation Systems. Session C4.5 Hypersonic & Combined Cycle Propulsion. FPSPACE recently carried many expressions of regret about the de facto cancellation of the RUS-M launcher. Simultaneously, IAC sessions on heavy-lift and future launchers showed many no-shows or withdrawn papers. Of the papers given on heavy-lift launchers, their slides consisted of paintings drawn by computers, nothing that actually is built, save for the photo of the horizontal static testing of a 5-segment SRB derivative. Roger Launius (well-known to most of those reading this) gave a witty & well-researched paper on five failed decades of spaceplanes. He hilariously noted how all these RLV schemes "depended on being built of Unobtainium & required the suspension of three laws of physics". There was one honourable exception to the above two paragraphs. Mark Hempsell's paper: Progress on the Skylon & SABRE Development Programme. Reaction Engines has decided to build Skylon of not unobtainium, but a TiSiC matrix, to avoid the difficulties of binding carbon composites to Ti. Also, instead of waiting for the appropriate legislature to repeal three laws of physics, R.E. showed actual photos of actual light-weight heat exchangers built for the pre-cooling & deep cooling of air, to inject O2 into their rocket engine. R.E.'s main sponsors, the ESA, required R.E. to demonstrate that they could move from a lab to a prototype factory assembly line for mass production of the tens of thousands of 1 mm. diameter pipes in their lightweight HEXes, showing their consistency of quality control. (Sounds a bit like John Harrison having to prove to the Board of Longitude that his chronometers could be mass produced). He said they hoped to advance to a flying testbed by 2016, and would do 400 test flights of Skylon. Four hundred test flights sounds a lot to lay people. But of course, the first Skylon test flight might be merely accelerating & braking on the runway, to validate the steering & braking capabilities of its undercarriage. Its second testflight might be merely a few low circlings of the airfield, to validate its aerodynamic handling qualities, including bank and turn, at very low speeds. And who of us dare forget the sobering conclusions of the Commission of Enquiry into the Columbia tragedy: that even after 107 flights, every STS flight must still continue to be regarded as experimental, never routine. 400 test flights will certainly be what actuaries like to hear before underwriting insurance for Skylon cargo. AFRICA - LATE ENTRANTS INTO SPACE Budgetary realities mean that no one can expect to see Saturn 5 class rockets lifting off weekly from Africa during the rest of our lifetimes. What we are seeing is an exponential growth of Africa as a a consumer of space goods & services. Satellite operation centres, tens of millions of VSATs for sat TV, the growth of mobile phone banking, GPS services, are now part of the daily plumbing of life for our continent. Discovery Channel viewers need to remind themselves that about half of Africans are now urbanized, even if that is often in giant shanty towns. In some African countries such as South Africa, the proportion of the population suffering from obesity is today higher than the proportion suffering from malnutrition. The next step up the ladder from consumer of space services to production partners in a value chain has been taken by Algeria, Nigeria, & South Africa. All three now have national space agencies, & are now building their own microsats. The first two of those countries had a score or two of satellite engineers & technicians trained in France & the UK respectively; South Africa indigenously at Stellenbosch University (about 45 minutes driving east of my own University of the Western Cape). Also, across the road from my campus, lies the Cape Peninsula University of Technology, making cubesats or palmsats with French aid. A South African amateur launched South Africa's first liquid propulsion two stage rocket in 1959, pressure-fed; ablative. South Africa, and the other African countries, have yet to build their first regeneratively-cooled liquid propulsion engines, using the cryogenic propellants essential for high performance. At least one of them is going to take this step during this decade. See www dot marcom-as dot com We should realistically however, anticipate space budgets remaining flat until the current international depression lifts. Judging by 1929-34, that could still take another two or three yrs. At session on multi-lingual terminology, we announced the near-completion of Astronautical dictionaries in Afrikaans and Xhosa, two of the official languages in South Africa. I should mention that Afrikaans published a dictionary of Astronomical terms about two decades ago. In countries where multilingual policy is highly politicised, such symbolism can be key in winning the support of political decision-makers. For example, a decade ago, that South Africa's first microsat, Sunspace, broadcast a recording to all radio amateurs in Afrikaans thrilled the highest officers of Stellenbosch University, in whose Electronics lab it was built. Today the languages of our next microsat might be Xhosa & English, but its symbolic impact would be the same on those who decide the budgets. Africa's most significant achievements so far in multi-lateral space cooperation are: 1) the African Resources Management Constellation, an MoU for image & data sharing amongst Algeria, Kenya, Nigeria, & South Africa; 2) RASCOM, a continental parastatal with 45 state-owned national utilities buying & operating a comsat in GSO. We can expect both of these endeavours to grow, & new ones be founded. Should any Italians & Chinese be reading this, all the best for the next two IACs scheduled for Naples & Beijing. Even if I cannot get funding to attend, I shall be cheering you along. with warm regards, Keith. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- All Email originating from UWC is covered by disclaimer http://www.uwc.ac.za/emaildisclaimer From ljk4 at msn.com Fri Oct 21 07:54:14 2011 From: ljk4 at msn.com (LARRY KLAES ) Date: Fri, 21 Oct 2011 11:54:14 +0000 Subject: [FPSPACE] Fwd: [vsnet-chat 7737] Yuri Sergeevich Efimov (died 21.10.2011) Message-ID: ---------- Sent from AT&T Wireless using Windows Live Hotmail -----Original Message----- From: Ivan Andronov Sent: 10/21/2011 11:09:49 AM To: vsnet-chat at ooruri.kusastro.kyoto-u.ac.jp Subject: [vsnet-chat 7737] Yuri Sergeevich Efimov (died 21.10.2011) On October 21, 2011, died Yuri Sergeevich Efimov - a leading researcher, a great scientist, poet, a true Russian intellectual and remarkable person. His diploma was based on observations using the "Shain camera" at the Cat Mountain, Crimea. After graduating from the Sternberg Astronomical Institute of the Moscow State University, he began his work in the Crimean Astrophysical Observatory in 1958. More than half a century he successfully worked in the Laboratory of Physics of Stars and Galaxies, starting as a lab assistant to a leading researcher. Yuri Sergeevich was one of those who stood at the origins of polarimetry in astrophysics. The State Prize in the team of collaborators in the field of science and technology in 2010 was a legitimate award. In the ADS, the list of his works (Efimov, Yu.) contains 269 articles. They were devoted to magnetic and non-magnetic cataclysmic variables, Mira-type stars, active galactic nuclei and other leading directions. With many talents, Yuri was a center of cultural life of the Departments and of the Observatory, his beautiful poems decorated many cultural events and were published in a book and in press. Tragic death stopped his activity. The project of a spectropolarimeter orphaned; extensive archives of Nikolai Mikhailovich Shakhovskoj (1931-2011) remained untreated; Yuri Sergeevich will not see the printed version of the "Selected Works of Academician G.A. Shain", which he initiated. All who knew Yuri Sergeevich Efimov, who was infinitely devoted to our science and the observatory, will always keep on him a good and blessed memory. (translated from Russian) Leisurely is flight of Time All days and nights so much alike, The Time gives us a strong invoice For every moment and the choice. We always are in debt to Time. And my credit was spent, was fine. I can't return this debt, when live, Since Time appointed to me... =================================================== Russian version (based on the info from the Crimean Astrophysical Observatory) http://www.realsky.ru/community/uavso/viewpost/1661 The photo http://uavso.pochta.ru/Yu.S.Efimov(1935-2011).jpg The address for condolences: the scientific secretary of the Crimean Astrophysical Observatory alex-baklanov at mail.ru -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From ljk4 at msn.com Fri Oct 21 10:59:25 2011 From: ljk4 at msn.com (LARRY KLAES ) Date: Fri, 21 Oct 2011 14:59:25 +0000 Subject: [FPSPACE] Fwd: Latest from Cosmic Log Message-ID: ---------- Sent from AT&T Wireless using Windows Live Hotmail -----Original Message----- From: msnbc.com/Newsvine Sent: 10/21/2011 2:40:44 PM To: ljk4 at msn.com Subject: Latest from Cosmic Log Cosmic Log NASA: Pay the Americans now ... or pay the Russians later - Alan Boyle If NASA can't provide as much support for U.S. spaceship-builders as it's hoping for, it'll have to keep paying the Russians $450 million for every year of delay, the space agency's No. ________________________________ If you would like to change your e-mail communication preferences, you may modify your settings here or unsubscribe from all e-mails here. Msnbc.com / Newsvine, One Microsoft Way, Redmond, WA 98052 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From japio at dds.nl Fri Oct 21 14:15:52 2011 From: japio at dds.nl (Jakob Terweij) Date: Fri, 21 Oct 2011 20:15:52 +0200 Subject: [FPSPACE] Fwd: kourou Message-ID: <20111021201552.s0b4vurwyko4kgsg@webmail.dds.nl> -2 hours ago 19.00hrs Moscow time they showed here on the news a beautiful launch of Soyuz CT from Kourou. congratulations for this first flight from Kourou I think I drink know a well earned wodka (they have a lot of that here) jakob j van Lennepstraat 249C 1053 JD Amsterdam +31651549606 ----- Einde doorgestuurd bericht ----- Jakob Terweij j van Lennepstraat 249C 1053 JD Amsterdam +31651549606 From cdomashnev at acm.org Fri Oct 21 15:40:16 2011 From: cdomashnev at acm.org (Constantine A. Domashnev) Date: Fri, 21 Oct 2011 15:40:16 -0400 Subject: [FPSPACE] Fwd: kourou Message-ID: <001901cc9029$4a5009c0$0800a8c0@vosem> > 19.00hrs Moscow time they showed here on the news a beautiful launch of > Soyuz CT from Kourou. CNN.com: Soyuz rocket launched Friday after delay http://www.cnn.com/2011/10/21/world/europe/europe-soyuz-launch/ From drwoods at stny.rr.com Fri Oct 21 17:27:19 2011 From: drwoods at stny.rr.com (David R. Woods) Date: Fri, 21 Oct 2011 17:27:19 -0400 Subject: [FPSPACE] Kourou - more coverage Message-ID: <4EA1E3B7.2030501@stny.rr.com> http://tvroscosmos.ru/frm/kosmostv/vesti/2011/vesti211011.php -------- Original Message -------- Subject: [FPSPACE] Fwd: kourou Date: Fri, 21 Oct 2011 20:15:52 +0200 From: Jakob Terweij To: friends and partners -2 hours ago 19.00hrs Moscow time they showed here on the news a beautiful launch of Soyuz CT from Kourou. congratulations for this first flight from Kourou I think I drink know a well earned wodka (they have a lot of that here) Jakob Terweij j van Lennepstraat 249C 1053 JD Amsterdam +31651549606 From john at satcom.freeserve.co.uk Fri Oct 21 17:59:31 2011 From: john at satcom.freeserve.co.uk (Satcom) Date: Fri, 21 Oct 2011 22:59:31 +0100 Subject: [FPSPACE] ROSAT NOTAM Message-ID: <003201cc903c$b65d3120$6ed6fea9@DELLMASTER> The FAA has now issued a special notice relating to ROSAT.... You can view it here http://satcomuk.yolasite.com/satellites-due-to-re-enter.php John From ljk4 at msn.com Sat Oct 22 03:20:49 2011 From: ljk4 at msn.com (LARRY KLAES) Date: Sat, 22 Oct 2011 03:20:49 -0400 Subject: [FPSPACE] NASA Sets Guidelines to Preserve Apollo Moon Landing Sites Message-ID: NASA Sets Guidelines to Preserve Apollo Moon Landing Sites by Leonard David, SPACE.com?s Space Insider Columnist Date: 21 October 2011 Time: 06:00 AM ET LAS CRUCES, New Mexico ? NASA has begun drafting guidelines to protect the Apollo 11 and Apollo 17 landing sites, listing them as off-limits, and including ground-travel buffers and no-fly zones to avoid spraying rocket exhaust or dust onto aging, but historic, equipment. Robert Kelso, NASA?s director of lunar commercial services at Johnson Space Center in Houston, has taken a hard look at future revisits to the Apollo sites and how to protect U.S. government artifacts on the moon. Kelso has carved out a set of guidelines intended to safeguard the historic and scientific value of more than three dozen "heritage sites" on the lunar surface. Full article here: http://www.space.com/13346-nasa-guidelines-protect-apollo-moon-landing-sites.html -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From kgottschalk at uwc.ac.za Sun Oct 23 08:07:02 2011 From: kgottschalk at uwc.ac.za (Keith Gottschalk) Date: Sun, 23 Oct 2011 14:07:02 +0200 Subject: [FPSPACE] IAC & IPC Sias Mostert Message-ID: <4EA41F86020000A60001441A@uwc.ac.za> Dear Friends, lots of credit for the smooth running of the first International Astronautical Congress held in Africa must go to its International Programme Coordinator, the South African Sias Mostert. Sadly, right during the middle of the IAC, he had a stroke, from which he is slowly recovering in hospital. We can guess that the sheer stress & overwork of the past twelve months triggered off that stroke. Sias professionally was on the satellite engineering side of things. He was working with the Association of African Remote Sensing. - Keith -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- All Email originating from UWC is covered by disclaimer http://www.uwc.ac.za/emaildisclaimer From kgottschalk at uwc.ac.za Sun Oct 23 08:33:56 2011 From: kgottschalk at uwc.ac.za (Keith Gottschalk) Date: Sun, 23 Oct 2011 14:33:56 +0200 Subject: [FPSPACE] reflecting on the transition between ELVs & RLVs Message-ID: <4EA425D4020000A600014420@uwc.ac.za> The topic of RLVs always starts with deep skepticism & cynicism, due to five decades of broken promises & cancelled programmes. As with the Roger Launius paper that I referred to in an earlier posting. Judging by the other papers at relevant International Astronautical Congress sessions, here are a few reflections on what is going on right now. 1. It seems that between ELVs & RLVs, we might be entering a transitional era of PLVs - partially reusable vehicles. Continuing with coining more new acronyms, it seems these PLVs can be divided into two variants: 2. We seem to be going to have what may be called RRVs - reusable reentry vehicles. These typically take the form of a TSTO VTHOL. The STS is the most venerable of these. X-37B is proudly making its second flight as a distant descendant of the cancelled X-20 Dyna-Soar. The wingless Dragon, CST, & Orion, are all an advance on Mercury, Gemini & Apollo in more than size, in that the former three are all designed & built to be reusable. ISRO's proposed TSTO winged RLV is also more accurately called a RRV. 3. Another PLV variant is the fly-back booster - FBB. The STS's salvageable SRBs are a venerable halfway house to this, which has not yet been achieved. SpaceX has announced their intention to add landing legs to their Falcon 9. We all look forward to seeing if they get further than the Douglas Clipper & Kistler.... The combined result of the above engineering approaches could be significant reduction in cost per kg. to LEO, even if not a reduction in costs per flight of one magnitude. We will also see advances in TPS materials manufacturing, compared to the STS TPS, which dates from 1970s technology. - Keith -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- All Email originating from UWC is covered by disclaimer http://www.uwc.ac.za/emaildisclaimer From svengrahn at bahnhof.se Sun Oct 23 08:55:44 2011 From: svengrahn at bahnhof.se (Sven Grahn) Date: Sun, 23 Oct 2011 14:55:44 +0200 Subject: [FPSPACE] IAC & IPC Sias Mostert In-Reply-To: <4EA41F86020000A60001441A@uwc.ac.za> References: <4EA41F86020000A60001441A@uwc.ac.za> Message-ID: <01811AD103634FFA9ABE9322593CFCED@svempadator> Hope he recovers quickly. Met Sias a coiuple of times at the Small satellite Conference in Logon, Utah and at various IACs. Nice person. Sven ----- Original Message ----- From: Keith Gottschalk To: Friends & Partners FPSPACE Sent: Sunday, October 23, 2011 2:07 PM Subject: [FPSPACE] IAC & IPC Sias Mostert Dear Friends, lots of credit for the smooth running of the first International Astronautical Congress held in Africa must go to its International Programme Coordinator, the South African Sias Mostert. Sadly, right during the middle of the IAC, he had a stroke, from which he is slowly recovering in hospital. We can guess that the sheer stress & overwork of the past twelve months triggered off that stroke. Sias professionally was on the satellite engineering side of things. He was working with the Association of African Remote Sensing. - Keith ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ All Email originating from UWC is covered by disclaimer http://www.uwc.ac.za/emaildisclaimer ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ _______________________________________________ FPSPACE mailing list FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From jameseoberg at comcast.net Mon Oct 24 11:15:43 2011 From: jameseoberg at comcast.net (James E Oberg) Date: Mon, 24 Oct 2011 10:15:43 -0500 Subject: [FPSPACE] October 24 space anniversaries.... Message-ID: <6D3E546DE61E4DC59695692540F44D56@ownerfbf08f40c> Several news items today in the Kazakhstan press regarding the memorial events at Baykonur for the 1960 disaster. And there are more items, in the Russian media, about tomorrow's centennial of the birth of Mikhail Yangel. Yandex his name for links. ?? ????????? ?????? ???? ?????? ??????????? ?????????? http://inform.kz/rus/article/2414122 ???? ?????? ???????? ?????????? ???????? ?? ????????? 24 ??????? 2011, 11:26 // http://www.zakon.kz/kazakhstan/4454640-den-pamjati-pogibshikh-raketchikov.html ????, ????? ?? ???????? ?????? 24 ??????? 2011 ?. 10:58 http://blog.fontanka.ru/posts/84268/ http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=aezxBB9vFNs#! -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From pjp961 at svol.net Mon Oct 24 16:19:51 2011 From: pjp961 at svol.net (Peter Pesavento) Date: Mon, 24 Oct 2011 16:19:51 -0400 Subject: [FPSPACE] New Article on NASA dependence on Russia's rockets for transport to the ISS...apparently beyond 2016 Message-ID: <4ea5c87a.09f4640a.6dde.ffffb175@mx.google.com> >From the Orlando Sentinel http://www.orlandosentinel.com/news/space/os-nasa-russia-dependence-20111022 ,0,286459,full.story Also has commentary by our own fpspacer, Charles Vick... NASA may extend Russian contract to fly to space station By Mark K. Matthews, Washington Bureau 9:12 p.m. EDT, October 22, 2011 WASHINGTON - Top NASA officials are quietly working to extend a contract with Moscow that would continue using Russian rockets to fly U.S. astronauts into space until 2016 and beyond - a move that underscores how much the U.S. now relies on its former Cold War adversary. Already, NASA is committed to pay Russia $1.5 billion during the next five years to transport its astronauts to and from the International Space Station, a necessary arrangement because the U.S. no longer flies a human-rated spacecraft since NASA retired the space shuttle last summer. The new contract could extend reliance on Russia even longer while serving as a painful metaphor for the state of NASA in the post-shuttle age. The agency that beat Russia to the moon now is entirely dependent on Roscosmos - and its nearly 50-year-old Soyuz rocket -- to get its people to low Earth orbit. And, ironically, one of the U.S. rockets that could break Moscow's manned-space monopoly relies on engines built by Russia. "It says to me that we're in trouble," said Charles Vick, a Russian space expert with the analyst group GlobalSecurity.org. "They [Russian space officials] are not going to wait for us to catch up. We have to get our act together, or we are going to be out of the game." NASA has brushed off concerns about its reliance on the Russians, saying it's the result of a policy decision to focus on building a new rocket powerful enough to fly astronauts to an asteroid or return to the moon. In fact, though, the agency has failed to build a new human-rated rocket in the 30 years since the shuttle was launched. The Constellation program - the result of President George W. Bush 's 2004 announcement that the agency would return to the moon - was canceled last year after more than $13 billion failed to produce a working rocket and spacecraft. A new program, just announced, is expected to cost $3 billion a year - and won't fly astronauts before 2021. That leaves the United States without the space shuttle - its retirement was ordered to free up money for Constellation - but still needing to get astronauts to the ISS, whose life was extended to 2020. The Russians are the only alternative. Buying from the Russians requires a congressional exemption from national-security laws that ban high-tech commerce with Russia. NASA first obtained a waiver in 2008 - after fierce debate - and has begun efforts to extend it past its mid-2016 expiration. Leading the charge is Bill Gerstenmaier, director of NASA's human-spaceflight division. Earlier this month, he told lawmakers that a waiver would be needed no matter what - even if NASA were successful in its plan to hire U.S. commercial-rocket companies to ferry astronauts to the space station by 2016. "We think an exception to the [security law] is needed even if we don't need to purchase Soyuz seats," Gerstenmaier said. "For basic operations of the ISS, we purchase certain services - minor - but from the Russians, and we need an exception for that to continue operations of ISS." Afterward, Gerstenmaier defined those "minor" services as "engineering services, sustaining engineering analysis, power margins - typical standard integration and engineering services." Meantime, NASA is pushing commercial-rocket companies to handle transportation to the space station. Two companies, SpaceX of California and Orbital Sciences of Virginia, have contracts to ferry cargo to the station through 2016. Both plan to begin flights by next year. SpaceX would get $1.6 billion for 12 flights, and Orbital would get $1.9 billion for eight trips. NASA also has awarded more than $300 million to U.S. companies to develop spacecraft that can taxi astronauts to the station - although it's uncertain when they will be ready. SpaceX, which also received money for crew transport, is aiming for 2014. That date, though, depends on several factors, including the stringency of "human-rating" regulations yet to be finalized by NASA. "With NASA's support, SpaceX will be ready to have our first manned flight in 2014," said SpaceX spokeswoman Kirstin Brost Grantham. The other major player, Boeing , has targeted 2015 - with a caveat. Boeing aims to build its own capsule to fly aboard an existing rocket, the Atlas V. But company officials have said it could meet that deadline only if it received a large chunk of the $850 million a year that the White House has requested during the next five years for commercial spaceflight. That funding level, however, appears unlikely. Budgets proposed by the House and Senate for 2012 allot a maximum of $500 million for the program. And given the tightfisted attitude on Capitol Hill nowadays, that amount is unlikely to increase. A Boeing spokeswoman would not speculate how that would affect the timeline. Even if Boeing is successful, however, it still leaves the U.S. dependent on the Russians. The Atlas V rocket, built by Lockheed Martin and a workhorse for NASA and the Pentagon, uses the Russian RD-180 engine. Top military officials have pushed Lockheed Martin and Pratt & Whitney Rocketdyne - a subcontractor that essentially acts as broker for the engines - to develop a U.S. alternative, but industry has said that would cost hundreds of millions. "That's one of the things we continue to talk about is co-production. It's the thing we need to go do, but . there has to be funding to do that," said Bill Parsons, president and CEO of RD AMROSS, a joint venture between Pratt & Whitney Rocketdyne and NPO Energomash, the Russian manufacturer. The Russian rocket industry is not without kinks. A Soyuz carrying cargo to the station failed in August, briefly raising the possibility of a long-term grounding. But the problem was attributed to fuel-line contamination, and two flights - one for cargo, one for crew - are planned this fall. And Russia's role in space is growing. In 2010, the Russians led the world with 31 launches of satellites - more than twice the 15 the U.S. put into orbit, according to a report published by the Space Foundation. And Friday, Russia blasted its Soyuz rocket from a new pad in French Guiana, the first time it has done so outside the old Iron Curtain. It's yet another reason that Vick, of GlobalSecurity.org, is shaking his head. "We have to have a real reconsideration of space policy," he said. "We are not a world power anymore." -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From jameseoberg at comcast.net Tue Oct 25 16:39:17 2011 From: jameseoberg at comcast.net (James E Oberg) Date: Tue, 25 Oct 2011 15:39:17 -0500 Subject: [FPSPACE] new TASS graphic on Fobos-Grunt Message-ID: here: http://www.itar-tass.com/data/Graphics/LargePhoto/1300.JPEG -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From ljk4 at msn.com Wed Oct 26 09:43:20 2011 From: ljk4 at msn.com (LARRY KLAES ) Date: Wed, 26 Oct 2011 13:43:20 +0000 Subject: [FPSPACE] Fwd: GSFC: STEREO Mission Celebrates 5 Years of Science Message-ID: ---------- Sent from AT&T Wireless using Windows Live Hotmail -----Original Message----- From: AAS Press Officer Dr. Rick Fienberg Sent: 10/25/2011 9:26:36 PM To: Rick Fienberg Subject: GSFC: STEREO Mission Celebrates 5 Years of Science THE FOLLOWING RELEASE WAS RECEIVED FROM NASA'S GODDARD SPACE FLIGHT CENTER IN GREENBELT, MARYLAND, AND IS FORWARDED FOR YOUR INFORMATION. (FORWARDING DOES NOT IMPLY ENDORSEMENT BY THE AMERICAN ASTRONOMICAL SOCIETY.) Rick Fienberg, AAS Press Officer: rick.fienberg at aas.org, +1 202-328-2010 x116. October 25, 2011 Contact: Susan Hendrix +1 301-286-7745 susan.m.hendrix at nasa.gov Text, images, and video: http://www.nasa.gov/mission_pages/stereo/news/five-years.html STEREO MISSION CELEBRATES FIVE INCREDIBLE YEARS OF SCIENCE On October 25, 2006, a Delta II rocket launched from Cape Canaveral carrying two nearly identical spacecraft. Each satellite was one half of a mission entitled Solar TErrestrial RElations Observatory (STEREO) and they were destined to do something never done before -- see the entire Sun simultaneously. The Sun rotates, of course, so there's no part of the Sun we haven't at some point observed from our vantage point on Earth. But watching this massive, highly active star from only a single line of sight has its limitations. For one, we never know what's about to come over the horizon: a clear, relatively quiet surface or a cluster of active areas ready to send billions of tons of energy and radiation toward Earth? It's also not easy to gauge the speed, size, or other characteristics of incoming solar activity when only viewing it head on. "Over the last five years, each STEREO spacecraft has moved to a position in its orbit where it can capture side-view images of anything the Sun sends our way," says Joe Gurman, STEREO's project scientist at NASA's Goddard Space Flight Center in Greenbelt, Md. "That's helped us come up with many new answers to old questions about solar activity." Such solar activity usually comes in the form of bursts of radiation called solar flares or eruptions of solar material and magnetic fields called coronal mass ejections (CMEs). Scientists want to know more about this activity since it can affect our own magnetic environment, interfering with communications and Global Positioning System satellites among other things. To get its unique view of flares and CMES, the two STEREO spacecraft were launched into a clever orbit scheme. One, STEREO-A, flies in an orbit around the Sun that is somewhat smaller and therefore faster than that of Earth. STEREO-B's orbit is somewhat larger and slower. Over time the difference in the speeds of the orbits have naturally caused STEREO A to move ahead of Earth in its path, and STEREO-B to fall behind. As of February 6, 2011, the two spacecraft reached almost exact opposite sides of the Sun. "The most important part of this configuration," says Therese Kucera, STEREO's deputy project scientist at Goddard, "is not only does STEREO track CMEs visually from the Sun to Earth, but that information can be combined with data from several other spacecraft sitting right in the line of the solar activity." Coordinating such in situ observations with an outside perspective opened the door to some of the first movies tracking CMEs and less well-known phenomena such as "co-rotating interaction regions" within the solar wind all the way from the Sun's surface to Earth's environs. STEREO also showed us that bursts of solar energetic particles -- of interest because just one particle can knock out computer components in a satellite or harm the DNA of a human in space -- were much broader than previously thought, extending widely enough that both of STEREO's spacecraft could sense them passing by. Another crucial aspect of this unique 360-degree view of the Sun is that we can now observe CMEs heading in any direction in space. Such space weather can affect any of NASA's spacecraft, so those who handle flight operations appreciate advance warning before a burst of solar particles pass by their sensitive electronics systems. STEREO's wide view also helped comet watchers as it recorded the tail of Comet Encke get ripped off by a solar eruption in April of 2007. And STEREO's images of Comet McNaught -- one of the brightest comets in 40 years -- helped show that the tail contained iron. In the coming months, the two satellites will keep moving further away from Earth, lining up on the far side of the Sun in 2015 and continuing on their journey until they are once again on Earth's side. During the trip, scientists will use STEREO observations to calibrate their techniques to monitor what's happening on the far side of the Sun by tracking the sound waves that roll through the Sun's interior -- a technique called helioseismology. "STEREO was designed to understand what causes CMEs and how they travel, as well as to understand the structure of the solar wind. It's already made great strides in doing that," says Gurman. "I'm looking forward to the next five years." # # # STEREO mission site: http://www.nasa.gov/stereo Heliophysics website: http://www.nasa.gov/sunearth ------------------------------------------------------------------------ If you do not wish to receive press releases that are forwarded to the news media by the American Astronomical Society, please unsubscribe by replying accordingly to any incoming press release, or send e-mail to rick.fienberg at aas.org. Requests for referrals to experts on astronomy and space science should be sent to the same address. Rick Fienberg, AAS Press Officer, +1 202-328-2010 x116, @AAS_Press (Twitter). -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From pjp961 at svol.net Thu Oct 27 18:26:39 2011 From: pjp961 at svol.net (Peter Pesavento) Date: Thu, 27 Oct 2011 18:26:39 -0400 Subject: [FPSPACE] News reports that Chinese military hackers successfully interfered with Landsat 7 and Terra EOS AM-1 Message-ID: <4ea9dab4.4aaaec0a.7b3d.2be4@mx.google.com> Agency France Presse via Raw Story http://www.rawstory.com/rs/2011/10/27/china-suspect-in-u-s-satellite-interfe rence-report/ Major excerpt: China Suspect in US Satellite Interference: US Report. By Agency France-Presse Thursday, October 27, 2011 WASHINGTON-NASA satellites were interfered with four separate times in 2007 and 2008, possibly by the Chinese military, according to a draft of an upcoming report for the US Congress. The latest draft of the report by the US-China Economic and Security Review Commissions said the computer hackers behind the interference gained the ability to issue commands to one of the satellites on two occasions. The targeted satellites are used for observation of earth's climate and terrain, according to the report to be submitted to Congress on November 16. A copy of the latest draft of the report was obtained by AFP on Thursday. It said the account of the interference with the satellites came from a May 2011 briefing for the Commission by the US Air Force. The hackers appear to have exploited the information systems of the Svalbard Satellite Station (SvalSat), a commercially operated satellite ground station in Spitsbergen, Norway, to gain access to the satellites, the report said. SvalSat relies on the Internet for data access and file transfers, it said, citing a recent NASA report. On October 20, 2007, Landsat-7, a US earth observation satellite jointly managed by NASA and the US Geological Survey, experienced 12 or more minutes of interference, the report said. Landsat-7 experienced another 12 or more minutes of interference on July 23, 2008, the report said. It said that on June 20, 2008, Terra EOS AM-1, a NASA-managed program for earth observant, experienced two or more minutes of interference, it said. It said the hackers behind the interference with Terra EOS AM-1 "achieved all steps required to command the satellite but did not issue commands." On October 22, 2008, Terra EOS AM-1 experienced nine or more minutes of interference, the report said, and "the responsible party" again "achieved all steps required to command the satellite but did not issue commands." "Such interference poses numerous potential threats, particularly if achieved against satellites with more sensitive functions," the report said. "The attacker could also deny or degrade as well as forge or otherwise manipulate the satellite's transmission," it said. "A high level of access could reveal the satellite's capabilities or information, such as imagery, gained through its sensors." The report stressed that it was not recounting the incidents "on the basis of specific attribution information" but rather "because the techniques appear consistent with authoritative Chinese military writings." -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From jameseoberg at comcast.net Thu Oct 27 18:34:21 2011 From: jameseoberg at comcast.net (James E Oberg) Date: Thu, 27 Oct 2011 17:34:21 -0500 Subject: [FPSPACE] News reports that Chinese military hackers successfullyinterfered with Landsat 7 and Terra EOS AM-1 References: <4ea9dab4.4aaaec0a.7b3d.2be4@mx.google.com> Message-ID: Good find, Peter -- here's another version of the story: Chinese hackers may have attacked U.S. satellites Jaikumar Vijayan 27.10.2011 kl 18:23 | Computerworld (US) http://news.idg.no/cw/art.cfm?id=C2E8CB09-1A64-67EA-E4B5BA48C574869A Suspected Chinese hackers interfered with two U.S. satellites on four separate occasions in 2007 and 2008, according to a Bloomberg Businessweek story that cites an upcoiming report by a congressional commission. ----- Original Message ----- From: Peter Pesavento To: fpspace at friends-partners.org Sent: Thursday, October 27, 2011 5:26 PM Subject: [FPSPACE] News reports that Chinese military hackers successfullyinterfered with Landsat 7 and Terra EOS AM-1 Agency France Presse via Raw Story http://www.rawstory.com/rs/2011/10/27/china-suspect-in-u-s-satellite-interference-report/ Major excerpt: China Suspect in US Satellite Interference: US Report. By Agency France-Presse Thursday, October 27, 2011 WASHINGTON-NASA satellites were interfered with four separate times in 2007 and 2008, possibly by the Chinese military, according to a draft of an upcoming report for the US Congress. The latest draft of the report by the US-China Economic and Security Review Commissions said the computer hackers behind the interference gained the ability to issue commands to one of the satellites on two occasions. The targeted satellites are used for observation of earth's climate and terrain, according to the report to be submitted to Congress on November 16. A copy of the latest draft of the report was obtained by AFP on Thursday. It said the account of the interference with the satellites came from a May 2011 briefing for the Commission by the US Air Force. The hackers appear to have exploited the information systems of the Svalbard Satellite Station (SvalSat), a commercially operated satellite ground station in Spitsbergen, Norway, to gain access to the satellites, the report said. SvalSat relies on the Internet for data access and file transfers, it said, citing a recent NASA report. On October 20, 2007, Landsat-7, a US earth observation satellite jointly managed by NASA and the US Geological Survey, experienced 12 or more minutes of interference, the report said. Landsat-7 experienced another 12 or more minutes of interference on July 23, 2008, the report said. It said that on June 20, 2008, Terra EOS AM-1, a NASA-managed program for earth observant, experienced two or more minutes of interference, it said. It said the hackers behind the interference with Terra EOS AM-1 "achieved all steps required to command the satellite but did not issue commands." On October 22, 2008, Terra EOS AM-1 experienced nine or more minutes of interference, the report said, and "the responsible party" again "achieved all steps required to command the satellite but did not issue commands." "Such interference poses numerous potential threats, particularly if achieved against satellites with more sensitive functions," the report said. "The attacker could also deny or degrade as well as forge or otherwise manipulate the satellite's transmission," it said. "A high level of access could reveal the satellite's capabilities or information, such as imagery, gained through its sensors." The report stressed that it was not recounting the incidents "on the basis of specific attribution information" but rather "because the techniques appear consistent with authoritative Chinese military writings." ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ _______________________________________________ FPSPACE mailing list FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From ljk4 at msn.com Fri Oct 28 00:05:39 2011 From: ljk4 at msn.com (LARRY KLAES) Date: Fri, 28 Oct 2011 00:05:39 -0400 Subject: [FPSPACE] Did the Soviets have the Vostok/Soyuz design back in 1949? Message-ID: Look at the illustrations in this book and you tell me: http://dreamsofspace.blogspot.com/2011/09/this-one-i-do-not-have-title-for.html -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From jameseoberg at comcast.net Fri Oct 28 00:22:25 2011 From: jameseoberg at comcast.net (James E Oberg) Date: Thu, 27 Oct 2011 23:22:25 -0500 Subject: [FPSPACE] Mars-96 Impact Location -- Any Russian official source EVER admitted it was Andes Mountains? Message-ID: <84C3EF7BD6C04CA7BA0888C74D0A56A2@ownerfbf08f40c> For a story I'm doing pre-Fobos-Grunt on the 'Ghosts of Mars Probes Past', regarding the controversy over where Mars-96 actually landed [see http://www.jamesoberg.com/plutonium.html], has anyone ever seen any Russian space official admit it might have landed in the Andes Mountains and NOT in the deep Pacific? Or do all official websites still state that it did fall safely into the ocean? thanks! -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From pao.ulivi at gmail.com Fri Oct 28 01:35:49 2011 From: pao.ulivi at gmail.com (Paolo Ulivi) Date: Fri, 28 Oct 2011 07:35:49 +0200 Subject: [FPSPACE] Mars-96 Impact Location -- Any Russian official source EVER admitted it was Andes Mountains? In-Reply-To: <84C3EF7BD6C04CA7BA0888C74D0A56A2@ownerfbf08f40c> References: <84C3EF7BD6C04CA7BA0888C74D0A56A2@ownerfbf08f40c> Message-ID: it was reported in Flight International that wreckage had been found in a salt plateau in Bolivia http://www.flightglobal.com/pdfarchive/view/1997/1997%20-%200188.html?search=oyuni On Fri, Oct 28, 2011 at 6:22 AM, James E Oberg wrote: > For a story I'm doing pre-Fobos-Grunt on the 'Ghosts of Mars Probes Past', > regarding the controversy over where Mars-96 actually landed > [see http://www.jamesoberg.com/plutonium.html], > > has anyone ever seen any Russian?space official admit it might have landed > in the Andes Mountains and NOT in the deep Pacific? Or do all official > websites > still state that it did fall safely into the ocean? > > thanks! > > > _______________________________________________ > FPSPACE mailing list > FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org > http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace > > From kgottschalk at uwc.ac.za Fri Oct 28 05:25:21 2011 From: kgottschalk at uwc.ac.za (Keith Gottschalk) Date: Fri, 28 Oct 2011 11:25:21 +0200 Subject: [FPSPACE] South African space programme planning Message-ID: <4EAA9121020000A6000149D4@uwc.ac.za> Dear Friends, Business Day (Johannesburg) 28 October 2011 ran an article today. PLANNING A TWO DECADE PROGRAMME The South African National Space Agency (SANSA) is setting up a 40-strong committee to plan a national space programme until 2030, in effect an eighteen year programme. In my experience getting 40 professionals together for a meeting is so impossible that its work will surely have to be largely done in sub-committees, with only one or two plenary meetings at the start & end. Phil Mjwara, Director-General of the Dept of S&T, mentioned three possibilities: - another South Africa micro-satellite; - another research satellite in cooperation with Brazil & India; - a 3rd satellite for the African Resource Management Constellation. The mothballed Overberg Test Range (built under apartheid under total military censorship to launch South African-build copies of Israeli Shavits) has not been transferred to SANSA, but remains operated by Denel, an armament parastatal. It can launch satellites into equatorial, polar, or SSO orbits The news report quoted Sandile Malinga, CEO of SANSA, as noting that the people who used to operate it are now close to retirement, some already retired. BUDGETS The SANSA starts with a budget of ZAR 93 million under the Dept. of S&T. This budget must include its existing facilities & personnel, such as the Space Weather Centre (formerly Hermanus Magnetic Observatory), the Satellite Applications Centre, & the ISSA (formerly Houwteq). The Govt. has also bought up a majority shareholding in March in Sunspace, the microsat company that was spun-off Stellenbosch University's Electronics Lab, but couldn't make it commercially. It faced fierce competition from South Korea and elsewhere for satellite sub-systems that it marketed. At the recent IAC, I was very surprised when the Nigerian representatives of their National Space Development & Research Agency, NASDRA, showed off slides of their buildings & facilities & their two recently launched micro-sats, but became incredibly evasive when I asked them how much was their budget. They said that this varied, and was more when they had a satellite up & less when they had no satellite. I responded "of course, but please tell us what is your budget for the most recent 12 month period for which you have figures?" They flatly refused to reveal any budget, & just repeated that it varied. Weird? What on earth have they to hide? The Official Opposition spokeswoman on S&T, Marian Shinn of the Democratic Alliance, has become increasingly critical & opposed to building microsats, on the grounds that they break down, & should rather buy imagery from foreign satellites. While the DA is most unlikely to become a government before 2019 or 2024, it does mean that the earlier all-party support for SA's space programme is now over forever. Yesterday Gordhan Pravin, South Africa's Finance Minister (who is also a member of the Communist Party & a qualified pharmacist) presented the supplementary budget appropriation. He gave both Parliament, & also the caucus of the ruling party, a stern talking-to about avoiding extravagance, opposing corruption, & the need for austere budgets. I am sure that the current international depression will taker another two or three years to lift, so South Africa's space budget will not increase much until after that. - Keith -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- All Email originating from UWC is covered by disclaimer http://www.uwc.ac.za/emaildisclaimer From thomsona at flash.net Fri Oct 28 08:40:28 2011 From: thomsona at flash.net (Allen Thomson) Date: Fri, 28 Oct 2011 05:40:28 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [FPSPACE] Did the Soviets have the Vostok/Soyuz design back in 1949? Message-ID: <1319805628.93727.YahooMailClassic@web80204.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Only in that they knew about spheres back then. The illustrations are of a much larger interplanetary ship. From ljk4 at msn.com Fri Oct 28 09:11:54 2011 From: ljk4 at msn.com (LARRY KLAES ) Date: Fri, 28 Oct 2011 13:11:54 +0000 Subject: [FPSPACE] Fwd: [Launch Alert] Delta II Launched Message-ID: ---------- Sent from AT&T Wireless using Windows Live Hotmail -----Original Message----- From: Launch Alert Sent: 10/28/2011 12:09:27 PM To: launch-alert at mailman.qth.net Subject: [Launch Alert] Delta II Launched TEAM VANDENBERG LAUNCHES DELTA II ROCKET VANDENBERG AIR FORCE BASE, Calif. - Team Vandenberg launched a Delta II rocket carrying NASA's NPOESS Preparatory Project (NPP) satellite from Space Launch Complex-2W here at 2:48 a.m. PDT today. Col. Richard Boltz, 30th Space Wing commander, was the launch decision authority. "Public safety is always our first priority, and Team Vandenberg did a phenomenal job ensuring a safe launch for this critical NASA mission," said Colonel Boltz. NPP, an Earth-observing satellite, represents a critical first step in building the next-generation of U.S. polar-orbiting climate and weather monitoring spacecraft. NPP is the bridge between NASA's Earth Observing System (EOS) satellites and the forthcoming series of Joint Polar Satellite System (JPSS) satellites. The mission will test key technologies and instruments for the JPSS missions. See www.nasa.gov/NPP for updates on post-launch NPP mission status. Today's launch is the last scheduled for 2011 from Vandenberg as well as the last for Colonel Boltz serving as 30th Space Wing commander. "It's been a tremendous honor serving alongside the men and women who make Team Vandenberg the best launch team in the world," said Colonel Boltz, whose change of command ceremony is scheduled for January 2012. Col. Nina Armagno, currently serving as Director of Staff, Headquarters, Air Force Space Command, Peterson AFB, Colo., has been named as the incoming 30th Space Wing commander. ______________________________________________________________ Launch-Alert mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/launch-alert Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Launch-Alert at mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From ljk4 at msn.com Fri Oct 28 09:20:21 2011 From: ljk4 at msn.com (LARRY KLAES ) Date: Fri, 28 Oct 2011 13:20:21 +0000 Subject: [FPSPACE] Did the Soviets have the Vostok/Soyuz design back in 1949? Message-ID: I know, but I was struck by the similarities regardless of the dimensional differences. I also wonder if any of the Soviet rocket makers were influenced by this work? Or were they actually consultants on this book? Note it came out at the same time as von Braun, Ley, and Bonestell's pivotal work in the West. Larry ---------- Sent from AT&T Wireless using Windows Live Hotmail -----Original Message----- From: Allen Thomson Sent: 10/28/2011 12:40:28 PM To: fpspace , LARRY KLAES Subject: Re: [FPSPACE] Did the Soviets have the Vostok/Soyuz design back in 1949? Only in that they knew about spheres back then. The illustrations are of a much larger interplanetary ship. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From jameseoberg at comcast.net Fri Oct 28 09:48:44 2011 From: jameseoberg at comcast.net (James E Oberg) Date: Fri, 28 Oct 2011 08:48:44 -0500 Subject: [FPSPACE] Mars-96 Impact Location --Wreckage found References: <84C3EF7BD6C04CA7BA0888C74D0A56A2@ownerfbf08f40c> Message-ID: Wow, I have no memory of ever seeing this report. I wonder what the source was, and if there was any follow-up -- such as photographs of the recovered debris. Caution is required -- even as the recent UARS fall reminds us, most junk attributed to 'space wreckage' turns out to have entirely prosaic origin. How do we pursue this very cold trail? Any contacts at 'Flight' that we can ask? ----- Original Message ----- From: "Paolo Ulivi" Cc: Sent: Friday, October 28, 2011 12:35 AM Subject: Re: [FPSPACE] Mars-96 Impact Location -- Any Russian official source EVER admitted it was Andes Mountains? it was reported in Flight International that wreckage had been found in a salt plateau in Bolivia http://www.flightglobal.com/pdfarchive/view/1997/1997%20-%200188.html?search=oyuni On Fri, Oct 28, 2011 at 6:22 AM, James E Oberg wrote: > For a story I'm doing pre-Fobos-Grunt on the 'Ghosts of Mars Probes Past', > regarding the controversy over where Mars-96 actually landed > [see http://www.jamesoberg.com/plutonium.html], > > has anyone ever seen any Russian space official admit it might have landed > in the Andes Mountains and NOT in the deep Pacific? Or do all official > websites > still state that it did fall safely into the ocean? > > thanks! > > > _______________________________________________ > FPSPACE mailing list > FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org > http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace > > _______________________________________________ FPSPACE mailing list FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace From kgottschalk at uwc.ac.za Fri Oct 28 09:58:48 2011 From: kgottschalk at uwc.ac.za (Keith Gottschalk) Date: Fri, 28 Oct 2011 15:58:48 +0200 Subject: [FPSPACE] Mars-96 Impact Location --Wreckage found In-Reply-To: References: <84C3EF7BD6C04CA7BA0888C74D0A56A2@ownerfbf08f40c> Message-ID: <4EAAD138020000A600014AEC@uwc.ac.za> Bolivia is not the Antarctic or Devon Island. Even its deserts are cris-crossed by lithium prospectors. For those with such resources, satellite imagery could be trawled through to speed up searching. Or aerial-flown geiger counters might pick up a spike. Good luck to researchers. - Keith >>> On 2011/10/28 at 03:48 PM, in message , "James E Oberg" wrote: Wow, I have no memory of ever seeing this report. I wonder what the source was, and if there was any follow-up -- such as photographs of the recovered debris. Caution is required -- even as the recent UARS fall reminds us, most junk attributed to 'space wreckage' turns out to have entirely prosaic origin. How do we pursue this very cold trail? Any contacts at 'Flight' that we can ask? ----- Original Message ----- From: "Paolo Ulivi" Cc: Sent: Friday, October 28, 2011 12:35 AM Subject: Re: [FPSPACE] Mars-96 Impact Location -- Any Russian official source EVER admitted it was Andes Mountains? it was reported in Flight International that wreckage had been found in a salt plateau in Bolivia http://www.flightglobal.com/pdfarchive/view/1997/1997%20-%200188.html?search=oyuni On Fri, Oct 28, 2011 at 6:22 AM, James E Oberg wrote: > For a story I'm doing pre-Fobos-Grunt on the 'Ghosts of Mars Probes Past', > regarding the controversy over where Mars-96 actually landed > [see http://www.jamesoberg.com/plutonium.html], > > has anyone ever seen any Russian space official admit it might have landed > in the Andes Mountains and NOT in the deep Pacific? Or do all official > websites > still state that it did fall safely into the ocean? > > thanks! > > > _______________________________________________ > FPSPACE mailing list > FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org > http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace > > _______________________________________________ FPSPACE mailing list FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace _______________________________________________ FPSPACE mailing list FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- All Email originating from UWC is covered by disclaimer http://www.uwc.ac.za/emaildisclaimer From agzak at optonline.net Fri Oct 28 10:07:13 2011 From: agzak at optonline.net (Anatoly Zak) Date: Fri, 28 Oct 2011 10:07:13 -0400 Subject: [FPSPACE] Did the Soviets have the Vostok/Soyuz design back in 1949? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Shapes of reentry vehicles are based on requirements to provide stability and thermal conditions during the descent. It is technically impossible to fashion an atmospheric vehicle from a body of a sci-fi starship. Vostok?s descent module was made into a sphere, because it promised the easiest way to perform ballistic reentry. Many other shapes were studied and rejected in the process, as described in Feoktistov?s memoirs. http://www.russianspaceweb.com/spacecraft_manned_first.html That said, Shternfeld? book was very popular, I remember these images since I was a kid. However depictions of the spacecraft made of spheres was rather typical for the period. I have many in my archive, for example: http://www.russianspaceweb.com/tsiolkovsky_kaluga.html Anatoly Zak On 10/28/11 9:20 AM, "LARRY KLAES" wrote: > I know, but I was struck by the similarities regardless of the dimensional > differences. I also wonder if any of the Soviet rocket makers were influenced > by this work? Or were they actually consultants on this book? Note it came > out at the same time as von Braun, Ley, and Bonestell's pivotal work in the > West. Larry ---------- Sent from AT Wireless using Windows Live Hotmail > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Allen Thomson > Sent: 10/28/2011 12:40:28 PM > To: fpspace , LARRY KLAES > Subject: Re: [FPSPACE] Did the Soviets have the Vostok/Soyuz design back in > 1949? > > > Only in that they knew about spheres back then. The illustrations are of a > much larger interplanetary ship. > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > FPSPACE mailing list > FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org > http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From ljk4 at msn.com Fri Oct 28 11:12:11 2011 From: ljk4 at msn.com (LARRY KLAES ) Date: Fri, 28 Oct 2011 15:12:11 +0000 Subject: [FPSPACE] Did the Soviets have the Vostok/Soyuz design back in 1949? Message-ID: The early Mercury designs included spherical shapes. Thanks to the V-2 and its makers the West long thought of a typical spaceship as a silvery needle with wings. Thank you for the information. L arry ---------- Sent from AT&T Wireless using Windows Live Hotmail -----Original Message----- From: Anatoly Zak Sent: 10/28/2011 2:07:13 PM To: Untitled Subject: Re: [FPSPACE] Did the Soviets have the Vostok/Soyuz design back in 1949? Shapes of reentry vehicles are based on requirements to provide stability and thermal conditions during the descent. It is technically impossible to fashion an atmospheric vehicle from a body of a sci-fi starship. Vostok's descent module was made into a sphere, because it promised the easiest way to perform ballistic reentry. Many other shapes were studied and rejected in the process, as described in Feoktistov's memoirs. http://www.russianspaceweb.com/spacecraft_manned_first.html That said, Shternfeld' book was very popular, I remember these images since I was a kid. However depictions of the spacecraft made of spheres was rather typical for the period. I have many in my archive, for example: http://www.russianspaceweb.com/tsiolkovsky_kaluga.html Anatoly Zak On 10/28/11 9:20 AM, "LARRY KLAES" wrote: I know, but I was struck by the similarities regardless of the dimensional differences. I also wonder if any of the Soviet rocket makers were influenced by this work? Or were they actually consultants on this book? Note it came out at the same time as von Braun, Ley, and Bonestell's pivotal work in the West. Larry ---------- Sent from AT Wireless using Windows Live Hotmail -----Original Message----- From: Allen Thomson Sent: 10/28/2011 12:40:28 PM To: fpspace , LARRY KLAES Subject: Re: [FPSPACE] Did the Soviets have the Vostok/Soyuz design back in 1949? Only in that they knew about spheres back then. The illustrations are of a much larger interplanetary ship. ________________________________ _______________________________________________ FPSPACE mailing list FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From jameseoberg at comcast.net Fri Oct 28 11:41:59 2011 From: jameseoberg at comcast.net (James E Oberg) Date: Fri, 28 Oct 2011 10:41:59 -0500 Subject: [FPSPACE] Mars-96 Impact Location -- Any Russian official source EVER admitted it was Andes Mountains? References: <84C3EF7BD6C04CA7BA0888C74D0A56A2@ownerfbf08f40c> Message-ID: <593F7F56B8D44368BB313569E9E763D9@ownerfbf08f40c> For those who can't get to the link, here is full citation: SPACEFLIGHT NEWS IN BRIEF * MARS FIND Wreckage of Russia's failed Mars '96 probe has been found south of the Oyuni salt plateau in Bolivia, 100km (55nm) from Chile and at an altitude of 12,000ft (3,650m). The spacecraft plunged from low Earth orbit on 17 November, 1996, after the fourth stage of its Proton launcher failed to restart. The fourth stage re-entered over the Pacific a day later. FLIGHT INTERNATIONAL, 22-28 January 1997 P. 22 ----- Original Message ----- From: "Paolo Ulivi" Cc: Sent: Friday, October 28, 2011 12:35 AM Subject: Re: [FPSPACE] Mars-96 Impact Location -- Any Russian official source EVER admitted it was Andes Mountains? it was reported in Flight International that wreckage had been found in a salt plateau in Bolivia http://www.flightglobal.com/pdfarchive/view/1997/1997%20-%200188.html?search=oyuni On Fri, Oct 28, 2011 at 6:22 AM, James E Oberg wrote: > For a story I'm doing pre-Fobos-Grunt on the 'Ghosts of Mars Probes Past', > regarding the controversy over where Mars-96 actually landed > [see http://www.jamesoberg.com/plutonium.html], > > has anyone ever seen any Russian space official admit it might have landed > in the Andes Mountains and NOT in the deep Pacific? Or do all official > websites > still state that it did fall safely into the ocean? > > thanks! > > > _______________________________________________ > FPSPACE mailing list > FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org > http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace > > _______________________________________________ FPSPACE mailing list FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace From geertsassen at gmail.com Fri Oct 28 12:04:36 2011 From: geertsassen at gmail.com (Geert Sassen) Date: Fri, 28 Oct 2011 18:04:36 +0200 Subject: [FPSPACE] Mars-96 Impact Location --Wreckage found In-Reply-To: References: <84C3EF7BD6C04CA7BA0888C74D0A56A2@ownerfbf08f40c> Message-ID: Purely from memory of those days, I seem to remember we even discussed this report on FPSpace, but quite apart from that one news-report nothing ever turned up, no follow-up reports and no pictures of debris or anything. I seem to remember the actual spacecraft was never tracked by NORAD as it re-entered almost immediately, all that was tracked was its Block-D stage, which re-entered a day later. Without any actual tracking-data I wonder how much value we have to give to the reported re-entry over the Andes, and from what I remember we reached the same conclusion in those days..Without any trackingships on station, there was no telemetry received from either Block-D or the spacecraft, so it never became exactly clear what had happened and whether or not the Block-D ignited and how long it burned, and whether or not the spacecraft (fregat stage) fully completed its burn after separation from Block-D, which makes it almost impossible to predict where it ended up.. Regards, Geert. On Fri, Oct 28, 2011 at 3:48 PM, James E Oberg wrote: > Wow, I have no memory of ever seeing this report. I wonder > what the source was, and if there was any follow-up -- such as > photographs of the recovered debris. > > Caution is required -- even as the recent UARS fall reminds us, most > junk attributed to 'space wreckage' turns out to have entirely prosaic > origin. > > How do we pursue this very cold trail? Any contacts at 'Flight' that we > can ask? > > > > ----- Original Message ----- From: "Paolo Ulivi" > Cc: > Sent: Friday, October 28, 2011 12:35 AM > Subject: Re: [FPSPACE] Mars-96 Impact Location -- Any Russian official > source EVER admitted it was Andes Mountains? > > > it was reported in Flight International that wreckage had been found > in a salt plateau in Bolivia > http://www.flightglobal.com/pdfarchive/view/1997/1997%20-%200188.html?search=oyuni > > On Fri, Oct 28, 2011 at 6:22 AM, James E Oberg > wrote: >> >> For a story I'm doing pre-Fobos-Grunt on the 'Ghosts of Mars Probes Past', >> regarding the controversy over where Mars-96 actually landed >> [see http://www.jamesoberg.com/plutonium.html], >> >> has anyone ever seen any Russian space official admit it might have landed >> in the Andes Mountains and NOT in the deep Pacific? Or do all official >> websites >> still state that it did fall safely into the ocean? >> >> thanks! >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> FPSPACE mailing list >> FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org >> http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace >> >> > _______________________________________________ > FPSPACE mailing list > FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org > http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace > > _______________________________________________ > FPSPACE mailing list > FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org > http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace > -- Geert Sassen http://www.facebook.com/geert.sassen From jeoberg at comcast.net Fri Oct 28 12:44:01 2011 From: jeoberg at comcast.net (James E Oberg) Date: Fri, 28 Oct 2011 11:44:01 -0500 Subject: [FPSPACE] Mars-96 Impact Location --Wreckage found References: <84C3EF7BD6C04CA7BA0888C74D0A56A2@ownerfbf08f40c> Message-ID: Thanks, Geert. I've sent off some emails to the tourist industry in the area, maybe we'll get a follow-up. Without skin-track radar, the tracking of the entry was based on three factors, as I recall. 1. Multiple ground witness accounts of a fireball crossing the coast from west to east. I have recently re-contacted some of the witnesses. 2. Analysis of the probe's orbit assuming NO second DM burn but THEN followed by the canned probe's OWN propulsion system burn that threw it into a more elliptical orbit. We know that burn occurred because the probe THEN opened its solar panels and this report was received in Russia via one telemetry pass [Lou Friedman report from MCC]. 3. IR tracking by US DoD satellite assets provided a corridor of entry that extended from the Pacific to well into Bolivia. That report was released by NORAD at 5 PM on the Friday after Thanksgiving, with the clear [to my mind, at least] hope it would be overlooked by the news media. And it was. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Geert Sassen" To: "James E Oberg" Cc: Sent: Friday, October 28, 2011 11:04 AM Subject: Re: [FPSPACE] Mars-96 Impact Location --Wreckage found > Purely from memory of those days, I seem to remember we even discussed > this report on FPSpace, but quite apart from that one news-report > nothing ever turned up, no follow-up reports and no pictures of debris > or anything. > > I seem to remember the actual spacecraft was never tracked by NORAD as > it re-entered almost immediately, all that was tracked was its Block-D > stage, which re-entered a day later. Without any actual tracking-data > I wonder how much value we have to give to the reported re-entry over > the Andes, and from what I remember we reached the same conclusion in > those days..Without any trackingships on station, there was no > telemetry received from either Block-D or the spacecraft, so it never > became exactly clear what had happened and whether or not the Block-D > ignited and how long it burned, and whether or not the spacecraft > (fregat stage) fully completed its burn after separation from Block-D, > which makes it almost impossible to predict where it ended up.. > > Regards, > > Geert. > > On Fri, Oct 28, 2011 at 3:48 PM, James E Oberg > wrote: >> Wow, I have no memory of ever seeing this report. I wonder >> what the source was, and if there was any follow-up -- such as >> photographs of the recovered debris. >> >> Caution is required -- even as the recent UARS fall reminds us, most >> junk attributed to 'space wreckage' turns out to have entirely prosaic >> origin. >> >> How do we pursue this very cold trail? Any contacts at 'Flight' that we >> can ask? >> >> >> >> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Paolo Ulivi" >> Cc: >> Sent: Friday, October 28, 2011 12:35 AM >> Subject: Re: [FPSPACE] Mars-96 Impact Location -- Any Russian official >> source EVER admitted it was Andes Mountains? >> >> >> it was reported in Flight International that wreckage had been found >> in a salt plateau in Bolivia >> http://www.flightglobal.com/pdfarchive/view/1997/1997%20-%200188.html?search=oyuni >> >> On Fri, Oct 28, 2011 at 6:22 AM, James E Oberg >> wrote: >>> >>> For a story I'm doing pre-Fobos-Grunt on the 'Ghosts of Mars Probes >>> Past', >>> regarding the controversy over where Mars-96 actually landed >>> [see http://www.jamesoberg.com/plutonium.html], >>> >>> has anyone ever seen any Russian space official admit it might have >>> landed >>> in the Andes Mountains and NOT in the deep Pacific? Or do all official >>> websites >>> still state that it did fall safely into the ocean? >>> >>> thanks! >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> FPSPACE mailing list >>> FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org >>> http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace >>> >>> >> _______________________________________________ >> FPSPACE mailing list >> FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org >> http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace >> >> _______________________________________________ >> FPSPACE mailing list >> FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org >> http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace >> > > > > -- > Geert Sassen > http://www.facebook.com/geert.sassen > _______________________________________________ > FPSPACE mailing list > FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org > http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace > From clj at panix.com Fri Oct 28 12:45:25 2011 From: clj at panix.com (Chris Jones) Date: Fri, 28 Oct 2011 12:45:25 -0400 Subject: [FPSPACE] photo essay on Soyuz pad in Korou Message-ID: <20111028124525.4ba263f7@Cloyd> http://englishrussia.com/2011/10/28/service-tower-for-soyuz-st-launch/ is a photo essay (with a time lapse video) of the construction and use of the Soyuz launch pad and service building in Korou, along with pictures of the launcher shipping from Russia. As it mentions, the pad very much resembles the pads in Russia and Kazakstan, with the main difference being a service building which can move into place to protect the erect launcher on the pad (and obviously move out of the way prior to launch). One difference between operations in South America rather than in Europe/Asia (BTW, am I correct in thinking Soyuz is the only satellite launcher to be employed in 3 continents?) is that the launcher is erected on the pad without its payload, which is added there from the service building. From pao.ulivi at gmail.com Fri Oct 28 15:38:19 2011 From: pao.ulivi at gmail.com (Paolo Ulivi) Date: Fri, 28 Oct 2011 21:38:19 +0200 Subject: [FPSPACE] Mars-96 Impact Location --Wreckage found In-Reply-To: References: <84C3EF7BD6C04CA7BA0888C74D0A56A2@ownerfbf08f40c> Message-ID: James you could try contacting Tim Furniss who reported on everything space for Flight Paolo On Fri, Oct 28, 2011 at 3:48 PM, James E Oberg wrote: > Wow, I have no memory of ever seeing this report. I wonder > what the source was, and if there was any follow-up -- such as > photographs of the recovered debris. > > Caution is required -- even as the recent UARS fall reminds us, most > junk attributed to 'space wreckage' turns out to have entirely prosaic > origin. > > How do we pursue this very cold trail? Any contacts at 'Flight' that we > can ask? > > > > ----- Original Message ----- From: "Paolo Ulivi" > Cc: > Sent: Friday, October 28, 2011 12:35 AM > Subject: Re: [FPSPACE] Mars-96 Impact Location -- Any Russian official > source EVER admitted it was Andes Mountains? > > > it was reported in Flight International that wreckage had been found > in a salt plateau in Bolivia > http://www.flightglobal.com/pdfarchive/view/1997/1997%20-%200188.html?search=oyuni > > On Fri, Oct 28, 2011 at 6:22 AM, James E Oberg > wrote: >> >> For a story I'm doing pre-Fobos-Grunt on the 'Ghosts of Mars Probes Past', >> regarding the controversy over where Mars-96 actually landed >> [see http://www.jamesoberg.com/plutonium.html], >> >> has anyone ever seen any Russian space official admit it might have landed >> in the Andes Mountains and NOT in the deep Pacific? Or do all official >> websites >> still state that it did fall safely into the ocean? >> >> thanks! >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> FPSPACE mailing list >> FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org >> http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace >> >> > _______________________________________________ > FPSPACE mailing list > FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org > http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace > > From ljk4 at msn.com Fri Oct 28 19:29:07 2011 From: ljk4 at msn.com (LARRY KLAES ) Date: Fri, 28 Oct 2011 23:29:07 +0000 Subject: [FPSPACE] Fwd: [New post] Whither the Space Shuttle Message-ID: ---------- Sent from AT&T Wireless using Windows Live Hotmail -----Original Message----- From: Roger Launius's Blog Sent: 10/28/2011 8:56:53 PM To: ljk4 at msn.com Subject: [New post] Whither the Space Shuttle New post on Roger Launius's Blog [http://1.gravatar.com/blavatar/5ab615dc2687e96bf21dc4fa4be2f3ff?s=32&ts=1319835413] [http://0.gravatar.com/avatar/488baba4b54ec638fa19eeebd09b6b69?s=50&d=identicon&r=G] Whither the Space Shuttle by launiusr On July 7, 2011, I gave a talk in the "Moving Beyond Earth" exhibition at the Smithsonian Institution's National Air and Space Museum on the history of the Space Shuttle. The audience was the first Student Spaceflight Experiment Program (SSEP) National Conference. This student science symposium allowed student teams from around the United States to share designs and preliminary results for experiments conducted during STS-134, Space Shuttle Endeavour's final mission. The video of this presentation is available here: [http://img.youtube.com/vi/jyVZWv8EUV0/0.jpg]<=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jyVZWv8EUV0> Comments are welcome. launiusr | October 28, 2011 at 8:56 pm | Tags: cold war, Department of Defense, History, NASA, presidential power, public perceptions, public policy, space shuttle, U.S. Civil Space | Categories: History, Personal, Politics, Space Shuttle | URL: http://wp.me/pwYu1-Eg Comment See all comments Unsubscribe or change your email settings at Manage Subscriptions. Trouble clicking? Copy and paste this URL into your browser: http://launiusr.wordpress.com/2011/10/28/whither-the-space-shuttle/ Thanks for flying with [http://s.wordpress.com/i/emails/wp-footericon.png] WordPress.com -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From bhen at telenet.be Sat Oct 29 17:28:03 2011 From: bhen at telenet.be (Bart Hendrickx) Date: Sat, 29 Oct 2011 23:28:03 +0200 Subject: [FPSPACE] Mars-96 Impact Location -- Any Russian official source EVER admitted it was Andes Mountains? In-Reply-To: References: <84C3EF7BD6C04CA7BA0888C74D0A56A2@ownerfbf08f40c> Message-ID: <000001cc9681$a43c3ae0$ecb4b0a0$@be> In April 1999 there were reports about debris having been found in Argentina. See this article in Novosti kosmonavtiki : http://www.novosti-kosmonavtiki.ru/content/numbers/197/36.shtml And for what it?s worth : last year Quest magazine carried an interview with NASA?s Thomas C. Duxbury, who witnessed the Mars-96 launch at Baikonur. He claims that a US team was sent to the Andes to look for debris, or at least that was the plan : ?After I return[ed] to the US, I received a call from a colleague working for an Atomic Energy Commission contractor in Nevada. He wanted to know if I had any idea why his company was putting together a crew to go down to the Chilean Andes. The Russians were sticking to their story that the debris fell safely into the Pacific Ocean, but the US was sending a crew to look for something in the Andes ?. Bart Hendrickx -----Original Message----- From: fpspace-bounces at www.friends-partners.org [mailto:fpspace-bounces at www.friends-partners.org] On Behalf Of Paolo Ulivi Sent: vrijdag 28 oktober 2011 7:36 Cc: fpspace at friends-partners.org Subject: Re: [FPSPACE] Mars-96 Impact Location -- Any Russian official source EVER admitted it was Andes Mountains? it was reported in Flight International that wreckage had been found in a salt plateau in Bolivia http://www.flightglobal.com/pdfarchive/view/1997/1997%20-%200188.html?search =oyuni On Fri, Oct 28, 2011 at 6:22 AM, James E Oberg wrote: > For a story I'm doing pre-Fobos-Grunt on the 'Ghosts of Mars Probes Past', > regarding the controversy over where Mars-96 actually landed > [see http://www.jamesoberg.com/plutonium.html], > > has anyone ever seen any Russian?space official admit it might have landed > in the Andes Mountains and NOT in the deep Pacific? Or do all official > websites > still state that it did fall safely into the ocean? > > thanks! > > > _______________________________________________ > FPSPACE mailing list > FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org > http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace > > _______________________________________________ FPSPACE mailing list FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace ----- No virus found in this message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 10.0.1411 / Virus Database: 2092/3978 - Release Date: 10/27/11 From drwoods at stny.rr.com Sat Oct 29 21:02:57 2011 From: drwoods at stny.rr.com (David R. Woods) Date: Sat, 29 Oct 2011 21:02:57 -0400 Subject: [FPSPACE] FPSpace server problems Message-ID: <4EACA241.90302@stny.rr.com> -------- Original Message -------- Subject: Re: FPSpace server problems Date: Sat, 29 Oct 2011 20:59:08 +0200 From: Greg To: David R. Woods Dave, before I could fix this, I ended up traveling - just got into Cairo yesterday and probably here for two weeks. So .. I doubt I'll have time to find out why our SSL servers are not working (something about certificates) so I just reverted back to old version of configuration files and commented out all references to SSL. Your web stuff should be back up. I'll try to implement a better fix once I get back home. Thanks for your patience with this. Greg -------- Original Message -------- > Subject: Re: FPSpace server problems > Date: Tue, 25 Oct 2011 11:42:48 -0400 > From: Greg > To: David R. Woods > > > > David, I'm sorry for this trouble - I was trying to fix other problems on the > web server last night (trying to get the old F&P server back up) and everything > else broke. I'll try to have all working again by this evening. The nightmare > of this O/S upgrade continues but I think/hope is about over .. Greg > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From drwoods at stny.rr.com Sun Oct 30 17:02:18 2011 From: drwoods at stny.rr.com (David R. Woods) Date: Sun, 30 Oct 2011 17:02:18 -0400 Subject: [FPSPACE] FPSpace server problems Message-ID: <4EADBB5A.5030400@stny.rr.com> -------- Original Message -------- Subject: Re: FPSpace server problems Date: Sun, 30 Oct 2011 15:03:43 +0200 From: Greg Cole To: David R. Woods David, I think/hope fixed everything this morning - please let me know if all ok now .. I will be in meetings the next 9-10 hours but will check email again when get back to hotel this evening .. Greg From clj at panix.com Sun Oct 30 17:41:13 2011 From: clj at panix.com (Chris Jones) Date: Sun, 30 Oct 2011 17:41:13 -0400 Subject: [FPSPACE] NASA commentary on Progress M-13M Message-ID: <20111030174113.2fd1c127@Cloyd> I watched the NASA TV coverage of the Progress M-13M launch (you can see it here http://www.spaceref.com/news/viewsr.rss.spacewire.html?pid=38902). In addition to calling it Progress 45 throughout, the NASA commentator (who I think I will choose to call Dick Navelless) referred to the upcoming escape tower jettison about 2 minutes after launch (when Progress craft don't launch with escape towers). Way to call 'em, Dick. From agzak at optonline.net Sun Oct 30 18:47:38 2011 From: agzak at optonline.net (Anatoly Zak) Date: Sun, 30 Oct 2011 18:47:38 -0400 Subject: [FPSPACE] NASA commentary on Progress M-13M In-Reply-To: <20111030174113.2fd1c127@Cloyd> Message-ID: NASA also "congratulated" Roskosmos with the "success", even though the spacecraft is yet to reach the station: "...this successful flight sets the stage for the next Soyuz launch, planned for mid-November." http://www.nasa.gov/home/hqnews/2011/oct/HQ_11-366_Progress_Launch_Statement .html :) On 10/30/11 5:41 PM, "Chris Jones" wrote: > I watched the NASA TV coverage of the Progress M-13M launch (you can see it > here http://www.spaceref.com/news/viewsr.rss.spacewire.html?pid=38902). In > addition to calling it Progress 45 throughout, the NASA commentator (who I > think I will choose to call Dick Navelless) referred to the upcoming escape > tower jettison about 2 minutes after launch (when Progress craft don't > launch with escape towers). > > Way to call 'em, Dick. > _______________________________________________ > FPSPACE mailing list > FPSPACE at www.friends-partners.org > http://www.friends-partners.org/mailman/listinfo/fpspace From cdomashnev at acm.org Sun Oct 30 20:04:29 2011 From: cdomashnev at acm.org (Constantine A. Domashnev) Date: Sun, 30 Oct 2011 20:04:29 -0400 Subject: [FPSPACE] NASA commentary on Progress M-13M Message-ID: <000801cc9760$a95fe370$0800a8c0@vosem> To the best of my recollection: after the docking hatch rim was wiped, the departing TMA-21 crew radioed from the Soyuz: "??? - ???????". ["Close the hatch."] One could hear on NASA TV the voice-over of an interpreter at the Johnson MCC saying "Hatch is closed" ["??? - ??????"] with the docking hatch still open. Not quite on the money. Not a big deal; just something to be aware of ... -- KD From bharwood at earthlink.net Sun Oct 30 21:02:47 2011 From: bharwood at earthlink.net (William Harwood) Date: Sun, 30 Oct 2011 21:02:47 -0400 Subject: [FPSPACE] NASA commentary on Progress M-13M In-Reply-To: <20111030174113.2fd1c127@Cloyd> References: <20111030174113.2fd1c127@Cloyd> Message-ID: <21F849D4-42B7-4977-A4EC-B981F49285FF@earthlink.net> Hi. I don't normally post comments, but your observations regarding the NASA commentary during the Progress launch this morning struck a nerve. First of all, his name is Rob Navias, and he knows more about the Russian space program than many on this list. Yes, he misspoke when he mentioned the escape tower, but only people who have never done live broadcasting expect perfection. Everyone misspeaks from time to time, and it's certainly no justification for attacking someone on such a personal level. His body of work as a wire service reporter, from the Patty Hearst kidnapping to the Jim Jones/People's Temple tragedy to live coverage of STS-1, STS-51L, STS-26 and dozens of other shuttle flights is above reproach. He is a fanatic about accuracy and after more than 50 trips to Moscow/Kazakhstan over the past decade, he personally knows many of the people involved and makes every effort to "get it right." He has provided informative commentary for multiple Soyuz/Progress launchings and is responsible for getting Russian TV back to the U.S. so you and I can watch these flights. Given the interpretation issues, satellite links, time zones and nationalities involved, it's not a trivial undertaking. No one likes mistakes, but I would argue it's not all that remarkable when one happens during live coverage of a Russian launch event. It's remarkable there aren't many more. As for calling it Progress 45, that's the official terminology at NASA. Attacking the commentator for following the official terminology of his employer is a bit unfair. Even the Russians sign off on NASA documentation using that same terminology! In any case, that one's not the fault of the commentator. That complaint should be addressed to NASA ISS program manager Mike Suffredini or Bill Gerstenmaier, NASA's associate administrator for space operations. Again, I'm not trying to start anything and I'll I won't post anything else on this topic. But as a space reporter with nearly three decades of experience who worked with Navias back in our wire service days, I know the depth of his commitment to providing quality coverage. This was a simple slip of the tongue and the criticism was both unfair and unwarranted. Regards, Bill Harwood Merritt Island, FL From jameseoberg at comcast.net Sun Oct 30 22:45:29 2011 From: jameseoberg at comcast.net (James E Oberg) Date: Sun, 30 Oct 2011 21:45:29 -0500 Subject: [FPSPACE] Russia abolishes 'winter time' Message-ID: <9E45D9A8F80D4286BA9116636AF2F24E@ownerfbf08f40c> Sorry, I just saw this, it may prevent confusion in converting Moscow space event times in the days ahead when other countries are jumping back from 'summer time'. Russia won't, ever again. http://www.timeanddate.com/news/time/russia-winter-time.html -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From ljk4 at msn.com Sun Oct 30 22:57:15 2011 From: ljk4 at msn.com (LARRY KLAES ) Date: Mon, 31 Oct 2011 02:57:15 +0000 Subject: [FPSPACE] Fwd: We remember two distinguished planetary scientists and friends Message-ID: ---------- Sent from AT&T Wireless using Windows Live Hotmail -----Original Message----- From: PSRD Sent: 10/31/2011 2:27:29 AM To: PSRDMAIL at soest.hawaii.edu Subject: We remember two distinguished planetary scientists and friends Announcement from Planetary Science Research Discoveries [PSRD] With sadness we mark the passing of Dr. Michael Drake in September and Dr. Ronald Greeley this month. Please read our tributes. http://www.psrd.hawaii.edu/Archive/PSRDremembers_Mike.Drake.html http://www.psrd.hawaii.edu/Archive/PSRDremembers_Ron.Greeley.html ------- PSRD is an educational web site supported by NASA's SMD Cosmochemistry Program and the Hawaii Space Grant Consortium to share the latest research on meteorites, asteroids, planets, moons, interstellar dust, and other materials in our Solar System. You are subscribed to our free mailing list. We never send attachments. For more information please see http://www.psrd.hawaii.edu/PSRDsubscribe.html ------- Brought to you by Jeff Taylor and Linda Martel, Hawaii Institute of Geophysics and Planetology, University of Hawaii psrd at higp.hawaii.edu voice (808) 956-3899 fax (808) 956-6322 http://www.psrd.hawaii.edu -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From ljk4 at msn.com Sun Oct 30 23:08:06 2011 From: ljk4 at msn.com (LARRY KLAES ) Date: Mon, 31 Oct 2011 03:08:06 +0000 Subject: [FPSPACE] Fwd: [New post] Conspiracy Theories in Aerospace History: A Lesson in Critical Thinking for the Internet Age Message-ID: ---------- Sent from AT&T Wireless using Windows Live Hotmail -----Original Message----- From: Roger Launius's Blog Sent: 10/31/2011 12:02:08 AM To: ljk4 at msn.com Subject: [New post] Conspiracy Theories in Aerospace History: A Lesson in Critical Thinking for the Internet Age New post on Roger Launius's Blog [http://1.gravatar.com/blavatar/5ab615dc2687e96bf21dc4fa4be2f3ff?s=32&ts=1320019328] [http://0.gravatar.com/avatar/488baba4b54ec638fa19eeebd09b6b69?s=50&d=identicon&r=G] Conspiracy Theories in Aerospace History: A Lesson in Critical Thinking for the Internet Age by launiusr [http://launiusr.files.wordpress.com/2011/10/thumbs.jpg?w=600&h=100]Check out the educational webinar that I participated in on Friday, October 28. "Conspiracy Theories in Aerospace History: A Lesson in Critical Thinking for the Internet Age" brought together several curators from the National Air and Space Museum, an educator from???National History Day,???and a naval historian to explore the issue of critical thinking, source evaluation, and reality checking on some of the wildest stories in the histo ry of flight. We reviewed four case studies. 1. The death of Amelia Earhart in 1937 in a plane crash in the Pacific Ocean. 2. The Japanese attack on Pearl Harbor in 1941 and whether or not American officials knew before that an attack was imminent. 3. The Roswell crash in 1947 and the question of UFOs. 4. The denials of the Apollo Moon landings. We asked questions about the nature of these theories, their origins, veracity, and evidence. We especially discussed the role of the Internet as an open source of information of all types and how to assess the legitimacy of an y piece of evidence that might be presented. We had more than 2,000 teachers, students, and others participate in the webinar. Now the entire proceeding it available on-line and available here. Check out the conference archives from this educational webinar: * Thinking Critically About the Apollo Moon Landings * Thinking Critically About Amelia Earhart's Disappearance * Thinking Critically About UFOs * Thinking Critically About the Attack on Pearl Harbor We hope you find this an interesting and useful educational program. Please check it out. launiusr | October 31, 2011 at 12:01 am | Tags: 1960s, Amelia Earhart, Apollo, cold war, Department of Defense, Franklin D. Roosevelt, History, JFK, Moon, Moon race, NASA, presidential power, public perceptions, public policy, Rosell, U.S. Civil Space, UFOs, World War II | Categories: Apollo, aviation, History, Personal, Politics, Space, World War II | URL: http://wp.me/pwYu1-Ep Comment See all comments Unsubscribe or change your email settings at Manage Subscriptions. Trouble clicking? Copy and paste this URL into your browser: http://launiusr.wordpress.com/2011/10/31/conspiracy-theories-in-aerospace-history-a-lesson-in-critical-thinking-for-the-internet-age-2/ Thanks for flying with [http://s.wordpress.com/i/emails/wp-footericon.png] WordPress.com -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From pjp961 at svol.net Mon Oct 31 19:19:03 2011 From: pjp961 at svol.net (Peter Pesavento) Date: Mon, 31 Oct 2011 19:19:03 -0400 Subject: [FPSPACE] Report: Unmanned Shenzou 8 launches Message-ID: <4eaf2d1b.059dec0a.70df.525e@mx.google.com> Associated Press via Yahoo http://news.yahoo.com/report-china-unmanned-spacecraft-launches-222340913.ht ml back next Report: China unmanned spacecraft launches AP - 45 mins ago BEIJING (AP) - China's unmanned spacecraft Shenzhou 8 blasted off Tuesday morning, the Chinese state media reported. It is the latest step in what will be a decade-long effort by China to place a manned permanent space station in orbit. The state-run Xinhua News Agency said the spacecraft took off from a base in the far western city of Jiuquan. Minutes later, the news agency cited Chang Wanquan, who leads China's space program, announcing the launch a success. China launched its own space station program after being rebuffed in its attempts to join the 16-nation International Space Station, largely on objections from the United States. The U.S. is wary of the Chinese program's military links and the sharing of technology with its chief economic and political competitor. Earlier Chinese news reports did not specify a launch date for Shenzhou 8. Chinese space officials rarely speak to foreign media. The Shenzhou 8 will attempt to dock with an experimental module, carrying out maneuvers to couple with the Tiangong 1 module now in orbit. The 8.5-ton, box car-sized Tiangong 1 launched last month. Following Shenzhou 8, two more missions, at least one of them manned, are to meet up with the module next year for further practice, with astronauts staying for up to one month. Plans call for launching two other experimental modules for more tests before the actual station is launched in three sections between 2020 and 2022. At about 60 tons when completed, the Chinese station will be considerably smaller than the International Space Station, which is expected to continue operating through 2028. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: